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The Band: Live at the Academy of Music 1971

Levon Helm: Ramble at the Ryman

The Band: Three of a Kind

Robbie Robertson: How to Become Clairvoyant

Garth Hudson Presents a Canadian Celebration of The Band

Levon Helm: Electric Dirt

Garth and Maud Hudson: Live at the Wolf

Pulse

Dirt Farmer

Elliot Landy's Woodstock Vision

The Band Guestbook, February 2002

Below are the entries in the Band guestbook from February 2002.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 23:14:42 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

Calvin - He's too busy fighting evil doers. Or maybe he's too busy counting the cash he swindled. I don't have the answers, and I'm not taking a "pro" or "con" position, I'm just saying let's have some facts before the accusations start to fly.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 22:39:21 CET 2002 from du-tele3-039.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.39)

Peter Viney

1) RIP Spike Milligan. A true master of absurd comedy.

2) Bob Crewe: "Music to watch girls by" is good grandma (thanks, Spike) while "Music by which to watch girls" is pedantic nonsense (as Winston Churchill so elegantly said. No prepositions at the end of a sentence is a rule up with which I will not put, or words to the same effect). Bob Crew did 'MTWGB' at the end of the Barberella OST session to use up spare time. Not a bad idea, as it turned out. I still seek the Bob Crewe Generation albums (I have Barberella).


Posted on Thu Feb 28 22:26:54 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Anagram for Enron: "R none"

Reasons why I, speaking for myself, would want to discuss Enron here in the guestbook -- there are none.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 22:19:40 CET 2002 from (64.80.240.29)

Diamond Lil

Al: That was beautiful! Thanks for sharing.

Have a good night everyone.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 22:18:00 CET 2002 from spider-wq063.proxy.aol.com (205.188.200.183)

Calvin

John W, while your quite right about the track record of some of Clinton's associate, youll find the Reagan administration how more people convicted by a fairly large margin, greed is both a Liberal and COnservative problem. I suppose when the vaults are open to you it is difficult not to step in. I don't understand Cheney's problem with revealing what went on at his meeting with Enron. I for one wouldnt see what the crime was if Cheney said Enron had a ton of input in our energy problem, suggesting we put in some ideas that allowed energy companies to make a ton of money so they would expand and put more people to work. I dont always agree with that but isnt that pretty much the Republican theory of economics? SO why is CHeney holding out?


Posted on Thu Feb 28 21:41:46 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

Jeffrey, I don't know what you think this Army guy did, other than working for Enron, but even if he did anything wrong, how does that tarnish Bush or Cheney? You asked why I keep bringing up Clinton. Here's why: When Bubba's close associates and business partners (see Webster Hubbell, Jim & Susan McDougal, former Gov. Jim Guy Tucker) were CONVICTED of crimes, you (liberals) said any attempt to assoiciate the "smell" with Clinton was unfair and nothing but innuendo and smear. So even if this Army guy IS is guilty of something -- which BTW is not the case, he has not even been indicted, has he? -- by the logic used by Clinton's defenders, nobody should be implicating Bush or Cheney without direct evidence. Unless, of course, what's OK for liberals is off limits for conservatives.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 21:38:38 CET 2002 from cache-bas-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.224.1)

Al Edge

From: Liverpool

Reading the beautiful words in Lil's post reminded me of a poem a mate of mine - Dave Kirby - wrote a few days after. I still cannot read it right through without pausing. Hope it's ok to post it.

A DAY IN NEW YORK

It's the break of dawn on a New York morn

As the streetlights fade away

A songbird sings and prunes her wings

As she greets a brand new day.

She feels so proud and sings out loud

To a clear blue Autumn sky

And the brown leaves fall with her morning call

As a gentle breeze floats by.

High above the ground she glances down

To a park bench way below

There’s an old man there who’s befriended her

And each morning feeds her so.

With his crumbs of bread he has kept her fed

Since the early days of spring

And he makes his way to the park each day

Just to hear his songbird sing.

Not too far away through the mists of day

Man's mountains scrape the sky

And nature cowers at these mighty towers

A sight for any eye.

They're the giant gates to the United States

Such a famous skyline view

And they stand so tall like a prison wall

Up against the sky so blue.

There’s a heart that beats on the New York streets

It's a pulse that never fades

But that heart was broke in the flames and smoke

At the Central World of Trades.

It was nearly nine in New York time

When the world would hold its breath

Where the World Trades flow they were not to know

That today they’d trade in death.

When the deadly shame of evil came

From out of the morning skies

And the wrath it brings with its devils wings

And cold murder in its eyes.

They came through the air without a care

In spiralling deathly dives

In their twisted mind they hate all mankind

The most innocent of lives.

In a deafening crash of shattering glass

Two explosions shook the world

On Manhattans streets there was disbelief

As the horror was unfurled.

Some ran so shocked as the buildings rocked

While others stood and gazed

As the firemen crews who’d heard the news

Came rushing to their aid.

These heroic folk clawed through the smoke

But their mission soon was cursed

From the flames of Hell came a deathly smell

As Satan did his worst.

An endless sorrow the scene to follow

On this cursed September day

As the mighty towers in a few short hours

Cried a tear and then gave way.

Such an awful sight when a thing of might

Comes crumbling to its knees

But it's magnified when so many died

Midst the terror, screams and pleas.

So many folk wore death's dark cloak

Neath stone and twisted steel

And the sunlight strays to a blacked out haze

In a scene that's so surreal.

As the sirens wail debris drops like hail

Through an ocean's fallout dust

As Manhattan shakes like those mighty 'quakes

From within the Earth’s deep crust

Two smouldering wrecks are all that's left

Of the towers whose fate was doomed

And a nation died as the whole world cried

For the innocent entombed.

As the evening draws the fire still roars

Bright orange 'cross the sea

There are tearful eyes as a lady cries

The Statue Liberty.

Stood on her Isle for all this while

With her head held tall and proud

From across the bay where the innocent lay

You would swear that head was bowed.

As shadows fall bare hands still maul

To the flashing bright blue light

In their hearts there’s pain for they dig in vain

In their search throughout death's night.

It's the break of dawn on a New York morn

But there’s eerie quiet today

For the birds don't sing or prune a wing

As they greet this brand new day.

Above the ground they make no sound

In Central Park's tall trees

As the morning dew makes patterns through

The dust upon the leaves.

Then a bird flies down towards the ground

To the old man's empty bench

In the smoke filled air which is everywhere

There’s an awful deathly stench.

But the bird never hears the old mans tears

In his home where he quietly weeps

So off she flies as the whole world cries

For the city that never sleeps.

And she’ll never know and thank God so

For she’d never understand

Why Nature's hand is bit by man's

Inhumanity to man.

Dave Kirby, Liverpool.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 21:28:14 CET 2002 from (4.20.68.20)

Rich

From: Rhinebeck, NY

Was it only me, or were the lyrics to Dylan's number last night almost completely unintelligible? I've noticed that before with him, and since he's the greatest lyricist of his time, it's kind of a shame.

Regarding outside projects of his, wasn't there some talk a year or so ago about his hosting a musical variety show, or something similar, on HBO or another cable outlet? Always sounded like a weird, but intriguing idea, and I was wondering if anyone knew whatever became of it.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 19:43:03 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp0531.dialsprint.net (63.187.10.23)

Jeffrey

Bush and Cheney, no knowledge of Enron financial matters? Check this out! compare today's bio of Army Secretary White ... http://www.army.mil/leaders/Secarmy/bio.htm ... to the "Aug 10, 2001" version that you can find here http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.army.mil/leaders/Secarmy/bio.htm


Posted on Thu Feb 28 19:37:17 CET 2002 from spider-tr011.proxy.aol.com (152.163.201.176)

Bob Silkowitz

From: Westchester County, New York
Web page

Greetings. Just discovered this site and chat room today. Yesterday a friend of mine and I were talking about the best concerts we've ever seen, and discussed being at the first show by The Band at the Filmore East in New York when we were much younger. We were amazed at how much we remembered about the concert because it was so incredible. Anyway, I'd love to get a copy of the show on CD or tape if I could. I have a lot to trade, or I can buy it. Please...if there is a copy out there somewhere, please e-mail me at RSilkowitz@aol.com I would even like to get leads on how I might be able to locate a copy of it. Thanks to everyone.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 19:25:13 CET 2002 from 1cust111.tnt48.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.92.111)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Good to see the legendary Bob Crewe mentioned in the GB!! His classic "Music To Watch Girls By" by the Bob Crewe Generation is one of my all time faves although I'm not sure the phrase is grammatically correct. Bob also co-wrote the great song "Can't Take My Eyes Off You" a big hit for Frankie Valli. I have always thought this would have been a great tune for Richard to have covered.

Also, good to see Mahatma Gandhi mentioned here.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 17:21:51 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Last night, after Jon Stewart's first of many seemingly endless inane attempts at humor, the Grammy awards show got down to music. That current group of scantily-clad divas strutted through "Lady Marmalade", a song first made famous back in 1975 by Labelle (Patti Labelle, Nona Hendryx & Sarah Dash). Ms. Labelle herself even made a cameo appearance during the production number.

I was reminded that, back in 1974, when Labelle began planning their next album, which would be called "Nightbirds", producer extraordinaire Allen Toussaint was brought on board the project. It was Mr. Toussaint who suggested that Labelle record "Lady Marmalade", a song which had been written by Bob Crewe & Kenny Nolan and previously recorded by Mr. Nolan's group The Eleventh Hour.

Mr. Toussaint's savy choice of "Lady Marmalade", along with Labelle's electrified performance, created a perfect anthem of sassy funkiness. The song became a hit and helped revive Labelle's career.

Last night while watching, I kept hoping that Ms. Labelle would, at some point, push one of those young girls aside to really let loose and show them how it's really done. Later, Bob Dylan, Ralph Stanley & the "O Brother" crew did exactly that.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 16:32:44 CET 2002 from 0-1pool33-135.nas1.cincinnati1.oh.us.da.qwest.net (63.232.33.135)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

All I have to say after watching Dylan at the Grammys last night is what a hot little band he has, but I am worried about his voice but maybe he is just hoarse from concerts. I hope he has quit smoking.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 16:30:54 CET 2002 from dialin-1766-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.7.242)

Gene

Web page

Check out the Web Page link, above, for the article: Bob Dylan May Take Film Role (AP)


Posted on Thu Feb 28 16:20:16 CET 2002 from (205.245.52.66)

carmen

From: pa

Fox News reported that Dylan is making a motion picture. Anyone out there know what this is about?


Posted on Thu Feb 28 14:40:28 CET 2002 from (205.211.160.1)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto

Someone please help! I am always happy to see Bob Dylan win an award, even though I don't put much stock in these things. However, someone please define for me "Contemporary Folk Album". If a person known to have been a "folk" singer for some part of his career (say Pete Seeger) does an album of Latin music, will his album go into the "Contemporary Folk" category or the "Latin" category. If a classical cello player (say Yo Yo Ma) decides to do an album of ELO covers in a contemporary format and it is highly regarded, will it turn up in -classical- or in -rock-. I hate categorization to begin with, but if there is going to be categorization, would Bob Dylan's album not 'fit' better into say -blues- than -folk-. I think the brain trust should look more critically at what they are doing if they are going to do it. The credibility (such as it is) of such an organization depends upon care being taken in making these categorizations accurately. Many already have trouble with all of this to begin with. To compound the problem like this is unfathomable. Why don't the Recording Industry members correct this?


Posted on Thu Feb 28 14:20:07 CET 2002 from host-65-164-8-8.co.erie.ny.us (65.164.8.8)

G-MAN

Well,,,,after watching 7 minutes of the Grammy's,it was time to change the channel!!! Blizzard or not, I am packing for a trip to NYC to see Jim Wieder and the Honky Tonk Gurus!!!


Posted on Thu Feb 28 13:13:30 CET 2002 from spider-wc083.proxy.aol.com (205.188.193.58)

Lee

Hello to Brother Jan and friends. Checkin' out Bandland. I've just been reading about the Philips DVD Recorder which transfers VHS tapes to DVD, something I'm rather eager to do. Re. Life expectancy of CDs. What about VHS tapes and DVDs?


Posted on Thu Feb 28 12:08:13 CET 2002 from 64-80-53-193-static.surferz.net (64.80.53.193)

Lil Again

Now that was fast! Thank you to my good friend down South who sent me the lyrics to the tune I asked about. I'm posting them here.. since I think they're beautiful..and something we can all relate to.(And btw.. does anyone know how to make paragraphs in something when it's cut and pasted? Thanks.)

Where were you when the world stop turning on that September day Were you in the yard with your wife and children Or working on some stage in L.A. Did you stand there in shock at the sight of that black smoke Rising against that blue sky Did you shout out in anger, in fear for your neighbor Or did you just sit down and cry Did you weep for the children who lost their dear loved ones And pray for the ones who don't know Did you rejoice for the people who walked from the rubble And sob for the ones left below Did you burst out in pride for the red, white and blue And the heroes who died just doin' what they do Did you look up to heaven for some kind of answer And look at yourself and what really matters Chorus: I'm just a singer of simple songs I'm not a real political man I watch CNN but I'm not sure I could Tell you the difference in Iraq and Iran But I know Jesus and I talk to God And I remember this from when I was young Faith, hope and love are some good things He gave us And the greatest is love Verse: Where were you when the world stop turning on that September day Teaching a class full of innocent children Or driving down some cold interstate Did you feel guilty 'cause you're a survivor In a crowded room did you feel alone Did you call up your mother and tell her you loved her Did you dust off that Bible at home Did you open your eyes, hope it never happened And you close your eyes and not go to sleep Did you notice the sunset the first time in ages Or speak to some stranger on the street Did you lay down at night and think of tomorrow Go out and buy you a gun Did you turn off that violent old movie you're watchin' And turn on "I Love Lucy" reruns Did you go to a church and hold hands with some strangers Stand in line and give your own blood Did you just stay home and cling tight to your family Thank God you had somebody to love Repeat Chorus ©2001 EMI Music / Tri-Angels Music (ASCAP)


Posted on Thu Feb 28 11:29:25 CET 2002 from 64-80-53-193-static.surferz.net (64.80.53.193)

Diamond Lil

Any country music fans out there? I watched the Grammy's last night (mostly because I was awake waiting for my 10 year old to come home from night snow tubing)..and was very impressed by a tune country singer Alan Jackson did called "Where were you when the world stopped turning". Can anyone out there send me the lyrics? Thanks. It would be much appreciated.

Have a good day everyone.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 07:45:29 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp68867.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.186.232)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

"Really disliked school, disliked groups, disliked authority.....I WAS MADE FOR ROCK AND ROLL"...

He wanted to learn how to play guitar by playing like Carl Perkins....When he was told that it was only three chords....He said show me....first and last music lesson.....His musical agenda was the written word anyway....Who else could mention the sword of Damocles in a song or could quote Yeats in concert??....Well.....maybe one other...;-D.....He would watch the "Ozzie and Harriett" show to listen to the band at the end of the show....James Burton....Recorded first record at 14!....LEAVE HER FOR ME....JADES....He likes to use the custom-made amps by Michael Soldano who states...."He has the BEST ears in the business. He can hear subtleties in tone that most people never hear. He is BEYOND a perfectionist in terms of sound."...

Cupid, Peter Viney and Richard Patterson....Since I will be looking for his office in Soho this weekend I will remind you now that it's his Birthday on Saturday....LOUUUU.......60.....STILL ROCKIN'.....WRITIN'.....PLAYIN'.....PUSHIN' THE ROCK AND ROLL ENVELOPE....Jeffffffrey! I bet your fave is SWEET JANE......;-D.....or how about Emmylouuuuu Harris and Cheryl Crow singing Lou's PALE BLUE EYES?...:-D...Btw...Agesilaus will be 14 on the same day!!....Their temperaments are sooooo similar....;-D


Posted on Thu Feb 28 07:37:41 CET 2002 from dialup-209.245.239.139.dial1.dallas1.level3.net (209.245.239.139)

csiron

From: dallas tx

Concerns about pervasive disc rot are overblown -- as they have been since the invention of the CD.

I recently ran across a truly "rotted" CD pressed in 1988, and believe it or not, the manufacturer (British) still replaced it, though the title has long been out of print. In fact, the exchange gave me quite a collectible because the disc (a Springsteen single) came from a fully ruined batch and most people just pitched their discs because they didn't know they could turn them in.

Anyway, CD rot almost always comes down to chemical interactions of inks with the disc and seldom has anything to do with moderate moisture or heat or a reasonable amount of anything else. The problem is not inherent to the CD.

In the case of the most famous "rotted" discs (of which admittedly there were many thousands), the problem was made worse by contact with the cardboard sleeves that many of the discs (often singles) were packaged in. It seems the inks interacted with the cardboard, and the deterioration was accelerated. And, by the way, the destruction happened pretty quickly, so if you haven't had problems with your older discs, you're not likely to.

Manufacturers know now what works and what doesn't. I would never swear that no discs made today rot, but I can say I have more than 5,000 CDs that I've accumulated since about 1984, and I've only had that one bad disc, which I bought cheap on eBay a few months ago, fully aware of the problem with the disc.

I have a fairly scientific method of spot-checking for problems. One of my CD players, an NAD, has an error light that comes on when the laser hits a glitch -- yellow means not-so-bad and red means the CD player has to use its error-correction system. When I check my oldest discs, they don't show any more errors than my newest ones.

Also, though I admit to a keen interest in seeing CDs survive, I also think the warnings of their imminent demise are vastly overstated.

No medium lasts forever, but the trend is toward more things on CDs -- movies, software, family photo albums. The CD has proved itself a durable, versatile medium.

If -- or more likely when -- CDs are supplanted by another format, they'll still be like your old records and, yes, your Edison cylinders: They'll still be playable. They'll just sound a whole lot better.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 03:45:42 CET 2002 from 1cust115.tnt2.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (67.227.173.115)

Jeffrey

Ahhhh.....! It warms me bones to see folks discussing important issues,hopefully raising some awareness, and not beating the RR/LH horse! Some enlightening posts to be sure.It's Crabbys fault! If he hadn't heckled me,this might not have happened.Sammy, your anger is justified. But until we realize the "U.S" role in all of this,we're fugged. Nice post Nick! It is unfortunate the amount of energy wasted on trying to find some common ground.If debate doesn't happen, we lose our checks and balances. Hell, I'd rather be blowin on my harp, playin my slide, and listening to Richard Manuel on"River of Tears", than thinking about the rest of this crap.Why can't people just be MELLOW!Eh BEG?


Posted on Thu Feb 28 03:12:31 CET 2002 from cpe-61-9-133-105.vic.bigpond.net.au (61.9.133.105)

Bill

From: Adelaide, still

John W.: You really don't think that Bush would have ratified Kyoto even if it applied the same rules to all countries do you? Canada's concern, I think, is not so much a fear of losing jobs to developing countries, but a fear of losing jobs to a slack US if "we" ratify and "you" don't.

As for Clinton, I saw him speak most eloquently - about the environment, global development and terrorism - just yesterday, from a distance of 10 feet. I was prepared to be unimpressed, but certainly wasn't. Everyone I spoke to thought similarly. (Band connection, if required: Arkansas.)


Posted on Thu Feb 28 02:10:16 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-th042.proxy.aol.com (64.12.102.37)

Rock

From: N.Y.

"

" Mud or Blood ? It's " mud below my feet" not " blood below my feet " Though one might be more inclined to swear by their blood then by mud. Listen to the LP not the CD turn down the volume level the equalizer and pan left to right speaker if you have to but it's mud not blood. You can go ask Virgil if you want. Mr. V. its "flames have turned to char" but we can talk about it now.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 01:33:52 CET 2002 from akcf2.xtra.co.nz (203.96.111.200)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

While we're busy analysing various songs and their arrangements, it's worth noting one of Robbie's comments on the Classic Albums video. He said that alot of things were played a particular way because thats all they were capable of doiing at the time. Maybe he was just being modest (on behalf of the others) .

I wonder who came up with the "and" bit on The Weight.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 01:17:26 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tg024.proxy.aol.com (64.12.102.159)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Jeff/Rollie = I'll go to Disneyland, no problem. Of course, there might be a bomb on the roller coaster if we don't stop these killers.........I haven't altered anything I do. Of course, when you tried to drive into NYC for several months after the attack, there were any -or all of the following at all the river crossings = cops, state troopers, military soldiers. It's hard to be completely normal with that atmosphere around. I'm going into the city tomorrow. I'm luckey because I'll be using the only East River bridge that you're allowed to cross with one person in the car between 6 and 10 am. So, yeah - I don't travel in and around NYC in fear - but tomorrow when I'm in the middle of the bridge, and I see a plane approaching LaGuardia airport, I can't help but imagine what it would be like if it diverted into the bridge - just to kill some more of us rotten Americans. I don't expect that to happen because enough people wouldn't die from a bridge. It's the Empire State Building that I worry about.

Also, I'm sure the President would like us to try to relax a little and be normal. But, I bet there's a couple of F-16's buzzing around Washington when he goes to bed at night. Actually, they're probably there 24-7.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 00:55:09 CET 2002 from hvc-24-164-174-169.hvc.rr.com (24.164.174.169)

Dennis...'n Wanda

From: NOT Maggie's Farm....but close to it!
Web page

Wrotten day at work today.....just like workin' for Maggie and I've 'bout had enough of that old farm work! Good luck tonight Mr. D....

Hey boys 'n girls, finally a Woodstock show: Joyous Lake, Saturday, March 16th...Gurus!

Gettin' back to the farm and encore stories, hope this one fits: 'twas the last night of Woodstock '94 here in Saugerties. I needed more shirts to sell at my booth, so had to run into Kingston, NY to pick some up from the factory. The entire area was surrounded by cops not letting anyone drive in the area, so had to bribe some police with t-shirts to let me back in later. Got to a NY State police roadblock and gave 'em each a Woodstock shirt so I could drive back into the music zone. One of 'em says to me, "Is that Bob Dylan on stage? I'd love to see him."

I said, "Yea, he's on stage now, but you'd better hurry, it's encore time." The cop begs me for another shirt, takes off his police shirt, throws on a Grateful Dead gem, and off he goes to Mr. D's encore!

Wonder who that man in gray will be rootin' for tonight.

And hope to see you 'n yours on the 16th.... Dennis 'n Wanda


Posted on Thu Feb 28 00:42:05 CET 2002 from 64-80-53-5-access.surferz.net (64.80.53.5)

Diamond Lil

Ok Jan..I have a question. Was just looking at the page for that Ellen Nikolaysen album (loved your wonderful review %-) and am curious as to how something called "Et Menneske jeg fant" (A person I found) translates from "The night they drove old Dixie down"? I understand this a terrible record, but now you have me intrigued. Can you give us a sound sample? Thanks..and um... hug :-)

Have a good night everyone.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 00:15:47 CET 2002 from m0187.dialin.swt.edu (147.26.248.197)

pehr

Peter Viney: Some thoughts on rocking chair... notes... The Instrumentation:

Song starts on a Minor chord. the dropped 3rd of the first chord has a tinge of that mournful, sad, reflective sound. There is a complex interplay of the stringed instruments, a mandolin and guitar- earthy folk instruments seem to in different places but coming together while the synthesizer has an etherial airbourne quality, sounds like woodwinds to me. The voicings of the chords and runs being played work to sort themselves out a bit before resolving, coming together on the I chord with a thud as the song begins. The bottom is heavy and wooden, and to me the bass sounds in fact more like a tuba, similar to the bottom end on "Rag Mama Rag".

The voicings of both the instuments being played and the vocal harmonies seem to become more abstract as the song goes on; particularly Garth's work on the synth/organ, whatever it actually is I lose track ofas the motifs weave an ever more complex tapesty of single threads-movements- these windlike swirling sounds echo and reciprocate unpredictably... the gesture of which reminds me of the wind blowing at night through the trees.

Thinking of the "Canon" style of solfege singing, and of the "Round" in the folk style of staggered repeated motifs being sung by different voices... "Micheal Row Your Boat Ashore" kind of thing. Reflections...upon reflections (appropos the water imagery) reflecting upon the act of reflection itself.

The song is very painterly in its instrumentation and its lyric content. Just the sound though seems to bring this to mind with all the coming and going. The sound creates chains of vanishing images and illusions/allusions as it goes on. I'm thinking of water's elusive quality, how it avoids the grasping by the hands yet assumes the form of the vessel that contains it. Very Chinese at the moment but this water imagery painted through the sound is alot like the transitory nature of deep thought and meditation, which this song most certainly alludes to.

As I listen to this tonight along the "Painterly" concerns I am feeling alot of things coming to mind... I see a painting of an empty rocking chair sitting on a porch waiting for this seaman to come home...it seems to have his number in my mind, an inescapable inevitability to it, the calm patient assurance that the "Captain" will wind up "here".

Thew rocking chair itself a metaphor for the rocking of the boat, no longer on the waves but on the porch now. the letting go the difficulty of making the transition to old age and increasing dependence on others. I'm thinking of the elderly in my own neighborhood rockin' on the front porch. looking at the old deeply rooted trees leaves blowing in the wind, the swaying of the branches, clouds go across sky- the mysterious invisible winds that blowe them and the sun and moon's daily journey and the mysterious forces that propel them. an elder contemplate these comings and goings while waving to neighbors and passing travellers. Layers of reflection as one contemplates the essence and meanings of their own journey through life.

Another image comes to mind as I write this...the Nocturne, meditations of the sea at night.

American Painting of this era much of the band's work hearkens to, Post Colonial to Great Depression explores this theme, much more to my own knowledge than what the French and European Painters did at this time... James Mcneil Whistler was painting seascapes in London at this time but was of course an american... There was JMW Turner over there as well dong marines but not so many nocturnal scenes, and his imagery was most often military/naval subjects.,, Back to the americans I'm thinking of Washington Allston, Asher B. Durand, Martin Heade, ("Watson and the Shark"- the image of the young man in the prime of his life with the long flowing mane of blonde hair, royally dressed, flailing about in the sea as a shark bites off his leg and his astonished companions watch helplessy.comes to mind) Another image in my head is the Winslow Homer painting of the shipwrecked black slave clinging to a raft being stalked by a menacing row of shark fins and whitecaps another.

Albert Pinkham Ryder comes to mind next- small, cryptic, encrusted, cracked moonlit marinescapes with solitary sailboats on the waves- considered by many to be the firs modern, abstract paintings to be done in America. He was known as an eccentric that spent many nights walking up and down the Hudson River studying the effects of night color on water and his paintings were worked and re worked over 30 years with layers of varnish and materials of the nature of whatever was procurable, particularly black tar which caused these paintings to crack and makes them very sensitive to light and priceless today, very seldom on public display.

Ryder's most famous painting is in fact "The Flying Dutchman", his homage to the Wagner Opera of that name, allude to in the "Rocking Chair" composition that is bringing all this imagery to mind.

Ryder's work was particularly inspiring to the next generations of painters that explored this motif, all of them from New York area interestingly so far except Whistler. (New Jersey) The suceeding painters persued the maritime imagery with a particular intrest in the visionary path and the unconscious, also from New York/Hudson River area, Louis Eilshimuis, Milton Avery, John Marin, Adolph Gottlieb, Mark Rothko, Elmer Bischoff and Jackson Pollock.

Pollock's take on this theme is rather intriguing. In the case of his development as a painter, Pollock's gloomy solitary sailboats at night came after his studies of the west under Thomas Hart Benton as a student, and his studies of "psychoanalytic" abstractions done under to supervision of his analyst whom he sought counselling for his alcoholism. In Pollocks case his therapy under the auspices of a Jungian opened Pollock up to the influences of the unconscious, foretold by the enigmatic sailboats on the void, which led him to explore the work of the surrealists, Miro, Picasso, and Native American Ideas and motifs.

I'm dfoing this kind of stream of consciousness myself at the moment... particularly interested still in the commonality shared by these artists and Robertson being the image of the sailboat at sea, the forces of the unknown, and the Hudson River. I wonder indeed how aware Robertson was or is perhaps of all of these images. They can enter ones thinking consciously or unconsciously of course... I think I might check Google to see if any of these images are on the web but, I'll have to later.

Gotta say the line about dippin snuff and tellin jokes sure seems to come right off the Kitchen table discussions at Big Pink- Maybe Levon's missing home, or Rick... Makes me want to write a song about a fly on the wall...I could pour over this guestbook and find some of that material somewhere in the archives.

Rick's Bass sounds like a rocking chair alright. at least as much as a tuba.

I gotta run. this Rockin Chair tread really got me goin'. Thanks Peter and of course Jan and all the posters into this. Hope I didn't bore ya too badly but If you come this far, god bless ya. You must really love the Band. Best, P


Posted on Thu Feb 28 00:13:56 CET 2002 from 43.newark-08rh15rt.nj.dial-access.att.net (12.89.174.43)

Nick

From: U.S.A.

Debating politics is like running in circles – by the time your legs give out, you realize you haven’t gone anywhere. There are so many variables that go into “what goes on” between governments and big business and governments and special interest groups that we rarely know enough about any given topic to form an “informed” opinion.

I don’t know much about politics, nor do I seek to know. I am however interested in issues – especially those that directly effect the safety of people and the health of the world, therefore; I condemn terrorism. I recycle. I don’t use aerosol sprays. I am extremely concerned about air pollution and water contamination. I am always aware of the earth-legacy we may leave for future generations. I am also aware that "global warming" is a theory discredited by a majority of the world's climatologists. I’m not saying it is not a real threat, but I agree there are two sides to every story…

Enron relentlessly pushed (and paid many hundreds of thousands to) the Clinton administration to help nudge the senate into ratifying the Kyoto Treaty because -- although experts say “it would have cost the U.S. billions and had a deadly effect on the economy” – it would have been a bonanza for Enron and the value of Enron stock.

The Kyoto Treaty, on the surface anyway, looks good for obvious environmental reasons, but like John W says, it would leave less developed nations like communist China for instance, with fewer “greenhouse gas” restrictions than the U.S. and other developed countries. Beyond that I don’t have a clue as to GW’s motives or alternate reasonings. Enron related? I don’t know. But I have heard that since Enron started in 1985 they have been a real live group of hustlers and swingers -- in bed enough with both Republicans and Democrats to cause Larry Flint to turn a rosey pink.

Remember Ron Brown, Clinton's Secretary of Commerce and how he died in that mysterious plane crash in Croatia? If Secretary Brown had lived, wouldn’t he have faced criminal indictments for Enron-dirty-dealings? An investigation back then would have turned up the information that is turning up now -- about the strong-arming of nations (dependant on congressional aid) to secure grossly over priced global energy contracts for – you guessed it --- Enron. The Ken Starr investigation would have never been necessary because Monica would never have been on her knees in the oval office in the first place – “that” Enron scandal back then may have precipitated an even earlier fall for Bill Clinton and his erotic humidor.

I wish we could all (myself included) follow the advice of Mahatma Gandhi. He said, "You must be the change you wish to see in the world". So… I don’t know… can we talk baseball next time? Oh, I forgot – we come here to talk about The Band. Rock on beautiful people.


Posted on Thu Feb 28 00:01:31 CET 2002 from pool-141-153-198-208.mad.east.verizon.net (141.153.198.208)

Bumbles

From: Where It's At

As I have heard it, the form of “CD rot” that plagued the original Scorpio “GBTs” is a manufacturing defect caused when a small amount of moisture is trapped on the surface of the disc by the application of a final plastic coating. Although I’ve never encountered it first-hand (my “GBTs” are knock-offs), the condition is apparently most likely to occur on bootlegs produced in small, mainly Asian facilities without the quality-control practices found in the larger industrial plants that manufacture the great majority of discs available in North America and Europe. So while I imagine it’s no fun to have a $150 set of discs rot away into unplayability, rot isn’t an inherent limitation of the CD medium. And based on the example of the “GBTs,” if it’s going to happen, it will be within a year or two. After that, the most illicit of discs should be safe---from rot at least. As far as (non-rotted) CD life span, the 20-30 years someone mentioned in the GB is the lowest I’ve seen. Most estimates are several times that (i.e., they’ll outlast you), although, of course, no one knows.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 23:35:11 CET 2002 from du-tele3-105.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.105)

Peter Viney

Markku - thank you for sending us to a great Band story.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 23:15:31 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Thank you John W. I know this is one of Canada's concerns as well......that jobs will be lost and moved to other countries.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 22:59:11 CET 2002 from stx32.library.uiuc.edu (130.126.32.133)

Susan

Apparently there are no library preservation standards for CD production, and no intentions to draw up some. The general feeling seems to be that the format will change so quickly that standards won't keep up. There is a general feeling in the library preservation world that technology will change completely every 10 years, rendering various formats obsolete. The preservation mantra for digital preservation is Reformat Often. This means they expect cds to be replaced by some other format. We may be seeing the beginning stages as cds that are unplayable on computers and dvd players begin to appear.

As far as preserving an individual collection goes the best you can do is protect cds from light, dust, and temperature and humidity swings. This last is easier said than done.

A wide dispursal of copies is another preservation measure; the more copies around the better chance that some will survive to be reformatted to a new medium. So sharing bootlegs is good, and documating sources is important.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 22:41:29 CET 2002 from c-d4c671d5.02-2-67626719.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se (213.113.198.212)

Markku (Quos)

Web page

Don't know if this has been posted already, but Dave Edmunds has a small "anecdote page" about The Band on his site, where he remembers his meeting with the boys. Click on the link above, or go to http://www.daveedmunds.com/band.htm


Posted on Wed Feb 27 22:04:44 CET 2002 from du-tele3-104.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.104)

Peter Viney

Funny. Have started compiling the Rockin Chair comments. I thought my ONE original addition was to be the KLM logo- but you guys got there first. One point I'd make about G.W. Bush - British comedians seem to have an endless fund of filthy jokes based on his surname - how come this never happens in the USA? Is it that we're so shallow that we pick on these minor details?


Posted on Wed Feb 27 20:55:23 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

John D. - Bush opposes the Kyoto Treaty because it places restrictions on the release of greenhouse gasses only on the developed countries, but not the 130 "developing" nations. They claim this will only cause businesses to relocate to developing countries like Mexico and China, and in the long run the total of the gasses emitted might end up increased, anyway. Why not place these environmental restrictions on ALL countries, such a policy might even help these developing nations modernize at a faster pace.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 20:27:37 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Maybe NICK knows the answer to this one. Does anyone know why President Bush is reneging on President Clinton's stand on the Kyoto Agreement We won't have to worry about terrorist attacks in the future when we all fry from our own greed. As long as I live I will never understand why Canada, the U.S. and other countries aren't concerned about the future of the planet instead of immediate big business


Posted on Wed Feb 27 20:08:13 CET 2002 from dialup-65.57.9.142.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.57.9.142)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

John W, I think you'll find that Ron Reagan started this demonizing of the opposition, which is what happens when religion and politics collide.

As far as Enron and the Texas Republican Party, a little nosing around provides enough interesting material linking the two to bathe both in the sickening smell of a real scandal, something hard to distiguish after so many years of straw dogs. And anyone who wants to paint such sentiments with broad strokes ought to go back to the pre-election GB.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 20:03:22 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

It saddens me when I think of the re-release of TLW; in that the other four original members and their heirs receive absolutely nothing from it. It just doesn't seem right that five people made the music and one gets to reap the rewards. As someone stated a few weeks ago, It will be interesting to see if Garth gets a song writing credit this time around for "Chest Fever."


Posted on Wed Feb 27 20:02:33 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Jan's guestbook is a testament to the power of BAND music. So many people of differing backgrounds, nationalities and political beliefs sharing common ground in their appreciation of such fine music. It's a shame that, for so many others in the world, they can't put aside their differences and listen.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 19:44:05 CET 2002 from (206.203.20.32)

Herb

Press Release: "Eleven Years" James Damiano vs. Bob Dylan for Copyright Infringement, now on CD Rom. Coming soon on DVD.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:49:33 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

Jeffrey - No, I'm not related to Fritz, although I did spend a lot of time hiking (not climbing) in the Shawangunk Mountains when I went to school at New Paltz. (Brings back memories of Levon at the Joyous Lake, and the first Band-related show I ever saw: the Danko/Manuel band, outdoors on the campus, Spring Weekend '79!

Anyway, I hope my posts were clear. I am no right wing extremist, but all I am saying is there are two sides to every issue. I get the feeling that to many liberals, it's not a matter of "my opinion versus their opinion" but it's "my opinion, which is the enlightened truth, versus their opinion, which is either evil or stupid."


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:44:46 CET 2002 from schltns-3.demon.nl (212.238.196.9)

Ragtime

Dear meadowlark2

Yeah, it's symbolic, didn't you know? I looked into the sky, saw a blue KLM bird flying high, figured Ilkka and Meadowlark2 heading from Sweden to the Provence, and thought: that big rockin' chair don't go nowhere... just like le vaisseau fantôme ;-)

Anyway, when KLM officials chose this legend as a symbol, they must have known that the Dutchman's curse is lifted at last...

But: in the Band song the Dutchman's on the reef...


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:37:28 CET 2002 from user-38ldlfi.dialup.mindspring.com (209.86.213.242)

J Quest

From: San Clemente

Here! Here! Jeffrey. It seems a person cannot critisize GWB without Clinton getting tossed in. One must start the debate by stating Clinton sucked in many areas, then start. A big difference between Whitewater, et al and ENRON is the amount. ENRON left the Clinton stuff far, far behind by hundreds of millions. What about that cat Skilling (ironic name, eh)? So inconcievably incompetant, or just another oily crook? I think GWB would be in trouble without the war; it keeps all us patriots distracted .


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:28:08 CET 2002 from syr-24-169-66-92.twcny.rr.com (24.169.66.92)

Bashful Bill

From: Minoa,N.Y.

Whoa! I was just going to post on here asking Gene, Dennis, et al what is going on at Joyous Lake, and I see a Guru's show announced. Just in time for St Patrick's Day, too.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:11:16 CET 2002 from 1cust135.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.135)

Jeffrey

Hey John- Why do yo keep bringing up Clinton in all of this. It seems like anytime Enron is discussed, or a negative Bush stance, it's always deflected with some reference to Clinton! Huh?I was never a big fan of his either! As for Enron, do your homework. Such close ties and no knowledge. Hard to swallow. But you're right.Hard evidence is more palatable. We may never find out the truth in this.By the way , you're not related to the famous climber , Fritz Weissner, are you?


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:08:30 CET 2002 from du121-4.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.4.121)

meadowlark2

From: Sweden

To Ragtime. The frequent flyer programme of the national Dutch airline company is called the Flying Dutchman club. Is this symbolic; does it mean that we will never arrive in our destination, but are doomed to spend the rest of our lives on board ;-)


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:06:30 CET 2002 from dialin-1718-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.7.194)

Gene

From: Dutchess County, NY
Web page

Saturday 16 March 2002 @ 10PM - Jim Weider and The Honky Tonk Gurus at Joyous Lake in Woodstock, NY


Posted on Wed Feb 27 18:03:09 CET 2002 from host-65.subnet-76.med.umich.edu (141.214.76.65)

Steve Knowlton

From: Ypsilanti
Web page

Alan Edge: This goes waaay back to your post about "Dixie" (just catching up here), but many thoughtful historians believe that it is one of the great miracles of history that after the Civil War ended, it ended. By which I mean, there weren't guerillas hiding in the hills to take out Federal troops sniper-style, plant bombs on the railways, etc. In far too many places around the world hatred like that has lingered for literally centuries: just across the sea from Liverpool, in fact. I think the line "you can't raise a Cain back up when he's in defeat" applies to this situation. Following the lead of General Lee, the southern soldiers laid down their weapons and accepted defeat. Had Lee (and Grant, for that matter) chosen anything other than the reintegration of the Confederate troops into civilian life, our nation may have been another Sri Lanka. But all the "South is gonna rise again" rhetoric has never meant, as far as I can tell, that armed rebellion will occur - instead, that southern culture would resume its place of pride in the eyes of the world. Virgil Kane lost the war, and he never expected any actions that would win back his brother, or his pride.

As Orson Scott Card points out at his essay posted above, we owe another debt of gratitude to Martin Luther King for channeling the energies that could have made for another IRA into the SCLC. Truly, our nation has escaped some horrors.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 17:30:48 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

Jeffrey, what evidence can you offer that shows Bush and Cheney "helped swindle" any money? When the Clintons were involved in scandal after scandal, their defenders always insisted the accusers show evidence, otherwise their heroes were the victims of innuendo and vast conspiracies. Why is the standard different now that the Republicans are in power? Just because Republicans are pro-business, does not make them any more responsible for wrongdoings like Enron, any more than a socially progressive liberal policy can be blamed for bribe-taking down at the local Department of Motor Vehicles.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 16:24:10 CET 2002 from 24-196-236-100.charter-georgia.com (24.196.236.100)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga
Web page

Streaming WFUV right now, and Jules Schere is on, singing "Too Soon Gone", nice. Such a great Radio station, and such a great song, and such a tragic thougth, I am sure we all can think of many who are "Too Soon Gone"


Posted on Wed Feb 27 16:11:17 CET 2002 from stx32.library.uiuc.edu (130.126.32.133)

Susan

From: one of the great unstable climates of the world

I work in library preservation, but most of my work is with paper. I checked the references in my office; there's almost nothing on CDs. I'll ask the professional when I see her to see if she's got more information.

Basicly, no medium is really permanent. There are trade-offs for every format. As a general rule, avoiding high humidity is a good thing for every storage medium, and avoiding fluctuations in humidity is even more important. Low normal temperature is generally a good idea; 55-60F. This is not the level of human comfort, and not the temperature of my house or my library, but it's the ideal.



Posted on Wed Feb 27 14:11:38 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-001ilurbap061.dialsprint.net (158.252.113.45)

Susan

From: landlocked Illinois

Ok, Ragtime, I'm being far too literatl about a ghost ship. I still like the notion of the song being full of ambiguous metaphors. Now I must go to work where I will spend far too much time thinking about Rockin' Chair, and making up reasons to go into the stacks so I can put headphones on and listen to it.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 13:30:06 CET 2002 from pd9e67524.dip.t-dialin.net (217.230.117.36)

ulbiman

From: germany

O.K. we all love the Band and all the stories about them. Robbie indeed is a good busyness man, but he´s not the one who destroid the group! They all had there fun, money , success and so on and they all decided to do what they want and live there "after Band" live the way they want it. Maybe there were only musicians, friends and first of all human beings with all their mistakes. But they are no saints ! We all have to live our own lifes!But they gave us lot´s of good feelings and the chance to talk to the peoplle of the world in this guestbook. And that is not so bad.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 11:24:06 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Bayou..... From a rookie Band fan who first saw the Last Waltz three months ago, my impressions were and the numerous times Ive watched since reinforces this is that Robbie as it appeared to me was tired of keeping this togather and I mean this from a creative standpoint that he was burned out, Ive read Peters note about orginators and contributers, well to say it as nicely as can be said there was really only one orginator since Pink for the most part with the rest of guys in the band as contributers, he was running on empty, I think at the time he loved these guys and still does, he just knew it was time... On this site Robbie is quoted as saying that Richard just faded away as a song writter after Pink and that no matter how much he tried to get Richard interested in writting again he couldn't get him to write. Robbie's conclusion is that some song writter's only have a few songs in them.... well maybe Robbie was also describing himself.. Just a thought


Posted on Wed Feb 27 10:30:50 CET 2002 from schltns-3.demon.nl (212.238.196.9)

Ragtime

Rockin' Chair:

The legend says that the Flying Dutchman is doomed to sail into eternity, right? So... if he is "on he reef" he must be stuck, can't sail forward or backwards. He's not on sea, he's not on the ground, he's just stuck... what a great metaphore for human life this is...

:-)

That big rockin' chair won't go nowhere...


Posted on Wed Feb 27 10:26:14 CET 2002 from du-tele3-130.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.130)

Peter Viney

Clarification: The tiny green holes are in the metal layer sandwiched in plastic, so the surface of plastic maintains its integrity both sides. You can't get through to them. You can't clean them. Because there is a metallic bit of meat in the sandwich, heat wouldn't do them any good, but disc rot isn't caused by hot rooms or sunlight.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 10:20:03 CET 2002 from du-tele3-130.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.130)

Peter Viney

Disc rot on CDs has been well-documented in European Hi-Fi magazines. Cleaning and polishing will do zero for a rotted disc, but it will help a greasy or dirty discs. I use Photo CDs all day and keep cleaner on the desk because after a few hours of disc swopping, they suddenly jam the computer and refuse to read. A quick clean and polish does the trick. Disc rot is quite different. It appears as tiny green circles and I’m afraid it is permanent holes in the surface which cannot be “bridged” by error correction. There was even a list of likely record labels, because in the early days there were so few pressing plants – just two at the initial launch! The very first CDs were pressed by Philips or Sony. Period. I believe these are all OK. A number of 1980s CDs have rotted, with several being noted in articles. The CD industry even admits it now, though puts it down to sub-standard materials or contamination in manufacturing plants allowing chemicals to be sealed into the layer between the plastic surface and the aluminum. When I was shopping for CDRs last week I noticed that several brands have “extra durable outer layers” to “prolong the life” of this eternal indestructible product.’ One conclusion was that certain colours of ink ate through the layers – which is why I saw very recently that some CDR collectors ask for no writing on the disc. The Genuine Basement Tapes have simple black printing on silver, but I believe most of the first run of Volume 2 have rotted. At a record fair, a guy told me he was doing quite a brisk trade in replacement GBT discs. CDRs are more susceptible to rot than CDS.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 08:01:48 CET 2002 from 1cust230.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.230)

jeffrey

Sammy, I think the answer to all this stuff is to heed GWs advice and just go shopping. Or maybe visit Disneyland.(he actually said that!) He and Uncle Dick have it under control. No doubt, with the money they helped swindle at Enron, this should enable them to pull a few more strings around the globe.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 07:52:12 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ti011.proxy.aol.com (64.12.101.151)

Rudolf E. Hoogenboom

From: Queens, NY
Web page

Just want to let you know, once again, that this website is an excellent source for anyone who loves the Band as much as I do. I missed seeing Robbie Robertson on the Olympic Opening Ceremony, and I was wondering if I could somehow get that on video. Also, recently, my brother says a TV commercial was aired in Japan; in the background, he says, was music that sounded like Robbie and the Red Road Ensamble singing a Peter Frampton song. Does anyone know if that is correct?


Posted on Wed Feb 27 07:08:43 CET 2002 from syr-24-169-66-92.twcny.rr.com (24.169.66.92)

Bashful Bill

From: Minoa,N.Y.

Too bad Richard didn't guest more on other people's albums with that beautiful voice. I've always loved River Of Tears on Bonnie Raitt's Green Light.I recall reading in Rolling Stone or somewhere that she sang that song and dedicated it to Richard at a show the night after he died. Real pleasant experience in the chatroom tonite, one of my infrequent visits there.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 06:51:27 CET 2002 from plumone.ne.mediaone.net (24.218.46.102)

doc

From: western mass

John D = I talked to my buddy again, the sound engineer, he told me that perhaps your storing your CDs near heat. Even a moderate heat over time may damage the disk and may have caused the discoloration that you mentioned. According to him, heat can damage the inside and outside of CDs. Your problem however seems to be just on the surface of the disk. Any scratches or cloudyness on CDs can be polished and the CD restored because the part of the disk that carries the data (music) is encased in the plastic exterior and may not be damaged. He also informed me that despite the article he had read that he saw no reason for CDs to have such a short life expectancy considering that they are made of plastic. Hope I've been helpful. Peace in the valley!


Posted on Wed Feb 27 06:07:43 CET 2002 from plumone.ne.mediaone.net (24.218.46.102)

doc

From: western mass

Charlie Young=Thanx for your response on my MOJO bit. I got so excited about finally discovering an excellent magazine that I wanted to tell everyone. Apparently, not enough people know about it yet and, well, I like to share a good thing. Funny thing it was that Peter Viney should have contributed an article(s) to MOJO because, in case you didn't notice, I thanked him for having responded to my last entry in the same entry that you responded to. I guess I learn best through trial and error or crash and burn. Though I'm still reading through my first issue, #99, I'm highly anticipating that MOJO will devote a lot of its coverage in the coming months to The Band owing to the release of the box set (April) and the special ed. DVD (May) of the Last Waltz. Maybe Peter knows.....? Anyway, as someone wrote earlier in the GB, "It's a good time to be a fan of The Band!"

Concerning the whole bit on the life of CDs, I asked my trustworthy buddy who is a really good sound engineer on the matter and he said that according to an article that he had read a number of years ago the life expectancy of CDs was thought to be anywhere between 20 to 30 years! In my opinion, that sucks! But that was also a number of years ago and who knows if things have changed...... Take care.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 05:58:17 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tc053.proxy.aol.com (64.12.105.173)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Shit! - I'm glad you straightened out who made the "limitations' comment Peter. I thought you meant that it was RR. It's a funny thing, but I still wonder if RR had those feelings that I suggested. He just might have felt limited. Another funny thing is that I got two e-mails from folks - one kind of agreed with me, and another thought I was dumping on RR (which I wasn't).

Different suject = It seems incredible - but it almost seems that people have sort of "gotten used to" what happened on Sept. 11th. There has been talk of some radio talk shows that people who are not right here have maybe not felt the impact of the incident quite the same. I've evn heard a couple of people that have the attitude that we should "get over it" already. Bullshit! Now - please - don't anybody who isn't near NYC take that as an insult. I'm not suggesting that you all can't feel the impact of Sept. 11th. I'm just saying that there are some of those people out there. I wish to God that everyone in the gosh-almighty country could have taken a stroll around ground zero like I did about a month later. You had to look at the hideous collossal fucking destruction that those inhuman bastards did. Anywhere else in the world, those killers being held in Cuba would have had their heads blown off already. I crossed the bridge again on Monday from Queens to the Bronx, and I looked over at the skyline. They really are gone. I still can't get over the change in that view. Do they report all around the world that they still pull bodies out of the rubble even now.

Sould we just relax now and get back to "normal". Gee, maybe we scared the bad guys and they won't try a silly thing like that again. Bullshit! The thought of these fanatics that hate us and are willing to die to prove it, getting any serious nuclear bombs scares the ever living shit out of me. We need to stop that from happening.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 05:27:27 CET 2002 from spider-tl051.proxy.aol.com (152.163.207.196)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA

Off the beaten track......

Did anyone here happen to catch Clint Black on a recent airing of "Austin City Limits" ? I was sitting and listening without much interest when Mr. Black moved to the drum kit and played an amazing cover of Steely Dan's "Josie". The guy's got chops !!


Posted on Wed Feb 27 05:17:00 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tj051.proxy.aol.com (64.12.106.41)

Brien Sz

From: nj

Just watched a very solid documentary/show on The Learning Channel called The World Trade Center: Anatomy of a Collapse. Fascinating stuff. It was the first time i've witnessed the grueling footage of the attack since the end of September. Basically the show recounts the innovative design and construction of the WTC and why that innovative design was its eventual downfall. A really good hour of television if anyone gets the chance to see it.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 04:09:46 CET 2002 from parachute2-156-40-65-25.net.nih.gov (156.40.65.25)

Jonathan Katz

From: Columbia, MD

Peter - Robbie did a guest appearance with the RTR at Madison Square Garden [Dec 8, 1975]. As far as I know, he played only on "It Takes A Lot To Laugh..." Several boots exist, one is titled "Knight of the Hurricane." Rick guested on RTR1 in Hartford, Connecticut in '75, and with RTR2 in Texas? [which seems strange but can't recall]. My tape of Hartford is missing the Rick songs, but I think that I have a line on a boot with his songs. Tapes of his appearance with RTR2 exist, as well, but I have not heard one of good quality.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 03:35:45 CET 2002 from 158.newark-33-34rs.nj.dial-access.att.net (12.89.141.158)

Nick

From: USA

I have enjoyed reading the guestbook many times. I don’t think I’ve ever posted, but my buttons got pushed today so in the spirit of voicing my opinion, here goes… "

" Yes. Music is politics. It is religion, it is philosophy, and all of it is life -- and all of that, is why we gravitated here in the first place -- The Band and that wonderful music. "

" Now… I am not saying that political or religious views shouldn’t be shared. Freedom of speech should apply to this forum, too… to the extent of vulgarity. And to that end may I respectfully request, that annoying, uninformed dribble also find no place here. "

" First button: No body DIDN’T support the president’s call to war -- especially congress. He received overwhelming support from all. Democrats and Republicans! Hawks and doves! Preachers and sinners! Cops and robbers! Band fans and Brittany fans! All! Unanimously! "

" We need not look farther than the bottom line: Our country was attacked – thousands of people where slaughtered! If someone causes you death, destruction, pain and suffering AND vows to do it again and again – should you not resort to serious steps and measures to make sure that “evil” aggression is not forced on you again? "

" Another button: I find it hard to believe that some people think Bush’s war on terror is “wagging the dog” to lock an election or keep folks from making fun of him again? Is that type thinking… one-dimensional or overly cynical? "

" Yet another button: war no longer has to be “declared war” to be war. Congress changed that some years ago. "

" There… "

" Soapbox? "

" I guess so – I’m on mine right now. And that’s what makes this “GB” a beautiful place. But politics and religion, folks? "

" Wouldn’t you rather go to a rally or a church? "

" Now back to music. That Bottom Line Show sounds like it was a magical evening. I wish I could have attended. Chest Fever is running through my head as I write this. And Kudos to the prof’ for his music and his business savvy. But, his association with The Band is production credits on the last three albums. I dig Aaron Hurwitz, but if anybody is carrying the “Ollie” torch, it’s Jim Weider. Fresh, rocking new-music and fresh, rocking remakes of some of The Bands’ classics. Check him out! His new CD will feature a remake of “The Weight” with a guest appearance by Mavis Staples. People may forget, Jim hit the road with Levon, Garth, Rick and Richard in ’83 and stayed for 17 years. And I haven’t seen anyone mention Randy Ciarlante on this page in quite a long time, either. Well, I’m happy to say they’re both still out there -- going strong and making great new music together. Weider carries that torch for me. I’m going to Tribeca Blues Friday night to see Jim Weider and the Honky Tonk Gurus. That’s brisk, baby! "

" Thanks all for letting me rant on. This is a pretty lively guestbook. Long live The Band, their wonderful music -- and the wonderment of the life that “that music” helped us all to realize.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 03:35:56 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-001ilurbap008.dialsprint.net (158.252.113.16)

Susan

Well, who'd have thought Rockin' Chair was so loaded with ambiguity? The more I look the more slippery the song seems, and that's just the lyrics.

Ragtime Willie has given me another way to look at some key lines. He sees the Flying Dutchman on the reef as the doomed sailor coming home, if I read him right. Now I take 'on the reef' as a wreck. I'm not a sailor, and have never been within 500 miles of an ocean, but reading tells me that when ships hit reefs it's not a good thing. The suggestion that the speaker is not satisfied to be home again is attractive, and is one possible reading, but I'm not convinced that the speaker ever gets back to land, to home.

There's another line that can have multiple meanings, and they all resonate. "This hill's too steep to climb" can be a metaphorical hill or a real one, and it carries a suggestion of the physical failings of age as well.



Posted on Wed Feb 27 02:59:09 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-249.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.249)

Amanda

FYI: If you are into the Johnny Cash Birthday Celebration...CMT is airing A Concert: Behind the Prison Walls (1976) at 9e.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 02:51:39 CET 2002 from spider-tk021.proxy.aol.com (152.163.206.181)

butch

From: the mountains

Bones mentions Cassandra Wilson's cover of The Weight,,,

when The Band did Mountain Stage, a little known Cassandra Wilson opened for them,,,,

maybe thats where she got the idea, 1st ???

hmmmmmmm i wonder,,,, ( her kid was a bundle of energy,, drove her staff nuts,,,,)


Posted on Wed Feb 27 02:31:27 CET 2002 from dialup-067.cork.iol.ie (194.125.43.67)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

Well....as I was saying...there I was, sitting in a bar talking to this guy about The Band and the Re-issues and ....uh....

Aw...fergit it!


Posted on Wed Feb 27 01:30:56 CET 2002 from adsl-61-166-24.rdu.bellsouth.net (208.61.166.24)

Bones

Of interest to Band fans......the great Cassandra Wilson will be releasing a new album in March which will feature a cover of The Band's "The Weight". Hope all is well with everyone in the GB.

Also, Bonnie Raitt's Green Light record (with Richard Manuel guesting) will be re-released next Tuesday on cd (not sure if any bonus tracks are involved).


Posted on Wed Feb 27 00:52:29 CET 2002 from m198214176091.austin.cc.tx.us (198.214.176.91)

Pehr

Go Pat Go!


Posted on Wed Feb 27 00:27:27 CET 2002 from dialup-65.57.15.32.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.57.15.32)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

John W.: Thanks for the laughs. When you beg people not to engage in political discussion then follow your entreaty with a political discussion, you display an interesting ability to apply free speech only to speech you like. A lesson from Ashcroft no doubt. For your edification, however, you should be aware that Bush was given the presidency by a historically poorly derived Supreme Court decision, the tax cut has bancrupted the government in a time of crisis, the military and the intelligence community is guiding the people through this crisis, and if you think this administration doesn't stink of Enron ( come to think of it, didn't Dubya do a stock bail on one of his fading oil companies?) I got an condo at Watergate that might interest you. But really, enough of the political talk.


Posted on Wed Feb 27 00:08:29 CET 2002 from 0-1pool74-67.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.74.67)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

John Donabie: your remarks about the questionable life span of CDs are the third mention of this that I have heard recently (though one was regarding disintegrating CD-R discs). I've yet to read anything authoritative about this yet, but it is disturbing. I own one Edison cylinder from around 1908 that would play if I had something to spin it on, but I do own a Victrola and some Spike Jones, Gene Autry and Chuck Berry 78 rpm discs that I play once in a while. It's really ironic now to think that some of those may outlive my much newer, and much more high tech and expensive compact discs.

Dave Hopkins: I'm with you in wishing that The Band had recorded more "stripped-down, acoustic stuff." Two of my favorite songs by the guys are "Acadian Driftwood" (as someone said, "a masterpiece") and, of course, "Rockin' Chair." I'm listening to the ROCK OF AGES bonus disc live version of the latter as I write this and the weariness of Richard's vocal--especially when he sings "the days that remain ain't worth a dime"--verges on the heartbreaking.

One of the later songs that fits this acoustic thread is "Atlantic City." I can still remember the first time I heard the song, pulling out of a foggy hotel parking lot in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia. A static-laced radio signal hauntingly teased me with Levon's mandolin and Garth's accordian. I felt like I was in hillbilly heaven because--for a short time at least--The Band was back!


Posted on Tue Feb 26 23:49:47 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

BAYOU SAM.......brings up a great point! My old records that go back 45 years are still mint. However some of my CD's as stated previously are fading. Mr. Viney???


Posted on Tue Feb 26 23:17:05 CET 2002 from du-tele3-070.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.70)

Peter Viney

My last post was unclear- the quoted "he" (who thought The Band had limitations) was Dylan, NOT Robbie. But then again … maybe Robbie did!

Any more thoughts on ROCKIN' CHAIR. In spite of too much other work I've started assembling some of the wonderful comments. Put 'em in now!


Posted on Tue Feb 26 23:12:38 CET 2002 from wwwcache.lanl.gov (128.165.156.80)

Kay

From: New Mexico

People should write about whatever they want in the GB, but some should practice getting to the point. Brevity is the soul of wit, I hear.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 22:21:13 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

The Grammy Awards show will be broadcast tomorrow night (Wed., Feb. 27th). In addition to Bob Dylan's three nominations & scheduled live performance, Band fans may hear another familiar name mentioned-- that of Mary Martin. Ms. Martin, now a VP with Mercury Nashville, co-produced the Hank Williams tribute album, "Timeless", which is nominated for Best Country Album. Individual performances by Sheryl Crow, Lucinda Williams, Ryan Adams and Johnny Cash from the "Timeless" album are also nominated.

Some 37 years ago, Mary Martin was instrumental in putting Bob Dylan together with the former Hawks. Over the intervening years she also worked with other artists, such as Leonard Cohen, Van Morrison and Emmylou Harris. Since the '80s she's been working as a recording label executive in Nashville, first with RCA and now at Mercury Nashville.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 21:51:36 CET 2002 from 1cust58.tnt30.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.78.58)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Terrorism may have been around for a long time but the stakes are now much higher as WMDs can all too easily fall into the hands of religious fanatics. "Imagine no religion..." thanks to JL for that beautiful thought!! Too bad the "Age of Reason" never caught on - it's gonna be a long, long, bumpy road.

BTW who cares what anyone "prefers" to read in the GB? I'm for free thinking and free speech, not restricted thinking and restricted speech. Music is often intertwined with philosophical and political ideas anyway. Anyone who wants to see only music discussed (well, maybe dancing too) should go read and post in the 'NSYNC Guestbook.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 21:36:46 CET 2002 from spider-wl011.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.21)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

That's a scary thought that John D. brings up about the life-span of CD's. I'm interested to hear from anyone who has any technical knowledge about why this would happen.

That's all the more reason to hang on to those old records.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 21:31:49 CET 2002 from spider-wl011.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.21)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

That's an interesting comment in Peter's post about RR feeling that there were limitations in The Band. I would think that the other guys could have handled RR's solo stuff easily, musically. So the limitations must have been personal ones. It could go back to the thinking that RR kind of "grew-up" as The Band's career went along. Maybe by '76 he just wasn't the same member of the "clubhouse" that he was once upon a time.

Sometimes I get the feeling - based on nothing but a feeling - that Robbie just grew to not particularly like the other guys as much as he did. I don't think he hates them, or dosen't respect their incredible musicianship - I just wonder if he simply didn't care as much for them as people. It's kind of a sad thought. It may not even hold water. it's just something rattling around in my brain. In fact, I get the feeling that RR has very delibrately NOT said what he REALLY thinks because he has no interest in being just plain mean and nasty.

Hey Robbie - if you visit this GB - do us a favor and wsrite a couple of books. One of your memiors - and one with the words ("mud" or "blood")and music for The Band tunes. Be a regular guy and write those if you have some "time to kill".


Posted on Tue Feb 26 20:13:25 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO FATS AND JOHNNY


Posted on Tue Feb 26 20:10:20 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

I hope that John W is kidding in his e-mail. I find that the "attack on terror" seems very odd, since there has been terror in the world since the Beginning Of Time. No one is going to wipe the world of terror. It will sadly be always with us. I've had many of my American friends tell me that Bush has to keep this up for another 3 years at least. Let's all remember before 9/11 this was a President who was kidded, laughed at and made fun of by many. The 9/11 incident made this quite improper. Like many I believe this is George's ticket to staying in the White House. Without a "war on terrorism" it might go back to the jokes. That is the feeling of many of my American friends. Also we must remember that the United States is not officially at war with anyone. Congress are the ones who have to "legally" declare war and they have never done so. This is a war in words only at this point. I'm surprised congress never backed Bush into making this an official war.

As a Canadian I feel it is our duty to fight with the Americans and do everything we can do to assist them. Some Canadians forget that the United States not only protects much of the world; but they protect us as well. We must tighten up our borders and make sure that radicals do not come in from our side of the door anymore. I've said many times that except for that invisible 49th parallel we are indeed Brothers and Sisters on this continent of North America.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 19:56:09 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

TO PETER VINEY & ALL

A couple of eyars back Peter and I got on a discussion about how long our CD’s were going to last us. This came out of the deterioration of a CD from the original 5 Dylan Genuine Basement Tapes. One of the CD’s that Peter and I both owned took on a strange look on the surface. It was as if you had spilled something on it and it had dried. This translated to a “skipping” CD. There were no scratches on the CD............just this “smear.”

Last night I brought out my original Bangladesh double CD to listen to the live version of My Sweet Lord. All of a sudden the CD began to skip. I took it out of the machine and turned it over and what do you think I saw? The same “stain” as on the Dylan CD. This also happened on an MCA Buddy Holly Greatest hits CD.

My point here is, that with thousands of CD’s that I have already collected what really is the life expectancy of the CD?

Remember when they first came out and people said you could smear peanut butter on them……you could scratch them with a knife and they would still play? Well we found out the truth about that. I must admit I am a little worried.

A friend of mine who is into film is telling me that some of his old VHS tapes are starting to look faded. Also some of the old Technicolor Movies that are shown on TV are starting to take on a “red” appearance. Let’s hope the archivists find a solution to all of these problems. I know I don’t have the money to re-purchase my CD collection.. Comments? Peter?


Posted on Tue Feb 26 19:33:51 CET 2002 from m198214176091.austin.cc.tx.us (198.214.176.91)

Pehr

"Plush safe he think"


Posted on Tue Feb 26 19:32:20 CET 2002 from user-38ldl32.dialup.mindspring.com (209.86.212.98)

J Quest

From: San Clemente

I just noticed a Cajun compilation called Evangeline-Made, on Vanguard, with some folks appearing that had recently been tossed about in the GB: John Fogarty, Nick Lowe & Richard Thompson.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 18:56:56 CET 2002 from dap-209-114-161-88.nfas.monroe-tnt-1.sns234.pa.stargate.net (209.114.161.88)

Mary (bear)

From: Western PA

Congratulations to my Canadian guestbook friends on the Canadian teams winning the Gold. Mario is on his way back to the "burg" tonight. You all take care and keep listening to the wonderful music The Band and so many others have left for us to enjoy.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 18:41:03 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Happy 70th birthday to The Man In Black -- a man as real as his music!

"There were nights I don't remember
And there's pain that I've forgotten
Other things I choose not to recall
There are faces that come to me
In my darkest secret memory
Faces that I wish would not come back at all."

"In my dreams parade of lovers
From the other times and places
There's not one that matters now, no matter who
I'm just thankful for the journey
And that I've survived the battles
And that my spoils of victory are you."

--Johnny Cash (from "Like A Soldier")


Posted on Tue Feb 26 18:05:14 CET 2002 from (12.33.178.141)

twilight

From: ann arbor, mi

Hey Butch - Any news on the Hubert Sumlin album release? I recall one of your posts from a while back said it might be soon. Let us know when you can.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 17:07:51 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp0170.dialsprint.net (63.187.8.170)

jeffrey

John,you're kidding right? By the way, when are you going to post a proper e-mail?


Posted on Tue Feb 26 16:44:13 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

I would prefer not to see endless political debates on this guestbook as it is much more pleasant to read about the music and musicians we love. Especially since most of the liberal "whine" is the fruit of "sour grapes." They just can't get over the fact that the conservative side has had some success. Just can't accept the fact that Bush beat Gore in the election; got his tax reforms implemented; has skillfully guided the nation following the 9/11 attacks; and nothing negative about the Enron situation has stuck to anyone in the administration.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 16:24:14 CET 2002 from spider-wk052.proxy.aol.com (205.188.198.172)

butch

From: the library

There is a nice review of Hubert Sumlin's 70th Birthday gig in NYC @ BB Kings,,,

it is in the newest issue of BLUES REVUE,,,

Levon, & Chris & Pat of the BarnBurners get a nice mention,,,,,,,,, as well they should,,,,they were blistering that night,,,, justa FYI,,,,,,, butch


Posted on Tue Feb 26 15:50:31 CET 2002 from du-tele3-056.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.56)

Peter Viney

From the latest issue of Q. They cite Robbie as a “cast member” of The Rolling Thunder Review. Well, not on the record or video, but I think he did play on just one gig. Anyone remember? They also make the comment on Rolling Thunder - “His artistic objective, inspired by Patti Smith, was to break out of what he had come to see as The Band’s limitations.” Hmm. Limitations – what were they? Playing in tune? Insisting on knowing the songs?


Posted on Tue Feb 26 14:41:41 CET 2002 from dialup-329.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.73)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

I was waiting for a lift yesterday..... in a pub here in Cork... and a guy I met while waiting mentioned to me how he got The Big Pink reissue and how much he really dug it....he knows I'm a Band-Head.....we talked about The Band for a while and he was under the impression that it must be great for them with all the re-issues coming out and how many new bands name-check The Band as influences....I agreed with him up to a point but felt compelled to tell him how two of The Band are now passed on and two of The Band are now virtually broke......he expressed amazement at this.......he said it was hard to believe.......my lift arrived and I had to split........I went away thinking that maybe I know too much and worse, that I might have SAID too much....this fellow was a music lover.......loved The Band.....and I had to go and give this dark edge to the conversation.......

On a happier note....I finished a gig last Friday night with "The Weight" and usually we have all the vocal parts all worked out and we do it properly....so to speak.......but the gig had gone so well and the crowd were well up on it and pretty well tanked up, too, that when we got to the "And" part, there was this huge swell of about 100 people singing "ANNNNNNNNNNNNND......you put the load right on me" all wrong and outta time.....funniest thing you ever heard.....now I KNOW that might annoy the shite outta some folks...but hey!!!......you know what happens when you DON'T have too much fun.....


Posted on Tue Feb 26 13:51:09 CET 2002 from (66.152.204.145)

Bob R

Not only is it Johnny Cash's birthday today, but Fats Domino also has a birthday as well-- the fat man turns 74 today !


Posted on Tue Feb 26 13:04:37 CET 2002 from spider-ta084.proxy.aol.com (152.163.205.84)

Brien Sz

From: Nj

Hello.., I'm Johnny Cash, (i love that opening line)to Folsom Prison Blues - i think i'll crank it up today.

Love the Rockin Chair discussion, it is definately the finest moment of the remasters. Also, is that RR's falsetto i hear in the background while Richards singing?

Civil Rights - First of all, they should be for citizens. Too many folks love to hide behind that viel when it serves their purpose. I say bring back the Alien and Seditions Act!

Yea, lets get another Special Prosecuter case going.., It's all this country needs. Every President since Ford has had one and everyone was a waste of taxpayers time and money. The only thing it does is distract what should be time spent trying to run the country effectively. I'm no Clinton fan but even Starrs Investigation was a colossal waste of time that in the end did nothing but hurt the country. Bob Woodward wrote a very solid book called "Shadow" that deals with all the Special Prosecuter cases of the last 5 presidencies.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 12:19:53 CET 2002 from i249-010.nv.iinet.net.au (203.59.249.10)

Nancy

From: Australia

I heard on the radio that Johnny Cash is 70 today.

Personally I don't like to think of him passing on, as he's such a legend and given enjoyment to so many people. My father used to get a great kick out of "A Girl Called Sue" when he heard it on the radio during late night car trips. He'd have a joke and a laugh about it, then pull my mother over from her side of the car to cuddle with him the rest of the way home. I was supposed to be asleep..........


Posted on Tue Feb 26 11:03:32 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

How old is the Man in Black? I hear he is in poor health, I first heard Johhny listening to my Mom's old 45's back in the 60's, yep my Mom's favorite's Elvis and Johhny were the sound's in our house.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 10:14:51 CET 2002 from p50853343.dip.t-dialin.net (80.133.51.67)

ulbiman

From: germany

HAPPY BIRTHDAY..... JOHNNY CASH !! Ride on Man in Black, ride on!


Posted on Tue Feb 26 07:06:37 CET 2002 from 1cust173.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.173)

Jeffrey

Hey boys! Is this the administration you're asking me to trust? This is way better than the LH/RR feud!----We Demand a Special Prosecutor for Enrongate! Sign the Petition The collapse of Enron was the largest bankruptcy in American history. Thousands of Americans - including many Enron employees - were financially devastated. But Enron's executives got rich. A shareholder lawsuit alleges that the 29 executives and directors dumped $1.1 billion worth of stock while knowing the company was in danger of collapse. Enron's collapse is the subject of a criminal investigation by the Justice Department of the Bush Administration. However, the Bush administration and Enron are so closely connected as to be virtually indistinguishable. Enron chair Ken Lay and other Enron executives were George W. Bush's largest donors, contributing over $550,000. Top officials of the Bush administration, including political advisor Karl Rove, were major stockholders in Enron. Close associates of George W. Bush, including Florida recount chair James Baker, served on the board of directors of Enron. Top Republican officials, including Republican Chairman Marc Racicot, lobbied for Enron, while the Republican Party received huge contributions from Enron. Enron was a key advisor to the Bush administration in the secret formulation of its energy plan, which the administration adamantly refuses to make public. One day after Ken Lay met with Dick Cheney in April 2001, Cheney declared the administration's opposition to wholesale electricity price controls in California, which was enormously profitable to Enron. The Bush administration cannot possibly conduct an independent and thorough investigation of Enron. Attorney General John Ashcroft had to recuse himself from the Justice Department's criminal investigations after it was revealed that he received more than $61,000 in contributions from Enron executives. Deputy Attorney General Larry Thompson, who inherited these criminal investigations, was a partner in a law firm that represented Enron, which creates an intolerable conflict of interest. We, the undersigned, demand a Special Prosecutor to investigate all of the crimes that preceeded the collapse of Enron, and the possible involvement of the Bush administration in those crimes. Sign the Petition


Posted on Tue Feb 26 06:47:54 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tc051.proxy.aol.com (64.12.105.171)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

If any of those prisoners being held in Cuba were given the slightest chance - they would cut the throat of any American they could get to. They're probably eating better, and sleeping better, than they ever have in their lives.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 06:29:02 CET 2002 from 1cust173.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.173)

Jeffrey

By the way, did I mention I was at The Last Waltz?


Posted on Tue Feb 26 06:18:35 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

CRABGRASS---maybe Im out line with how folks on this site feel but I just dont feel any compassion for the al Qaeda detainees, if what your saying is a example of thier civil rights being violated I guess my response would be I'm surprised they are treated that well, I believe in due process, I don't think they should be beaten or treated like animals but on the same hand they are being held on very serious charges and if you've ever been through the legal system you know it's no picnic..........


Posted on Tue Feb 26 05:56:54 CET 2002 from a010-0002.blgs.splitrock.net (209.254.61.2)

Jack Straw

From: "somewhere in the middle of Montana"

An alleged Ronnie Hawkins Martin D-45 up on eBay #1518797287.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 05:53:58 CET 2002 from 1cust173.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.173)

jeffrey

Crabby is referring to an e-mail I sent him.Skewed to suit your taste Crabby.But I suppose it can be argued, we all do that.Nonetheless,certain details you mention are taken out of context, and to be truthful, many Middle Eastern folks have been detained illegally, many of whom are in the US legally. You left out this part(among many)"....We cannot justify a government which takes from the people our right to privacy and then assumes for its own operations a right to total secrecy".Or this"...Let us pray that our nation will remember that the unfolding of the promise of democracy in our nation paralleled the striving for civil rights. That is why we must challenge the rationale of the Patriot Act. We must ask why should America put aside guarantees of constitutional justice? How can we justify in effect canceling the First Amendment and the right of free speech, the right to peaceably assemble? How can we justify in effect canceling the Fourth Amendment, probable cause, the prohibitions against unreasonable search and seizure? How can we justify in effect canceling the Fifth Amendment, nullifying due process, and allowing for indefinite incarceration without a trial? How can we justify in effect canceling the Sixth Amendment, the right to prompt and public trial? How can we justify in effect canceling the Eighth Amendment which protects against cruel and unusual punishment? We cannot justify widespread wiretaps and internet surveillance without judicial supervision, let alone with it. We cannot justify secret searches without a warrant. We cannot justify giving the Attorney General the ability to designate domestic terror groups. We cannot justify giving the FBI total access to any type of data which may exist in any system anywhere such as medical records and financial records".Does any of this make sense? I hope so. For the complete text(unedited by Crabby) go to counterpunch.org and look for "A prayer for America" by Rep. Dennis Kucinich. Judge for yourself.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 05:21:30 CET 2002 from 1cust244.tnt48.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.92.244)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

I have just received word from a reliable source that some of the al Qaeda detainees at Guantanamo Naval Base in Cuba are not being afforded their civil rights. Also, there is a shortage of U.S. taxpayer purchased copies of the Holy Quar'an and that two to three detainees are often forced to share one copy during morning prayer in order to reinforce their religious convictions. In addition, many illegal aliens from the Middle East living in this country are victims of having their civil rights infringed upon.

Anyway, I'm thinking of organizing a March on Washington to protest government policies - if enough GBer's are into this we can rent a few buses and take a stand on this issue as Band fans. Contact me if interested.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 04:49:37 CET 2002 from sqd104.nirai.ne.jp (218.40.162.4)

Fred

To Scouser Alan Edge: Thanks for the info on your latest post (re: Scouser Tommy) I have a version of that LiverpoolFC anthem, on a Cherry Red Records CD, & i've always had the nagging feeling that that particular song was very familiar..of course Red River Valley! One of my dreams in life is to visit Anfield on match day...although I'm not a Liverpool fan (GREAT club, though, can't deny that fact!) hey maybe you could get the Kop to belt out a few Band songs..perhaps if you beat Man U you could sing The Night They Drove Ol' Manu U down!!!


Posted on Tue Feb 26 04:42:39 CET 2002 from as3-2-24.hip.berkeley.edu (136.152.194.138)

Dave Hopkins

From: Berkeley, CA

"Rockin' Chair" is the only Band song that I can think of from the original lineup without a drummer on the track (not counting "The Genetic Method" and some of the demos on the reissues like "What Am I Living For"), which gives it a bit of a Basement Tapes feel. I've always loved Danko's bass playing on the track, in part for this reason. Usually, Rick liked to play off the drums with a fair amount of syncopation (check out "Up on Cripple Creek," "Across the Great Divide," "Stage Fright" etc. etc. for great examples of this) and was of course just terrific at it; I can't think of a bass player anywhere with a better intuitive sense of rhythm.

But on "Rockin' Chair" there's no Levon or Richard behind the kit, and Rick adopts a different approach entirely since it's his responsibility to keep time for the rest of the group. So he sticks mostly to the downbeats, and it's perfect. I especially love the descending figure he plays during the verses (under "it's for sure, I spent my whole life at sea" and the corresponding points later in the song). There's nothing at all technically complex about his performance, and just about any bass player could play it. But not just any bass player *would* play it, and that's what separates the great musicians from the rest of the pack.

Hell, there's nothing shabby about the other guys' playing either. I wish the Band had done more of the stripped-down acoustic stuff on later albums; it clearly had a feel for that style.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 02:46:21 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Charlie, I think you missed my point. Of course George knew The Band. Mr. Edge apologized for his piece not being on The Band and I said, it doesn't really matter; because few posts deal with "THE BAND" anymore because they no longer exist. That's just a reality. Nothing we can do about it. I think it's great we have this forum to talk about music in general, Band or not Band related. There is "no need to apologize" is what I was just saying.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 01:26:13 CET 2002 from cache-hay-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.32.130)

Al Edge

From: Liverpool

Just come across this on a Liverpool Football website - I did tell you about there being some good debate on there.

This particular debate concerns the origins of a song we sing on the Spion Kop at Anfield, the home of Liverpool Football Club.

It is a very moving song about the fierce pride a Scouser has for his beloved Liverpool as he lies dying on a scorching desert battlefield in Libya.

His final defiant words before dying are "I am a Liverpudlian, just come from the Spion Kop...". You can imagine how stirring this can be when roared by a large crowd.

Anyroad, the thing is somone has posted on the site that he believes the origins of the song lie in the American Civil War and has provided some background to this.

Reading about it is very moving and if the tale is true it goes to show the power of such bravery and dignity can actually survive in ways you might scarcely imagine.

True folk music perhaps?

Of course it has two connotations for me. Quite apart from the Scouse one, I am also reminded of what I wrote the other day about Virgil Kane and his brother. The valour , the honour and the fragility.

Anyroad, here's what the fellow posted. If you haven't read it before, I'd advise you to have a few tissues handy.

THE POST

The men were often thrown into the heat of a terrible battle just moments after reaching the front. They would engage in exhausting combat for days, interspersed by sleepless nights on the ground—sometimes in freezing rain or snow.

During the battle itself, they ate a dry, hard biscuit called hardtack, and very little else. In less combative times, they could add a little salt pork and coffee to their diet. That was it! As might be expected, their intestinal tracks were regularly shredded by diarrhea, dysentery and related diseases that decimated their ranks.

The Union Army reported upwards of 200,000 casualties from disease, often disabling up to 50 percent of the soldiers. The Confederates suffered a similar fate.

Combat experience itself was unbelievably violent in those days. Thousands of men stood toe to toe and slaughtered one another like flies.

After one particularly bloody battle in 1862, 5,000 men lay dead in an area of two square miles. Twenty thousand more were wounded. One witness said it was possible to walk on dead bodies for 100 yards without once stepping on the ground. Many of the wounded remained where they fell among dead men and horses for 12 or 14 hours, with their groans and cries echoing through the countryside.

While their willingness to endure these physical deprivations is almost incomprehensible, one has to admire the emotional toughness of the troops. They believed in their cause, whether Union or Confederate, and they committed their lives to it. Most believed that they would not survive the war, but that was of little consequence.

Please understand that I do not see unmitigated virtue in the heroic visions of that day. Indeed, men were all too willing to put their lives on the line for a war they poorly understood. But their dedication and personal sacrifice remain today as memorials to their time.

There is, perhaps, no better illustration of this commitment to principle and honor than is seen in a letter written by major Sullivan Ballou of the Union Army. He penned it to his wife, Sarah, a week before the battle of Bull Run, July 14, 1861. They had been married only six years. These powerful words still touch my soul:

My Very Dear Sarah:

The indications are very strong that we shall move in a few days—perhaps tomorrow. Lest I should not be able to write again, I feel impelled to write a few lines that may fall under your eye when I shall be no more ...

I have no misgivings about or lack of confidence in the cause in which I am engaged, and my courage does not halt or falter. I know how strongly American civilization now leans on the triumph of the Government, and how great a debt we owe to those who went before us through the blood and suffering of the Revolution. And I am willing, perfectly willing, to lay down all my joys in this life to help maintain this Government and to pay that debt...

Sarah, my love for you is deathless: it seems to bind me with mighty cables that nothing but Omnipotence could break, and yet my love for country comes over me like a strong wind and bears me irresistibly on, with all these chains to the battle-field.

The memories of all the blissful moments I have spent with you come creeping over me, and I feel most deeply grateful to God, and you, that I have enjoyed them so long. And how hard it is for me to give them up and burn to ashes the hopes of future years, when, God willing, we might still have lived and loved together and seen our sons grown up to honorable manhood around us.

If I do not (return), my dear Sarah, never forget how much I love you, and when my last breath escapes me on the battle-field, it will whisper your name. Forgive my many faults and the many pains I have caused you. How thoughtless, how foolish I have often-times been...

O Sarah, if the dead can come back to this earth and flit unseen around those they loved, I shall always be near you in the gladdest day and in the darkest night, amidst your happiest scenes and gloomiest hours—always, always: and if there be a soft breeze upon your cheek, it shall by my breath, or the cool air cools your throbbing temple, it shall be my spirit passing by.

Sarah, do not mourn me dead: think I am gone, and wait for me, for we shall meet again...

Sullivan

Major Ballou was killed one week later in the first battle of Bull Run. I wonder, don’t you, if he did indeed utter Sarah’s name as he lay dying on the battlefield. She undoubtedly suffered the greater pain in the aftermath of that terrible war.

The story goes that as a Tribute the Americans created a song which eventually was sung to the tune of Red River Valley and as a result Americans have been singing it at sporting events since the 1920s, I have a few versions of the American song.

Liverpool supporters may well have got the idea of Poor Scouser Tommy uttering the words 'I am a Liverpudlian' from this poignant tale of Major Ballou.


Posted on Tue Feb 26 01:25:16 CET 2002 from 210-55-236-20.static-dialup.xtra.co.nz (210.55.236.20)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

Jared, I've only ever heard the Cromatix on the Souvineer CD and based on that I do have to agree with you. That being said the prof's organ on Rag Mama Raf is like something out of Rock Of Ages. Incredible stuff.

The thing(s) I like most about Rocking Chair is the Accordion and Mandolin. The whole arrangement is like some string band from another time. When You Awake , The Unfaithful Servant and Dixie have that same sort of feel and are probably the songs that (as someone once said) made The Band the best album of the 19th century.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 23:19:23 CET 2002 from 1cust18.tnt23.tco2.da.uu.net (67.200.182.18)

Charlie Young

From: On the Road in Charlottesville, VA

First I mention Bugs Bunny and now someone named "Doc" posts here. What's up Doc? Seriously, Doc, you mention MOJO as a fine music magazine and I agree. In fact, our own Peter Viney wrote a fine piece about Richard Mauuel for a special issue of MOJO that discussed great singers.

Finally, George Harrison had countless connections to The Band, among them his words about them on any number of occassions (including the "Classic Albums" documentary). I just saw the clip of Sir Paul singing "Yesterday" with the lyrics altered to honor George and it was quite moving.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 23:05:36 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ta074.proxy.aol.com (64.12.105.54)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

THE BAND


Posted on Mon Feb 25 22:56:13 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

AL EDGE: No need to apologize for not mentioning The Band in your Harrison story. The Band are rarely mentioned here anymore; other than talks of feuds or who likes or dislikes certain members of the group. My feeling is that Jan allows the guest book to continue on, I think; because many of us have become on-line friends and some of us personal friends. The reason that brought us all here no longer exists; but the memories do.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 21:33:07 CET 2002 from 24-196-236-100.charter-georgia.com (24.196.236.100)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga

Away on a driving trip but had more time to think about the wonderful concert last Thursday of John Hiatt, doing his solo tour. John, came out in a Black Suit, said later that it is his slimming black suit, but the jacket came off about half way through the concert. Luckily, we had seats about 10 rows from the stage in a 1000 seat venue, like Rick used to say, like being in his living room, so we danced, boogied and cried to the Rider with the King. Don't remember the set list, but lots of favorites, including, Gone, Tiki Bar, Everyone went Low, Have a little Faith in Me, What are we going to do, and of course, accoustic Riding with the King. What made the ending so magic, the 4th encore, John comes back and does a new tune, which is a tribute to NYC and 9/11. If you remember, the following weekend was the BB King Tour in the NY area, and JH was in the city at the time of the tragedy.

Another special moment came, after the show, we went in the back of the venue, waited about 5 minutes near the bus and John comes out, well everyone who waited, had their time with John, shaking hands, taking pictures, just BS ing, such a nice guy. It made me remember, how wonderful it is when you can meet your heroes, just like Rick, just like Levon, John Hiatt has paid his dues and his love for his fan's and music shows.

This completes my February musical Trifecta, and now got to find some live music for March, but maybe one day, will be lucky enough to mark The Barn Burners on the Calender down here.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 21:23:15 CET 2002 from dra-211.dhcp.umass.edu (128.119.99.211)

doc

From: western mass

Probably a silly question but I wanted to know if anybody has an idea on where I could obtain a really well done professional-like copy of the complete Last Waltz on CD? I've been directed to one site from one of the good folks over on the chat line but, apparently, that company isn't intent on trading.

Thank you Pat Brennan and Peter Viney for your responses to my message last week - if you still remember. I would have liked to thanked you two earlier but not having my own computer makes it difficult.

One last note: If anybody finds it, pick up an issue of a music mag entitled "MOJO." - It's been around for about 10 yrs but apparently it's not that popular. My friend introduced it to me last week and I thought it was great reading. He describes it as "the music mag for all the disgruntled Rolling Stone fans because it's everything that Rolling Stone should be." It surely is informative and intelligent and w/o all those darn adversitements! The only problem is that it's only distributed from the UK so it will cost anywhere from $7-$10. Funny thing is, I know I have seen it a million times but I just passed it up as probably another fluffy mag - and I always say 'never judged a book by its cover'! Anyway, definately buy it, I know you'll love it. Great article this month on why Brian Wilson's "Smile" never came out.

Take care folks.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 20:22:38 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

Jared Goldman - Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I can't believe how you can miss the talent of Prof. Louie and the Crowmatix! I think he displays tons of talent with the piano, organ and accordian, and sings pretty well, too! And Miss Marie seems to get better all the time, she can belt out the blues pretty well. She reminds me of a combination of Janis Joplin (better voice, though) with the "witchiness" of a Stevie Nicks. If you watch Mike Dunn, he's always right on the money with the bass licks, and Gary Burke is, in my opinion, an awesome drummer! I think the "Jam" CD is even better than the prvious one, "Over the Edge", though they are both worth the price!

The only thing I will acknowledge is that they are not the most guitar-oriented band you will ever see. If you ever see them on the same bill with the Gurus, you might walk away thinking the Gurus were better, because the Crowmatix don't have anyone who can play like Jim Weider. But then, who does? But as far as pure talent and playing tight together as a unit, the Crowmatix are hard to beat!


Posted on Mon Feb 25 19:40:03 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-249.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.249)

Amanda

Ragtime Willie: I think that is excellent...what you wrote about Rockin' Chair. The speaker is older and tired, yet wants to keep this life that he has always known...he doesn't want to go home and grow old in his rockin'chair because that Big Rockin' Chair won't go nowhere. I hadn't thought of something so simple...thanks. And...thanks to everyone for the wonderful reviews of The Barnburner shows...Bob Wigo...your turning into a regular Road Warrior!


Posted on Mon Feb 25 19:38:43 CET 2002 from proxy4ext.disney.com (204.128.192.73)

Jared Goldman

Hi Everyone, I know I may be in the minority here but, does anyone else have trouble listening to Prof. Louie and the Crowmatix? I love the Band and early anticipate the rerelease of the Last Waltz and even enjoy going to see Garth and Levon however, I find Prof. Louie etc to be almost unbearable to listen to. They sound extremely second rate and hokey and at times I feel like their renditions of Band songs are almost insultory. Harsh words I know, but I always read how everyone seems to like their music and I just don't understand where I've gone wrong. Jared


Posted on Mon Feb 25 19:29:57 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tk074.proxy.aol.com (64.12.107.54)

butch

From: dumbville

OOOOOPS !!!!!!!!! MY MISTAKE !!!!!!

i should read my mail ALL the way through,,,ROFL

it was NOT PSB,,,,

it WAS peter spencer,,,,

sorry,,,MY FAULT!!!!!!!!

butch


Posted on Mon Feb 25 19:13:57 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tk074.proxy.aol.com (64.12.107.54)

peter stone brown

From: off line

Dear Butch, I no longer have access to the AOL bulletin board. Could you post this there for me? vvv, pete

It was another grand night on Friday, when the BBs hit Trenton at the new Conduit Club. I brought the guys in my band Wise Virgins to the show and Levon couldn't have been nicer to them, which is a HUGE boost to my credibility! They were thrilled to meet him and knocked out by the music.

Okay, so the sound was a bit Pink Floyd for my taste, all those super-highs and super-lows that just get in the way IMHO. But that's what you get, I guess, when the place doubles as a dance club and the sound people are in their twenties. Hard not to play with all those toys when you got 'em. Lee sounded great despite a cold that had him reaching for the tissues fairly often. Those false endings are turning into a real tour de force, and on another tune he did some spectacular rim-work on the toms. George the drummer was in awe, and everyone in the club had the same delighted, vacant smile on their face that I had. Bear and I danced a lot, which she likes. We did the dirty boogie (although not as dirty as that blonde at ringside - she was hot!) the Twist, the Tango, the Foxtrot, and the lighter-than-air-hippie-wave. My back hasn't felt so good in months. It really is a healing experience to dance to that music, reminds me of Garth's comments in the LW movie about "The musicians are the ones who punch it out and make people feel good." That's what Levon does. Miss Amy wasn't there, but this band keeps getting more and more solid each time I hear 'em. Pat and Chris work together beautifully and the new bass-player (Frank?) swings like a bitch and also does wonderful hokey tricks with the upright.

One sometimes overlooked factor is the pleasure I get in watching Butch work. This is a total pro, whether calming down an overamped kid who's requesting "The Weight" every five minutes, announcing the band, directing traffic on and off the stage - or in the dressing room - he is always on the case and making things better. Thanks Butch!

This morning one of my co-workers asked me how my weekend went. I said "I had a hot date Friday night and spent the rest of the weekend sleeping." She said, "Perfect!" and it was.

spent creeper


Posted on Mon Feb 25 19:03:26 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

For me the definitive version of Hoagy Carmichael's "Rockin' Chair" is the one that trombonist Jack Teagarden sang along with Louis Armstrong. Another song, with a similar theme, that Mr. Carmichael wrote with Johnny Mercer, is "Lazybones". My favorite version of that song is the one that Amos Garrett performed on Geoff & Maria Muldaur's fine "Sweet Potatoes" album.

When you mention Hoagy Carmichael, you can't help but talk about his great classic, "Georgia On My Mind", a song he wrote with lyricist Stuart Gorrell. Although Ray Charles practically made this song his own, who can forget The Band's great version with Richard Manuel's haunting vocal performance. Another wonderful version is Maria Muldaur's from Geoff & Maria Muldaur's "Pottery Pie" album, that also features an incredible guitar solo from the aforementioned Amos Garrett.

With these songs, Jack Teagarden & Louis Armstrong's "Rockin' Chair", The Band's "Rockin' Chair, Amos Garrett with Geoff & Maria "Lazybones", along with "Georgia On My Mind" by Brother Ray, The Band & Maria, one has the makings of a good CDR compilation disc. Anybody have any suggestions for other songs in a similar vein to add?


Posted on Mon Feb 25 18:30:01 CET 2002 from spider-tl021.proxy.aol.com (152.163.207.181)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA

Great show Friday night in Trenton. My thanks to Levon and the Barn Burners for the gift of great music.

And thanks to you Butch for your kindness and generosity. Hope to see you all again soon.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 18:07:20 CET 2002 from schltns-3.demon.nl (212.238.196.9)

(they call me) Ragtime (Willie)

From: the Flying Dutchman... no... not Ol'Virginny...

Rockin' Chair...

I always thought it's about old men coming to rest at the end of their days...

The Flying Dutchman's on the reef - in other words: he who was doomed to sail into eternity without ever finding a place to stay... has finally come home.

But intrigueing are the following lines:

I can hear something calling on me / And you know where I wanna be / Oh Willie do you hear that sound... (and a little bit further on) I Believe old rockin' chair's got me.

So: I think the speaker is not in the least satisfied to be home again... he keeps longing... and longing... but he has to face reality and has to say to himself: "I just want to get my feet back on the ground".

Peter what do you think... surprised you didn't do an article on this one just yet...


Posted on Mon Feb 25 17:44:55 CET 2002 from citrix1.doc.state.vt.us (159.105.102.5)

John Cass

From: VT

I went to a great show this weekend at the Flynn Theatre in Burlington VT.. John Hammond's Wicked Grin and the Blind Boys Of Alabama.. great show but a funny thing happened as I was listening to John Hammond I was thinking to myself.. how much better Levon Helm & Barnburners are (in my opinion)at the same time I was thinking this my girlfreind nugged me and said "Levon's Band is alot better" I laughed to myself.. after the show I overheard a guy talking about Levon & Barnburner's and how much he enjoyed the show last year at the Higher Ground in Winooski (about 20 minutes outside Burlington) Its good to hear people talking about Levon as a Blues artist because the word is hopefully spreading that the Barnburners blues will stand up to any blues Band even ones that are headed by blues legends like John Hammond!!


Posted on Mon Feb 25 16:21:40 CET 2002 from sqd104.nirai.ne.jp (218.40.162.4)

Fred

that should have been "WON" not "one"...too many "STUPID" pills today


Posted on Mon Feb 25 14:43:13 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

My favorite Band songs was always a toss up between Whispering Pines and Rockin' Chair...I just thought that Rockin Chair was about five guys who had been traveling non-stop for about eight years and finally settled down up there in the Woodstock hills..they must have felt like old men to a degree...veterans...and at last they had the time and the place to reflect on their own lives..living in the country...getting to know the old timers that had become their neighbors and friends...I always felt that the song was about comfort...settling down to a simpler life...if you want to take it apart sentence by sentence you can come up with all kinds of different takes but if you are going to feel it as a whole....to me it means one thing.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 12:28:04 CET 2002 from sqd104.nirai.ne.jp (218.40.162.4)

Fred

Chester: It was a psychological ploy on the part of The Great One (that Us against the World bit seems to a tactic used by everyone---even me---to varying degrees of success, although it's NEVER worked for me! I say we petiton the IOC to have GARTH, ROBBIE & LEVON perform at all future Olympics (Winter & Summer).

for those of you interested in how my daughter finished in her race...she placed second. She could have one but she tripped at the start, fell down, picked herself up and from 19th ended up 2nd. If it was me I would have stayed on the ground, emoted and then threaten to sue/boycott the 2nd grade!! "That kid tripped me!!!" "IT's a plot, nobody wants me to win", etc.

Well gotta go do the dishes...I think I'll put on NLSC. I always liten to The Band when it's my turn to do the dishes (when I clean up the house then it's only the blues; Jazz when I'm cooking supper, unless it's pasta then the music has to be Italian (classical or folk). Oh gotta go, the wife is giving me THAT look. Yikes


Posted on Mon Feb 25 07:48:20 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Back at ya, wondering what the hell Kiss was doing performing at the olympic farewell, I can't believe that was the best they could do. Tough loss today for the good ole USA, great game, lots of great hockey played throughout and if we had to lose it's nice to see the folk's to the north get the gold, could of heard less complaining from the Great one though, I can't believe he really believes that everyone wanted to see the Canadian's lose, had to be a us against them ploy to get the Hab's to start playing some hockey, the man's got too much class for it to be anything else.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 06:24:25 CET 2002 from spider-ti033.proxy.aol.com (152.163.194.188)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Feb. 25 - George Harrison's 59th birthday.

Happy Birthday Dark Horse - wherever you are....


Posted on Mon Feb 25 05:58:18 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

50 Years is along time to wait for a Gold Medal in Men's Hockey. It was worth the wait.

After the game tonight I went to the first ever National Canadian Jazz Awards. Sat about 15 feet from Oscar Peterson as he sat down at the piano with Dave young on bass. He hasn't lost his groove.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 04:38:42 CET 2002 from (62.31.64.2)

Al Edge

From: Liverpool

What's happened Jerry? I take it a gold medal in the Olympic ice hockey??

Nice one Canada. The land of snow melts the opposition!

Who did you beat in the final btw? I know it couldn't have been us like - unless everybody else dropped out or we discovered a remote controlled puck that is.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 04:32:15 CET 2002 from cpe-61-9-134-107.vic.bigpond.net.au (61.9.134.107)

Bill

From: Adelaide, at the moment

Band collectors/completists might want to head to the record store in Adelaide's seaside suburb, Glenelg, for the el-cheapo Australian pressing of the Dutch compilation titled "The Weight". Same songs, same cover. Nearby in the B miscellaneous section is a '96 release of recordings by some pseudo-Byrds - among them, it appears from the writing credits, Danny McCullough (sp?) from the "Sky Pilot" days of Eric Burdon and the Animals. I didn't buy either, though I did pick up a 3-disk Nina Simone complilation. It's a wonder that she didn't record any Band songs - or did she?

Susan mentioned Maria Muldaur's "Sweet Harmony" album - in my view her best, featuring the guitar work of both Amos Garrett and David Wilcox (who also played together in an unrecorded Woodstock band called Juke - or Jook - with Billy Mundi and others. Wilcox, another amazing guitarist, had taken Amos' place in the Great Speckled Bird - with Buddy Cage, who Band Thought mentioned. I believe it was Wilcox who played on Ian and Sylvia's version of "Get Up Jake".


Posted on Mon Feb 25 04:26:24 CET 2002 from (62.31.64.2)

Al Edge

From: Liverpool

Well, well. Just read down below. Some kind words again. Thanks ever so.

Pete, what you said about my 'Band reflections', I have to say I would be honoured and totally thrilled for something I have written to be considered worthy of a place on this site.

I was SO pleased with how that piece turned out. It came from the heart and said exactly what I wanted it to say which as most of you will know isn't necessarily always the case when you're writing something. I just hope that others can identify with some of what I have to say. After all The Band's music is all about making those sort of connections and if that can be even remotely recreated in what we write on here then it can only be for the good. As Paul Godfey says SHINE ON.

Must say tho I do find it so natural writing about the boys and their music since their it has always connected so emotively with me. Writing about it when I can find the time is truly a labour of love as I'm sure it is with so many others on here as witnessed by the overall standard of posts which is often breathtaking.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 04:19:40 CET 2002 from cpe0000e8c550f8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.157.156.244)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto, Ontario, CANADA

Toronto is in a frenzy! There are people out in the streets downtown all over. After the game, people emptied out into the streets. Horns were honking. Flags were flying out of car windows. Poeple were really whooping it up. It is still going on hours after the game. My son lives right downtown and he said he's never seen anything like it. I don't think its so much the winning as it is the triumph of the spirit at a time when something like this is uplifting and without consequence. It just makes one feel plain good.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 04:01:45 CET 2002 from 12-249-69-3.client.attbi.com (12.249.69.3)

Chris

From: Chicago
Web page

Hey can anyone tell me the session that Levon played with Max Weinberg. Saw a picture of it at www.drummerworld.com, which if everything goes right is the web page above.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 03:57:48 CET 2002 from cache-hay-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.32.130)

Al Edge

From: Liverpool

Fuckinhell girls and boys will yiz behave!!! I've only just got through "Dixie" and "Unfaithful Servant" and now yiz are all sat on the bloody "Rockin Chair" or collecting rags and friggin bones!!! Ever get the feeling you're off the pace??? I feel like the British skiers playing catch up to the Canadians!!

Incidentally loved the Bugs Bunny FUDD. Treeemendose. Do you think Wynona's fella sings about the JUDD below his feet after they've got a bit frisky??? Just curious like?? LOL


Posted on Mon Feb 25 03:42:44 CET 2002 from sqd104.nirai.ne.jp (218.40.162.4)

Fred

I listen to/look at/take Rockin' Chair at face value (laziness on my part?): it's a nice melancholic song about retirement. now if I may be a bit jingoistic: CA-NA-DA!! A question: what are KISS doing at the olympics?!?!!? They should have had GARTH do ALL the music for the closing ceremonies.( Ithink that should be a prerequisite for any future Olympics..ONLY GARTH does the opening and closing ceremonies!!! Well, gotta go watch my daughter run a race (we live right across from her school...I can watch from our balcony) CA-NA-DA (sorry to all the US GBers..not to rub salt in an open wound, but...CA-NA-DA! Oops there I go again!)


Posted on Mon Feb 25 03:27:37 CET 2002 from (62.31.64.2)

Al Edge

From: An extremely emotional Liverpool

GEORGE HARRISON TRIBUTE CONCERT AT THE LIVERPOOL EMPIRE

A night of incredibly high emotion on the banks of the Mersey. The concert had sold out within a few hours of its being announced without a single appearing artist known. Has to be some sort of record.

Three thousand packed The Empire to the rafters to pay tribute to one of the city's most famous sons. On the night we simply did what we do best around here which is to have a good time with old friends. Tears, jokes, laughter but above all fine music filled the air.

As I said I would inevitably do I blubbed at least half a dozen times as the early song memories of those early Liverpool Fab Four days completely overwhelmed me - ["I'll Get You" really did get to me - after 38 years I finally found out what Paul meant by his lyrics] but nobody noticed as they themselves were too busy wiping away their tears too.

George will always remain in the hearts of his fellow Scousers. Being the quietest and most unassuming he was arguably remembered most fondly.

Some tremendous acts graced the famous old Empire stage tonight. Obviously the theme was 'George'. His own and other Beatles songs were featured throughout.

They were all there. Too many to mention but for me the stand outs were "Here Comes The Sun" from Steve Harley - who incidentally was utterly sensational throughout and someone for whom I shall certainly be on the look out in the future - and "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" by an incredible duo called 'Dare' featuring an organist [ex Thin Lizzie whose name escapes me] and an amazing acoustic guitarist/vocalist.

As local rebel rouser Pete Wylie - who was on next last - joked before launching into his tribute song - "I got the short straw - there's only Ringo 'B' sides left!!"

A pulsating "Badge" - which George had evidently penned with Eric Clapton - confirmed that Pete was only kidding. As ever. It's one thing we Scousers are good at as I'm sure most of you folks on here are sick to fuckin death of me telling yiz all.

I'll take away some treasured memories of the evening but the one that will linger will certainly be the final finale. As everybody was trooping off after a rousing "My Sweet Lord" with about 10,000 Hari Krishnas on the stage, the local jockey Billy Butler MBE [which stands for Mrs Butlers Eldest btw] came across to the microphone to introduce a person whom he termed a well known local drunk who had just popped in from the ale house round the corner.

Now I swear to all of you I have never behaved like a teenybopper in my entire life before. Even when I was one. I would rather be garrotted. In all the years I've been attending concerts I can solemnly assure you I have NEVER behaved like a besotted teenage girl. Sure I have shouted and yelled and hollered and roared and sang and danced and jigged about with the best of them. Never though have I screamed like a little teeny.

Well tonight I'm afraid I have to say that I broke that record. At the age of fifty-one I finally flipped my lid.

As the man strolled impromptu onto his hometown stage I swear the entire place went completely stark raving mad. Myself no more or no less than anybody else. Paul's arrival was, you see, totally unannounced and unexpected. Nobody dared even dream that another Beatle would lend their royal seal of approval to the occasion. By way of some sort of explanation, we Scousers are simply not a presumptuous breed. Very fucking demanding yes. But honestly we expect fuck all. Tonight was no different. Yes we'd have all loved the man to show up but nobody suspected it for one minute.

Hence, the sheer unadulterated mania. It really is the only way to describe how we all reacted. Everybody was hugging and kissing each other as if a winning goal - touch down to you lot - had just been scored in an FA Cup Final - Superbowl to you fellas. Only on such rare high drama sporting occasions have I ever seen displays of sheer emotion to equal it. In front of us two old grannies - and I mean grannies in their eighties - were jumping up and down with unbounded joy and exhilaration. After embracing my wife and sister I hopped over the back of their seats to join the jig of delight with the two old dears. The rapture continued for what must have been fully three minutes before the more sensible ones amongst us managed somehow to restore some order so a clearly overwhelmed Paul McCartney could speak.

He proceeded to tell us of his life in the land of submarines and the town where he was born. How he and George were the first Beatles to meet. From Ardwick Road, Speke they used to get the number 82 bus - cue thunderous cheers of recognition from the many thousands of 82 bus drivers who had somehow managed to get tickets for the show [joke btw] - into Liverpool. He was clearly finding it difficult to talk and said he would sing instead.

Unaccompanied he and us sang "Yesterday" with the lyrics modified for George. For the first verse some of us quietly clapped the beat to help him out as he was clearly finding it difficult with all the emotion. For the next verse and middle eight we sang with him. For the final bits he then motioned us to sing without him. Which we did. As sweetly as three thousand Scousers ever could. It was sublime. Never better. Not even back in 1965 I'm sure. We could all have been in his front parlour in Speke.

Incidentally, I apologise for no mention of The Band. But I'm sure Richard and Rick will have loved the show. Especially that last bit. They were in the 'gods' I understand. With John and George. Finest seats in the house.


Posted on Mon Feb 25 02:26:33 CET 2002 from 1cust148.tnt25.tco2.da.uu.net (67.200.184.148)

br

From: va

This afternoon while driving home from Baltimore, I listened to American Routes on the radio. One of the topics for discussion was visual music. Although the commentator concentrated on gospel music I find very little music more discriptive than that of the Bands. Everytime I hear "Rags and Bones" I not only see a picture but hear the sounds created by the lyrics.

Trolley car rings out the morning

Whistle blows at noon.

A cat fight breaks open the night

While watch dogs bay at the moon

A preacher on an orange crate

With a Salvation Army Band

And clicking along the cobbled stones

That's the sound of the ice cream man

It is my opionion that very few songs can top this one when it comes to visualizing and actually hearing the lyrics of a song.

BR


Posted on Mon Feb 25 02:24:36 CET 2002 from spider-tp074.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.209)

butch

From: burnt barnville

those of us that witnessed Levon, The Barn Burners & Jimmy Vivino on Saturday night, in chester , ny,, know what THEY saw,,,,

one of those magic nights,,,

friday,, the BarnBurners played a hard-charging set of Low Down Dirty Blues, as a quartet,,

but

sat night was one for the books,,, truly magic,,,,,,,


Posted on Mon Feb 25 01:47:25 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-002ilurbap031.dialsprint.net (158.252.113.143)

Susan

More thoughts on Rockin' Chair.

What is the relationship of the Band's "Rockin' Chair" to the Hoagy Carmichael song of the same title? It's clear that the one inspired the other; the last line cried in performance "I believe old rocking chair's got me, " makes that plain. Both are narrated by aged persons contemplating the final trajectory of their lives. Yet they are very different songs; I'm not really sure how "I believe old rocking chair's got me" fits the rest of the Band song. - why this strong reference here.

I have the HC song in Maria Muldaur's version on her album Sweet Harmony. It's slow and sultry in both meanings. An elderly woman, or at least a woman who needs a cane, is sitting, probably on a front porch. There's a child around to fetch gin, possibly for that quintessential summer drink the gin and tonic. She seems to be longing for death, asking her 'dear old aunt Harriet" to send a 'sweet chariot', a reference to yet another song 'Swing Low, Sweet Chariot". Yet the music and performance don't sound at all like a wish for death. It conjures lazy summer images, slow and sleepy, but not sad at all.

The Band's 'Rockin' Chair' seems on the surface a similar song; an old sailor wants to spend his last years at home, doing nothing in particular. If you just listen to the music and bits of the words here and there you might thing that's what the song is. But a more detailed look at the lyrics shows a man and his friend who won't make it back home.

Now, can someone explain to me just what the last line of the Band song does to the rest of the song. Why invoke the Hoagy Carmichael song so directly?


Posted on Sun Feb 24 23:59:56 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp68537.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.185.156)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

Hungry for goals
Orr....was poetry on ice....wishing the world could see poetry on ice again....off side
CAPTAIN MARIO LEMIEUX....CBC....HOCKEY NIGHT IN CANADA....CANADIAN SPORT AND PASSION
KARIYA....speedster and sniper....he is even able to skate with a stick in his skate.......
Emotional game....Eager to bring home gold medal after 50 years.....
Yessssss! Iginla!!!....next generation of Canadian hockey players!.....Yzerman....

I was extremely happy for Mario Lemieux....struggled through a disease which cut his career short and then miraculously recovered.....BACK ON THE ICE YEARNING TO RECLAIM THE GOLD MEDAL FOR CANADA....

Stompin' Tom Connors and Tragically Hip....THE HOCKEY SONG!.....Joni Mitchell....River...."I wish I had a river I could SKATE away on"....Joni Mitchell....Raised On Robbery...."Glued to that damn HOCKEY game".....Thank You Robbie Robertson and The Red Road Ensemble and all the Native Chiefs for your blessings!


Posted on Sun Feb 24 22:56:51 CET 2002 from (63.143.92.254)

Pete Rivard

From: Hastings, MN

Having lived South of the Mason Dixon line for four years (Houston, TX), I would occasionally see a bumper sticker proclaiming "Dumb white trash--and proud of it!"

One of my bandmates, and a local journalist, stated his view that the average Southerner was in equal parts both proud and ashamed of his heritage.

Listening to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down" with this statement in mind gives the lyric line a certain flavor.

While on the topic of the Civil War, I've lately discovered a writer by the name of Owen Parry who churns out highly readable period whodunits featuring Abel Jones, a Welsh immigrant and veteran of the India Mutiny, who is sucked into the War Between the States, is wounded at Bull Run, and finds himself detailed to various unsavory situations needing a solution. Anyone else stumble across this guy?


Posted on Sun Feb 24 21:14:23 CET 2002 from spider-wn043.proxy.aol.com (205.188.197.168)

Pac (woman)

From: SF

Hi everyone! Just scanned the most recent Guestbook entries and am sorry to have missed the GP/Burritos discussion. Over Christmas break I read the "Hickory Wind" bio on GP, followed by Pamela DesBarres' groupie book, "I'm With the Band." Highly recommend both! Have been listening to all the GP CDs with a much-deepened apreciation. Didn't even realize that there's a second CD release of "Sweetheart of the Rodeo" with Gram's voicetracks mixed back in [legal issues resolved], plus many lost recordings. Then this week Spring arrived in full song, along with the final concert of the "Down From the Mountain" tour. My god, did anyone see it???!!! Emmylou's solo of "Love Hurts" was all the more painful without GP's or anyone's accompaniment, but "Blue Kentucky Girl" with the White Sisters' true blue mountain harmonies and great old timey instrumental backups brought tears to our eyes. Ralph Stanley sent chills up the spine. Alison Krauss and her brilliant Union Station band kept the intimate jam feeling going. Patty Loveless was the biggest surprise of all -- turns out she grew up in a very poor coal mining town and lost her dad and grandfather both to black lung disease. Like dear Rick Danko, the music just rippled through her ever-moving body as she sang and listened. Her ballad about never getting out of Harlan County alive is powerful! Throughout the night, different musicians mixed and mingled onstage, each sharing with us the sadness of it being the final show and their love for each other that was so evident with every in-joke and hug. The microphones were those old RCA silver ice cream bar kinds, adding to the feeling of the Grand Ol' Opry on a Saturday night. Small theatre; perfect sound mix. We were treated time and time again to the sweetest harmonies by varying trios of women artists. Never saw Emmylou smile so brightly and have such joyful eye contact with fellow performers. Absolute perfection. Dobro lovers must check out Jerry Douglas! Norman Blake's guitar was like a warm blanket, intricately woven but soft and subtle. What a night. One of the best! Sorry if any of this is old news [too many pages of archives to scan through]. Rumor has it there'll be a second lengthy tour starting this summer. Don't miss them! And to those of you on the east coast, yes, it was a mild winter, and the songbirds thrived. Soon you'll be waking to their deafening chatter. Enjoy! Love to all. And Crabbie, you're the greatest!


Posted on Sun Feb 24 19:58:52 CET 2002 from spider-tp044.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.194)

Donna

From: PA

I have to agree with Crabgrass, Judy Collins' rendition of Leonard Cohen's "Suzanne" is so hauntingly beautiful. When I lived in Virginia, there was a lake we all would go fishing and built campfires after dusk. I remember sitting there watching the sun go down, listening to the rushing of the water as the boats passed by, I would have that song in my head. It is where a song takes you, and that song always brings me back to that lake in Virginia.

Suzanne takes you down to a place by the river

You can hear the boats go by

You can spend the night forever

And you know that she's half crazy

That's why you want to be there

And she feeds you tea and oranges

That come all the way from China

And just when you want to tell her

that you have no love to give her

She gets you on her wave lenght

And lets the river answer

That you've always been her lover

And you want to travel with her

And you want to travel blind

And you think you maybe trust her

For she touched your perfect body with her mind



Posted on Sun Feb 24 19:56:01 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-249.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.249)

Amanda

I too am a big fan of the "Dixie" article by Peter Viney. I have refered to it more than once to help myself put into perspective the mixed emotions I feel for the Confederacy.

"Rockin' Chair" is so metaphorical that it could mean so many things to different people. I like to think that Robbie got his inspiration from meeting Sonny Boy Williamson and Muddy Waters and any other aging musicians that he was fortunate enough to get to know. When The Band had the encounter with Sonny Boy in Helena...Sonny Boy was up there in age and still living hard with liquor, wild women and such...still into that juke joint jumpin' kind of lifestyle. Maybe Robbie sensed that Sonny Boy or himself or anyone else couldn't ride the waves on those seven seas forever...that eventually that lifestyle would send you crashing to shore. I think what is beautiful about the song and Robbie's perception of life is that no matter where you roam it always feels good to put your foot back on the ground...the ground that is familiar and that means home to you. Just like Sonny Boy always came back to Helena. No matter how silly the people or conversations seemed to you as a young man/woman...they are somehow the sweetest things to have in your twilight years. The love for childhood friends...we never get over that. I know that the Mississippi River and Arkansas are a long way from the sea and Virginny. Robbie is such an inspired writer...I can easily see how he could find a relationship between both worlds.

God Bless Garth!


Posted on Sun Feb 24 19:39:10 CET 2002 from du-tele3-163.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.163)

Peter Viney

She queued four hours in pissing rain and didn’t get a ticket so my honour is intact – I will not after all be seeing Sir Cliff! Good. They gave out numbers to the queue. She got # 625. It's a 3000 seat hall. They allowed 6 tickets per head. Those at the front who’d invested 3 days got 12 between a pair. They sell for £150 on the internet, I’m told. But not to us. So … (a) why doesn’t he charge more rather than let the scalpers make a killing? (b) with that many people, why not restrict to two per head? The rest all end up with scalpers. Twas ever thus.

Listening to that Glen Campbell 12 string guitar instrumental album again. What’s the connection between ‘Dark As The Dungeon’ (Merle Travis) and ‘Hickory Wind’ (Gram Parsons-B. Buchanan)? Because the tunes are on the extremely similar side of similar. I’d never heard of the Merle Travis one before, and coincidentally Emmylou’s version of “Hickory Wind” was on the radio on Friday. I think Hickory wind is an improvement, BTW. But is it a lift?


Posted on Sun Feb 24 18:34:02 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tj031.proxy.aol.com (64.12.106.31)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

JTull: Reading your post that mentions the death of animator Chuck Jones in the same paragraph as words about the "blood or mud" discussion reminds me of the rare Bugs Bunny version of "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down." Though old Bugs' interpretation of the song was nothing like the mangled mess of the Baez hit single, the pesky wabbit clearly sings, "I swear by the FUDD below my feet..."

I guess that proves that there was connection between Chuck Jones and The Band after all!


Posted on Sun Feb 24 18:11:37 CET 2002 from intern2.wdse.org (131.212.19.41)

Marsen

From: N. Minnesota

Greetings to all here in this very active week in the GB! I just got back from a week in sunny Florida, and am now facing the stark reality of a grey and snowy Minnesota morning. Spent last night warding off post-vacation depression by spinning ROA and indulging in some home "remedies". Sure enjoyed reading the last week's posts, and killed off quite a bit of time at work in the process. I must say this site really makes the time fly while "working". It seems theres always something new to explore here, and just when you think you've seen it all, you stumble on to a goldmine. I echo Alan Edge's sentiments on Peter Viney's articles, and must have spent a week reading them when I discovered them,(not to mention Alan's great postings which are in a league of their own). Count my vote in, as one who would like to see Peter V. anaylize "Rockin' Chair", one of my all time faves. I think Susan has a pretty good take on it, and it's fun to see what others "hear". Good to hear more praise for the remastered ROA disc 2, which is tops on my list lately, just can't get enough, and it hasn't gotten old yet. In Florida while driving from Tampa to The Atlantic coast, we drove through a very crowded Orlando. My wife wanted to drive through Winter Park, I did not. We settled for a stop at a gas station off the interstate, on the edge of town. I diddnt have the morbid curiosity some may have, but was overcome with a very uncomfortable feeling while filling my gas tank, and I just had to get the hell out of there. Heck, if it was any other famous event that happened there, I'd probally go check it out, but when it's your all-time musical hero it's a very different story. I decided to try and forget that place, and got back on the Interstate. Lastly, Im sorry if I offended any Die-hard banjo enthusiastics by calling Pete Seeger the "Guru" of the banjo. I understand he may not be the most technicaly proficent player(like Roy Clark or Earl Scruggs...by the way, my favorite banjo tune has to be "Foggy Mountain Breakdown" with him and Lester) but when I think of Pete Seeger,I immediately think of a banjo. And, in his own genre his music has stood the test of time, and as someone else said, he's still out there playin'. Sorry if I'm unearthing the Seeger thread many were happy to see go, and again believe me, I haven't dusted off a Seeger album in years..................


Posted on Sun Feb 24 12:44:11 CET 2002 from (64.80.240.14)

Diamond Lil

Many thanks to Richard Wall (hi!) and Phil (hi!) and everyone else who posted about the Bottom Line show on Friday night. I would've given a limb to be there, but family obligations had to come first. I was, in fact, very disappointed that I missed it.

I wanted to say that it's so nice to read such nice words about Aaron in some of the latest posts. He's really been amazing in not only his performances, but in his wonderful way of not letting The Band.. or Rick.. be forgotten. So I just wanted to say 'thanks' to him.. for everything.

As some of you may already know, my beloved green car is now my dearly departed green car. Thankfully, there were no guestbookers in the trunk when it crashed. It's been replaced by a new, Burgandy car, which speeds and taligates just as well as the other one did :-) Hopefully it'll also bring me as many nice memories........

Have a good day everyone. Hug Jan.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 09:58:13 CET 2002 from du-tele3-001.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.1)

Peter Viney

Alan’s piece is one to add to the articles section of the site. Great. And Susan added some excellent comments on Rockin’ Chair. What with the reviews of Garth, this has probably been the most Band-focussed weekend in ages!

Which is why I’ll go aside to explain the most embarrassing moment of my life which is non-Band material. My wife’s sister is inordinately fond of Cliff Richard, as some people are (and it’s not a crime. It doesn’t make you a bad person), and my wife decided that a couple of tickets for his local November show would make an excellent birthday present. And liking Cliff makes birthdays and Christmases easy as there’s always a new album and video for each one, as there have been for 40 years. She discovered that tickets went on sale today at 8 a.m. Then we heard that people had been camping in the concert hall car park since last Thursday to get tickets. Undaunted we set the alarm for 7 a.m. ON A SUNDAY MORNING. I offered to drive her to the hall to save time parking. So at 7.15 a.m. we approached the hall to see a queue snaking right round the building and up the cliff (it’s located near the beach, so up “the” cliff, not “up Cliff”). “Well, as long as no one sees me,” I grumbled. Then we came round the corner to the theatre entrance where a line of cars were dropping off people to join the queue. I slowed to let her out and realized I was staring straight into a TV camera mounted on the pavement, filming the sad loonies who were up early to buy tickets for the unaged toothy clean-living evangelical knight. I tried to reach into the back seat for my floppy Van Morrison-style black hat to conceal my face, but I could see that little green light glowing above the lens. So what do you do? Storm over and demand that they do not use your image without permission? But that’s just a bigger laugh for the TV team. Hope the sun was reflecting on the windscreen? But I always knew that the mild vanity of a (slightly) personalized registration plate would be my come-uppance one day. So, I left my wife to the queue. I wound down the window as I passed the news team and croaked, ‘They’re not for us. They’re for her sister. Honest.’ But no one believed me. Or cared. So I got back home and made myself a cup of tea. Then I just phoned her on the mobile, ‘Sod it. My reputation is in total shreds. Buy four tickets. After all this trouble we might as well see the bastard ourselves.” Well, I didn’t say ‘bastard’ I said the word that is on the BBC’s offensive words list at number one.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 09:13:09 CET 2002 from rneray.ne.mediaone.net (65.96.234.100)

WheelOnFire

From: New England (+ Canada)

Saw both sets at The Bottom Line last night -- and I felt as if I was in another dimension for a couple of hours.

Garth was conjuring up spirits with his organ playing (plus some heart-rending sax and accordion), Professor Louie’s (Aaron Hurwitz) singing was in fine New Orleans form and his orchestration was a joy to hear and behold (his piano and accordion playing were also pretty sweet), the horn players led by Tom Malone were soaring (just think of the horn parts in “Life is a Carnival” and “Ophelia”, for example), “Miss Marie” was hot (and added that hot gospel mix to the vocals), the fiddle player (Larry Packer) was right there whenever Aaron pointed him towards the solo, Buddy Cage on pedal steel was studied and tasteful, the drummer (Gary Burke) was solid (as were the bass player and rhythm guitarist) … and we all just flew with them in this timeless musical paradise for the evening.

Here’s the “official” set list as it was written down for the band (the encores were different in each set, and I didn’t write those down):

1. Don’t Wait
2. Twilight
3. Ophelia
4. Forever Young
5. Carnival
6. Blind Willie McTell
7. Next Time U C Me
8. The Weight
9. Mr. Luck
10. Shape I’m In
11. Tired of the Blues
12. Makes No Difference
13. Last Train Out
14. Chest Fever
15. Scarlet Begonias
16. Cripple Creek

A very sincere and heartfelt thanks to everyone who made this show happen.

… and special thanks to Lil for pointing me in the right direction when, last Saturday night in the chat room next door, I innocently asked her if she knew where I could hear Garth play.

-- Phil


Posted on Sun Feb 24 06:29:56 CET 2002 from 1cust74.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.74)

Jeffrey

Okay Professor Louie! Did you tape the show? I know a few folks who would pay top dollar for it I'm sure! Is this going to be Garths next release?


Posted on Sun Feb 24 06:13:12 CET 2002 from spider-te031.proxy.aol.com (152.163.195.186)

Rich

From: Rhinebeck, NY

Fabulous show at the Bottom Line last night, at least the late show was. Can't help but wonder how many more times we'll get to see a set like this played live again, but it was the best $22.50 I've ever spent, believe me. Professor Louie deserves a lot of credit for carrying the torch.

Did anyone else notice that Garth seems to have lost a lot of weight? He didn't look unhealthy, and definitely seemed to be into the whole experience, but I wonder if all the financial stress has taken a toll.

I doubt the economics of an 11-piece outfit of world class musicians in a half (maybe two-thirds?) filled club will make this an ongoing thing, but if it ever happens again, run, don't walk. It was more than I expected, and I expected a lot. I'm still singing Young Blood 24 hours later. Can't get it out of my mind. Wow.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 06:05:01 CET 2002 from 209-239-210-142.oak.jps.net (209.239.210.142)

Phil

Turn the stern and point to shore - these seven seas won't carry us no more... what a beautiful lyric. Probably got the idea from PH's A Salty Dog.....just kidding.... Turn the stern... I love it. Only RR can pull off stuff this great.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 05:01:47 CET 2002 from spider-ti013.proxy.aol.com (152.163.194.178)

Dave Z

From: Chaska, MN

Thanks for the posts on the Garth Band show... you lucky dogs... Good to see Pete R back again... I can't hang out with the Road Warriors here... so I go catch Pete's band whenever he reunions in Hastings... Good stuff, good people... and his banjo on Downtown Train always gives me the shivers... We are still fighting recurring colds here... and the best remedy has been holing up on the couch under the blanket with the twins watching a new DVD I just got... Gord in Reno... Today we watched Levon on TNT... Fire Down Below... my little drummer boy actually recognized him... my other little keyboard boy was whining "I'm wanta watch Indian videos"... meaning RR soundtracks... I had to separate them when things escalated into... "he's touching me"... great movie, though... I didn't realize all the stars in that movie... musically too...


Posted on Sun Feb 24 05:01:14 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-002ilurbap320.dialsprint.net (158.252.112.226)

Susan

Serendipitously, the accompaniment for my walk today was the 2nd disk of the remastered Rock of Ages, with a particularly fine live version of Rockin' Chair. I listened to it twice, and got to thinking about what is really going on in the song. I've always vaguely thought that the narrator is talking to his friend Willie, who is on this ship with him, and that Levon is singing Willie's part. This does not really hold up in a close look at the lyrics.

It starts " Hang around, Willie, boy. Don't you raise the sails any more This suggests that everybody's on land, and the narrator does not want Willie to set sail. The narrator (I'll call him N) wants to go home to Virginny, and take Willie with him.

But the second verse sets a different scene. They are at sea, and Willie's working hard; N wants to 'Turn the stern and point to shore" Now this is a fine idea, but how they are going to do it without raising sail I don't know. Those sails in the first verse must be metaphorical sails; perhaps Willie wants to keep on, and N is trying to persuade him to head for home.

The third verse gets really confusing. In a wonderfully abstruse way it suggests that there's some danger, since N sees or hears the Flying Dutchman on the reef, a bad omen. N thinks they've used up all their time; are they going to die in a storm at sea? Yet "This hill's too steep to climb". Is this a metaphorical hill, or a big wave?

The next line is poignant; N has been longing to be home to 'sooth away the rest of our years', yet now 'The days that remain ain't worth a dime" I take this to mean they won't have those days of peace and reverie; it's all ending here and now.

Then one more chorus, but the verb changes. Instead of we're gonna it's would'a . The big rockin' chair won't go nowhere, and neither will Willie and N.

The cry "I believe old rockin' chair's got me" brings to mind the Hoagy Carmichael song. I'd not heard it in years, but remembered I had Maria Muldaur's version on vinyl. That's a song about ageing and dying as well, but in that song the narrator seems to be haveing that peaceful, homely end that Willie and N don't get.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 04:41:10 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ti041.proxy.aol.com (64.12.101.166)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

Tried to post this earlier today but got locked up: We lost another one. I know this is non-Band and even non-music related, but Chuck Jones left us today at 89. Mr. Jones was one of the premier animators and directors behind Warner Borther's Looney Tunes, AKA Bugs Bunny, Daffy Duck, road Runner, etc. Many thanks for making my world a happier one filled with smiles and laughter. What a gift you shared with us! MUD/BLOOD: I Think Dixie is more ....I don't know...but 'blood' resonates more emotionaly. As a former Civial War guide for the U.S. Nat's Park Service (Chancellorsville, Stonewall Jackson's mortal wounding) I can tell you that 'blood' is historically accurate and defensable as a lyric. As a Chesterfield County, VA (bordering Richmond to the south, and the place where Chesterfield Cigarrettes get their name)resident who recently struggled to plant a fan palm tree, I can tell you that 'mud' is also historically accurate. Certain Virginia soils have a quality that allows thaem to absorb infinite amounts of rain and water, only to become muddier and heavier. it is truly a phenomenom. Historically, search the web for Civil War General Ambrose Burnsides famous 'mud march' around Fredericksburg, Va, in early 1863. The Union soldiers were literally marching with their feet caked in pounds of sticky Virginia mud, much to their misery. So either blood or mud are historically accurate.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 04:17:00 CET 2002 from 1cust248.tnt38.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.86.248)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Judy Collins' beautiful rendition of Cohen's "Suzanne" is one of the great classic '60s "Folk Songs" which I never tire of hearing. The guitar work is particularly exquisite. I've never heard another version (and don't really care to) except for Cohen's own which is not as good in my opinion as his singing is always dreary and depressing. Collins, however, lifts the song to new heights.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 00:55:33 CET 2002 from 0-1pool35-39.nas1.cincinnati1.oh.us.da.qwest.net (63.232.35.39)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

Our brand new computer crashed on Monday, and so I have missed many threads here.

Someone mentioned Steve Forbert and I asked my husband if he had ever heard of him and it turns out he has an album of his so I played it today. (Sorry Lil about the run-on and any to follow.) But I couldn't locate the song or songs about Rick on his website. Can anyone help me here?

Also regarding writing credits and Ry Cooder, I got out my Little Village CD (Little Village=Ry Cooder, John Hiatt, Jim Keltner and Nick Lowe--a pretty good line-up, eh?) Every song is credited to all the guys. It is a good little CD with a sort of eco-justice song (Do You Want My Job?), a funny, sexy eco-themed song which there should be more of is this world (Solar Sex Panel)and one of those hot car/hot girl songs (She Runs Hot) at which I should maybe be offended but always love (esp. Ramrod by Bruce). Plus one song mentions Eagle Rock, the part of LA where I grew up--a part that does not have the zip code 90210, but isn't dangerous enough to make the news too often so almost nobody has ever heard of it. (It sticks up between Glendale and Pasadena.)

I liked the list of good things out of Canada, except for Leonard Cohen. I know he has some fans here and I don't want to step on any toes, but way too many people warble away on that song Suzanne about the girl who is so fascinating because she is half nuts and buys overpriced oranges. Maybe I am missing his genius, and I don't know too many of his other songs, but I would be happy never to hear Suzanne again.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 00:33:57 CET 2002 from (63.143.93.254)

Pete Rivard

From: Hastings, MN

Damn, Al. Welcome to the Guestbook.


Posted on Sun Feb 24 00:03:14 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Al Edge

From: Liverpool

BAND REFLECTIONS

This website really is like discovering buried treasure for someone like me. You take one of those nifty little gardening trowels from the shed, then you keep daintily burrowing away like a determined little jack rabbit and hey presto - precious little gems await you.

Just finished trawling through the analysis of 'The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down' and 'Unfaithful Servant'. Now this has probably been said many times before - and if it hasn't then it damned well should have been - but take a bow Peter Viney for your truly exquisite and lovingly crafted expositions of these wonderful songs of The Band.

These two in particular have been delights.

A tribute also while I'm at it to so many of the other regulars on here, notably I seem to recall Pat Bennett, Amanda and David Powell for their contributions to the 'Dixie' debate. It is fitting that Peter has woven your impassioned and informed views so painstakingly into his synopsis on a piece of music that is so dear to all our hearts. Having been an avid regular on some football [soccer] forums that themselves have hosted extremely credible football - and broader - debates I have to say, on the evidence I have seen, the standard of debate on this Forum is second to none.

The one on 'Dixie' seems, however, to have been quite exceptional. The song seems to have touched so many people so profoundly. I only wish I could have been around at the time of the debate. I would have loved to have been a part of it. Certainly it has made me reflect on when I heard the song for the first time and just what it was I felt back then.

I purchased the single 'Cripple Creek' on its black Capitol label from Myerscough's record shop in South Road, Liverpool when it was released in '69. When I got home and played it in the solitude of my tiny boxroom I can recall thinking to myself - "yeah, not bad, maybe not quite as good as 'The Weight' but you'll do for me boys...probably grow on me, anyroad."

Then I turned the disc over and played the song on the flipside. The one with the title that seemed as if it must be too lengthy and cumbersome to fit into a conventional pop song.

How right I was. As it crackled and soared out of my Dansette, I was stunned.

Now this wasn't in that typical 'bowl me over' way that you got with the likes of 'Heard it Through the Grapevine' or 'Like a Rolling Stone' or 'Brown Sugar' or stuff like that. Rather it was in a far more subtle way. A unique way, in fact. I found myself thinking along the lines of "now listen here fellas, you simply CANNOT do a song like this... nobody can…it's just not the way these things are done".

For a start it was all too sober and sobering; too profound and historical. Too precise and too perfect, even. And yet, at the same time, it was also so completely fucking outrageous - in a reverse way to rock 'n' roll's usual outrageousness, of course. In this instance, you simply felt it was outrageous that a young rock group could actually come up with a song and a sound so mature; so battle hardened and weary as these guys had somehow managed to do with 'Dixie'. Sure 'Big Pink' had kind of prepared us for it. Softened us up a mite. But it had not quite prepared us enough to expect this level of accomplishment. Why it was almost verging on the classical in its execution.

More than anything else, it really did sound like the men singing it had just trooped away from the horrors of Gettysberg or some other nightmare. These were guys that were staking their testimony as to what had actually happened; to what they had actually witnessed happening. Listening to their story as they chewed on their tobacco was a hundred times more authentic than if you'd watched a score of films or documentaries on the subject. You could sense their angst; feel their weariness; share their pain.

And, of course, when the LP came out and you saw that brown sepia cover, you just knew your hunch had been proved right. These guys WERE indeed straight off that famous battlefield.

Reflecting now on my subsequent absorption into The Band's music I can see what must have actually transpired in my own case. What 'Dixie' did along with those other flawless songs on 'The Band' album - but undoubtedly more so than any of those others - was to form for me a complete whole with the songs of the preceding 'Big Pink' album. It brought a symmetry to the proceedings. It made the connection, affording me the opportunity to begin to understand - instinctively most certainly not consciously as far as I was concerned - the statement these fellows were trying to make. That message was not so much a lien to preaching but merely to telling it the way it was. The way it had always been. The way they had been told it. They were relaying their heritage and, I suppose more to the point, what they, themselves, stood for.

Sure, on their own, that first clutch of songs on 'Big Pink' had been something truly wondrous. The sheer togetherness and democracy of the sound had pulled you in and wrapped itself around you with its warmth and humour, its candour and its mystery. Its almost cavernous looseness had lent you the space to find your way into the songs alongside these master craftsmen. Paradoxically, their unparalleled tightness had made you gasp in awe. No feeler gauge in existence could ever get between these fellows.

Then there were the voices, of course. These truly were dead ringers for something like you ain't ever seen…or heard. Why old Jed Clampett himself sounded positively Queen's English in comparison to these fellows. The thing was, you never knew whose wails were who's. The rot gut moonshine lead of one. The proverbial country cousin drawls of two or three others. Then they would all melt into one. Then another would suddenly appear from round the corner like some friendly neighbour dropping in. Then yet another would pop up his head as if through some hatch from underneath the floorboards with some throwaway back-up line. At times it was as if half the neighbourhood were chiming in and out. You simply couldn't keep track.

It was great fun to try, though.

Bottom line was, 'who cared if it said on the album sleeve notes that these fellows were from Ontario?' As far as their "you've got to keep the engine churnin" inflection evidenced, these guys were country bumpkin American. Pure and simple.

Yet, as the more delicately crafted delights of 'The Band' unfolded, the full picture started to emerge. Gradually, it all became that bit clearer. Piece by piece, you got to know from just where all that homeliness and sense of community you had felt with 'Big Pink' had originated. Precisely why it had all sounded so authentic and so real. The fact was The Band were actually offering you a thick slice of American life and a huge dollop of American culture and history. You never quite understood it all but one thing was for sure. You were on pretty safe ground with these boys. They were not out to dupe you. What you were seeing and hearing was very much what you were getting. And that in a nutshell was an America that for quite some time had been obscured by events elsewhere. Events that had taken everybody else's eye off the ball. Except, of course, these lovely fellows.

In my own case it was an America I knew very little about. These were not just the Davy Crockett or Buffalo Bill Cody characterisations with which I was so familiar. This was not simply Mississippi riverboats and lonesome tumbleweed blowing through some Wild West ghost town. We weren't just picking bales of cotton or hunting bison here. Nor was it simply all that wonderful American popular music either. Sure there were snatches of all of these. With The Band, though, there was much much more besides.

For this, rather, was the whole deal. In other words, this was about the ordinary folks, the ordinary places, the ordinary music. This was the ordinary everyday things. Not just the celluloid heroes, the glamorous settings and such like and so forth. Sure they had their place too. They were all part of the same American melting pot. The Band's take, however, was the real deal - the America that lies within the heart and soul of every American. That sense of identity that must only come when a people come together in the way Americans have. Not so much a patriotism but more of an extended community. It is a rare commodity, indeed. Perhaps it is unique to America. Certainly we in Britain do not have it. Sure there exists a patriotism but nothing like this extended American neighbourhood. That American feel.

The Band's second album in tandem with their first - and in particular with the haunting and brutal honesty of 'Dixie' - managed to capture vital strains of that feel; much of the essential spirit of that broad American community. It made outsiders such as myself feel as if we could connect with it, too. Quite what it must have done to native Americans I can scarcely imagine - though clearly the delicious irony of the Band's achievement has not been lost on Jaime Robbie Robertson in the intervening years as he has sought to make reparations to natives even more indigenous.

Whether the boys in The Band set out with such an impossible target in mind must remain uncertain. Sure people who are blessed from the heavens with such talent as they possessed would have harboured high artistic ideals. Inevitably, too, they were always going to retain an integrity consistent with those ideals. To entertain the notion that they were going all out to capture the very soul of their [four fifths] adopted homeland on vinyl is probably stretching credibility. Personally, I feel they probably just did their darnedest to be true to the gifts that had been bestowed upon them. The fact that their best was enough to create two monuments to their country to rank with any other in history is simply Americans' good fortune.

And the rest of us too, of course.

POSTSCRIPT

Returning to the subject of the song 'Dixie' itself, it was particularly illuminating within the debate that the ground beneath the boys feet figured so strongly. The actual debate centred on whether Robbie wrote "I swear by the 'blood' - or the 'mud' - below my feet".

Now, I suppose like most others I have always sung "blood". Not only is that what I would have sworn Levon sings but anything else would seem like a sacrilege.

And yet would it? In the context of what I've been trying to say in this piece about the entire thrust of what The Band were about at this stage of their career - i.e. quietly yet joyously proclaiming America's heritage - the use of the word "mud" now actually seems to make perfect sense. As a metaphor for the very lifeblood of any poor farmer the ground - or in Virgil's case the mud - below your feet ranks pretty high on the list.

Woody Guthrie in that great celebratory national anthem of his for the ordinary American chose the power of the term "your land" to convey what he felt about the very spirit of his country. Is not The River Mississippi too - itself a crucial part of America's metaphorical lifeblood - the Big Muddy. For me either term - 'mud' or 'blood' is perfectly congruous and, I must say, I AM beginning to be swayed towards "mud". It will, however, always remain a moot point I feel.

One lyric in the song that has always leapt out at me is where Virgil almost rues that "you can't raise a Kane back up when he's in defeat". Some in the debate felt this to be incongruous with the almost defiant sub-text of the narrative - i.e. that spirit of Dixie rising up again.

I can understand such a view. I would have the same feelings regarding we 'Scousers' - Liverpudlians - rising up in similar circumstances. I daresay any downtrodden folk can sometimes feel that way. Personally, however, I have always seen this line as a key one in the song. To me it represents the fragility and sheer human vulnerability that even a young Virgil can see is present in all of us. These Kanes are tough hombres. They have been through a lot. Bottom line is, however, they are only human. Mortal souls. They are nothing special. Fact is, of course, their very humanity makes them very special indeed. That line warms me to Virgil and his family more than any other in the song.

God, I love The Band, you know. What they created truly is immortal.


Posted on Sat Feb 23 23:54:45 CET 2002 from du-tele3-079.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.79)

Peter Viney

… but if enough people here add comments on "Rockin Chair" I'd be happy to do another "compilation job" on it.


Posted on Sat Feb 23 23:52:27 CET 2002 from du-tele3-079.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.79)

Peter Viney

Started on Rockin Chair a couple of times and never finished it. But I agree with Pete that it's pretty much what it says it is. As such it's masterly - the image "The Flying Dutchman's on the reef …" was singled out in the 1970 Time article, and I would rate it as one of Robbie's best lyrics, but I couldn't find much to add.

Robbie Robertson: "Most people are knocked out by younger people. I’m knocked out by older people. Just look at their eyes. Hear them talk. They’re not joking. They’ve seen things you’ll never see. "


Posted on Sat Feb 23 20:50:42 CET 2002 from (207.88.77.196)

tom bassett

From: orem, utah
Web page

this is great... maud is my 1st cousin, and I used to play with her and bruce as kids in Boise...I love The Band..Garth played for our christmas eve party once, I'll be forever grateful for that..the olympics are awesome here..I wish The Band could've played at the medals!


Posted on Sat Feb 23 20:05:19 CET 2002 from (63.143.92.254)

Pete Rivard

From: Hastings, MN

Just finished perusing the lyrics to "Rockin' Chair" and checking to see if Mr. Viney had pursued that one in an article. I have to conclude that the lyrics are just so straight forward that there's not much subtext to mine. I don't get an addiction layer in the lyrics at all.

I was startled to see "Dipin' snuff". I always heard that line as "If it's enough".

Anyway, there are several remarks buried in various articles regarding the Band's rejection of the "Don't trust anyone over 30" ethos of the 60's. I see Rockin' Chair as an artfully rendered imagining of what it must be like to have most of your life behind you, instead of ahead.

Does anyone suppose that this innate respect for their elders grew from the Band's inclusive and broad listening habits: Sonny Boy, Pop Staples, Bill Monroe, or just their general upbringing?


Posted on Sat Feb 23 18:39:09 CET 2002 from du-tele3-098.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.98)

Peter Viney

Nick- a question I’ve often thought about. If I were an executive producer of film music (it’s not too late – just e-mail me, Mr Speilberg, I can start tomorrow. Morning if you prefer. No need to send a car. I’ll get there under my own steam) I couldn’t think of anyone better than Garth, who worked on both TLW and Raging Bull with Robbie. I suspect that there are only two places to live if you want to do film music. London (UK)’s the second one but a long way behind. You have to be on the spot to get the commissions. That’s all I can think. I think Garth would do wonderful work – that NYC concert sounds wonderful too. I can think of several people in the British film business with great reputations who found the work dried up fast when they moved too far outside of London. With LA, I’d guess it’s even more so. On which, our GB contributors from California seem to have disappeared. No doubt a lot of the top ten film music guys live outside LA, but if you’re John Williams they come to you – the ability to blend Holst and Korngold is clearly valuable. If you’re not John Williams, you have to be on the scene – by which I mean living right around the corner rather than hanging out with the stars.

Good to See Pete Rivard’s post. If you’re Bela Fleck it’s not pretentious to play Bach on the banjo. If you believe in simplifying folk so that the masses can sing along, then proving you can knock off a bit of Bach too probably is.


Posted on Sat Feb 23 17:39:37 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tc062.proxy.aol.com (64.12.105.177)

Band Thought

From: New York

Friends,

What a terrific night of music last night in the friendly confines of Manhattan's Bottom Line. "A Night Of The Band Music with Garth Hudson" lived up to every expectation, and was extremely well organized and conducted by Professor Louie Horwitz. With a stellar cast that included Louie and the Crowmatix, the legendary Buddy Cage, Tom Malone and a kickin' horn section, Larry Packer and, of course, The Maestro Garth, the two hour show spanned the history of the The Band's studio work.

Beginning somewhat unassuming with a mid-tempo version of "Twilight," the 11-piece stage force was hitting the mark right from the beginning. During the opener, it brought back strong memories of Rick standing on the very same stage not all that long ago, solo with just guitar in hand. As Adam organized the evening (and he did so with a great knowledge of The Band's musical and personal history), it was obvious that he picked "Twilight" as the opener in honor of Rick. And it worked. I still miss Rick and his endless roadshows.

Although this description of the setlist is not in order, Adam cherrypicked gems from virtually every Band album: "The Weight" and "Chest Fever" from MFBP, "Up On Cripple Creek" from the Brown Album, "Shape I'm In" from SF, "Life Is A Carnival" from Cahoots, "It Makes No Difference" "Ophelia" and "Twilight" from the NLSC era, and the post '76 Band gems "Blind Willie McTell," "Forever Young," and "Don't Wait." It was pretty clear from the setlist that Adam, who handled the bulk of the vocals, has a vocal style similar to Levon's. The night also included a few Crow classics like "Next Time You See Me" (the band had an absolutely stellar drummer who did not miss a beat). One low light of the evening was the use of Buddy Cage, the terrific pedal steel player of "Panama Red," "Meet Me In The Morning," Great Speckeled Bird and New Riders fame. He had few and far between opportunities to show his stuff, but then, The Band's music was never really meant for pedal steel. Just the same, the few moments me had were worth the Weight. I spoke to Buddy after the show, and we laughed about the story where he wanted to kick Dylan's butt for chastizing him about how he was recording his pedal steel during the sessions for Blood On The Tracks.

And then there was Garth. Man, if this is the new Garth, bring on more. A whirlwind Genetic Method (prelude to Chest Fever) lasted a good 10-15 minutes. Band fans live for moments like these. As I am listening to Garth, I cannot believe that Robbie never has the urged to just pick up the guitar and play a gig or two a year; the music is so damn timeless and still has such life to it. But Garth was, as always, the subtle star of the show, horns and accordians included. It is pretty evident that he still has a great love for playing live, and having the opportunity to shake his hand and thank him after the show made me realize how strong his mitts still are - yes, Garth will be playing well into his 80's with that grip. We should all be so fortunate.

To suggest that the music of The Band has been silenced with the misfortunes of the past few years is absolutely not true. This night proved that The Band's music is alive and well and still kickin' with a bunch of Woodstock-based musicians. Now here is a very serious request. Adam, for all of The Band fans around the country, please, please - take this show on the road. Make this an annual kick-off event at The Bottom Line; I'm sure you can enlist musicians from all parts of the country to join the caravan in local cities. For a Band fan of 30 years, thanks for bringing the music to life (live) again. Great, great, stuff.

The music of our lives.

John from New York


Posted on Sat Feb 23 17:20:56 CET 2002 from sqd104.nirai.ne.jp (218.40.162.4)

Fred

I forgot to mention Old Dutch Potato Chips (salt & vinegar). MEA CULPA


Posted on Sat Feb 23 17:01:10 CET 2002 from dialup-65.58.191.36.dial1.stamford1.level3.net (65.58.191.36)

Richard Wall

Whew! Blistering show last night at the Bottom Line! The marquee read "Music of The Band featuring Garth Hudson." Aaron, Marie and the Crowmatix breathed new life into the classic songs. It was great to hear those horn charts played live again, so skillfully and with such passion. Everybody played an exhilarating set, especially Tom Malone, Larry Packer, Buddy Cage and Garth himself. I wish I could've stayed for the second set. I bet they're repairing the roofs at NYU this morning.

Bravo and thanks to everyone.


Posted on Sat Feb 23 16:58:23 CET 2002 from cranberry.cache.fi.jippii.net (195.197.160.12)

Kalervo

From: Finland

Mr Guerilla:I sometimes wrote that Gomez is one of the few bands these days which has things in common with the Band..Right... Yeah Travis is a fine band, too. But other bands too, which are using banjo in their music like the wonderful High Llamas....

Lil: I have not much empathy towards the hockey millionaires (how they managed to pass the doping tests??)but I really wish Canada will win, because I am, and many others are bit tired of American patrionism....Canadian treasures: How could you forget two of the greatest:Bruce Cockburn and k.d. lang!!!Or Glenn Gould..or...


Posted on Sat Feb 23 16:34:43 CET 2002 from spider-ti061.proxy.aol.com (152.163.194.201)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Peter = thanks for those Beatle bits. I'll have to see if I can find that issue here in Nu Yawk.

Paul could certainlly pull off those negro-like tunes couldn't he :-)


Posted on Sat Feb 23 12:18:41 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tc022.proxy.aol.com (64.12.105.157)

Nick

From: Virginia

Mr. Viney, Your post about The Beatles was great. Do you have any thoughts on my post about Garth?


Posted on Sat Feb 23 11:19:52 CET 2002 from du-tele3-152.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.152)

Peter Viney

Do pick up the magazine “NME Originals: The Beatles- The Complete Story” which is a compilation of New Musical Express cuttings from 1962 to 1970. A few choice bits (148 pages of more):

Paul McCartney: “We don’t like protest songs of course, because we’re not the preaching sort and in any case, we leave it to others to deliver messages of that kind.” (but no more on Pete Seeger)

From a December 1965 review of a Glasgow show: “Then it went straight into the belter, ‘She’s a Woman’. Paul on vocal, he almost screamed this negro-styled raver into the mic …’ (How language has changed!)

And one that never emerged on tape. NME in May 1965 describes an impromptu concert on the ‘Help’ film set. The Beatles were behind their equipment when a camera reload was called for, so they just played through the break for fun, performing It’s Not Unusual, Amor, How High The Moon, P.J. Proby’s ‘I Apologise’, Michael Row The Boat … then (quote) “John sang a rendition of Catch The Wind. Or was it The Times They are A Changing?”

(On Bob Dylan)”It was from the lips of John, Paul, George and Ringo that most of us who are now his fans learned his name.” (1965)


Posted on Sat Feb 23 10:32:26 CET 2002 from spider-wq074.proxy.aol.com (205.188.200.193)

Nick

From: Virginia

Does anyone know why Garth Hudson hasn't with Robbie Robertson since the mid-eighties? And if not, why? Garth's "Sea to the North" cd is fantastic! Surely with RR's hollywood contacts he could get the greatest keyboard player of all time (and friend) to produce a movie soundtrack. Does anyone know what's going on here?


Posted on Sat Feb 23 09:01:40 CET 2002 from c5300-2-ip202.albany.thebiz.net (216.238.225.202)

bea

From: a little gleam in my father's eye

CONGRATULATIONS TO NORWAY!!!

THE OLYMPIC GOLD MEDAL FOR CURLING!!!

YOU'RE THE BEST!!!


Posted on Sat Feb 23 06:44:54 CET 2002 from sqd104.nirai.ne.jp (218.40.162.4)

Fred

George Vecsey forgot: The Garden City (St. Catharines, Ontario), The Brier, Stompin' Tom Connors,the Welland Canal,the mighty Niagara River, the house my grandfather built on the corner of brown & Gordon st. in Westfort, the long since defunct Westfort Hurricanes, Alex Delvecchio, Banff & surrounding areas, Broadview Saskatchewan (only because the train forgot to stop there and had to back up) John Candy, toques, Fort William, Ontario (the jury's still out on Port Arthur, though). I could go on, but you know WE Canadians are a humble bunch.


Posted on Sat Feb 23 04:47:59 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

Stanley Landau

From: Toronto

Lil: I loved your post. Who even knew we had eight pin bowling?!


Posted on Sat Feb 23 02:22:00 CET 2002 from 64-80-55-193-static.surferz.net (64.80.55.193)

Lil Again

From: society for the abolition of run-on sentences

Hmmm...seems when one cuts and pastes, paragraphs tend to disappear. Sorry bout that. I have a headache trying to read my previous post.
Jan: Could you please paragraph it for me? Thanks. Hug :-)


Posted on Sat Feb 23 02:15:16 CET 2002 from modem749.netkonect.net (194.164.15.241)

Mr guerilla

From: London UK

On the banjo thing Travis received a lot of praise for their use of the instrument on their latest album and their favourite record is MFBP.

I have noticed there has been a bit of discussion on Ryan Adams, I have only heard it a couple of times but think it sounds pretty good. A contemporary group who I really like and who have some similarities to The Band are Gomez. They have three lead singers are a great live act and mix up their influences. They have a new album out soon but I strongly recommend their 1998 debut Bring it on and the follow up Liquid Skin. For me they are the pick of the current UK bands.

Finally I would like to know if anyone knows what the song Rocking Chair is about. I have always thought that it is the best song about addiction ever written. Is that just my screwed up take on it? Also hi to everyone, this site really is the best thing on the net and thanks to you all I learn something new nearly everytime I visit. I feel like I want to invite everyone to stay, sort of old family friends. I think that's Rick's influence. Sorry I'm tired and emotional, I'll er get my coat (love u Alan)


Posted on Sat Feb 23 02:09:27 CET 2002 from 64-80-55-193-static.surferz.net (64.80.55.193)

Diamond Lil

Saw this article in yesterday's NY Times. Thought some of you would appreciate reading it. Was pleasantly surprised to find The Band mentioned.

Now Canada Must Duck the Upset February 21, 2002 By GEORGE VECSEY WEST VALLEY CITY, Utah - IN this fabulous Olympic hockey tournament, there have been six or seven countries that swore, absolutely swore, they invented this sport, or at least purchased it, in the case of the United States. However, we worry for Canada. We worry a lot. Having expended so much national angst on Jamie Salé and David Pelletier, Canada then had to fight off the lurking suspicion that its figure skating officials were way over the top in lobbying for their skaters. Their women lost in curling to Britain yesterday. Britain! Now the nation must store up its psychic strength for hockey. Can't let your guard down. Not in this crowd. The Canadians managed to hold off Finland, 2-1, in a furious finish that was both skilled and nasty, and they must now play Belarus tomorrow. Common wisdom is that Belarus cannot possibly knock off two powers in a row after stunning Sweden, 4-3, yesterday in the biggest upset since 1980. But we all know how that works. Meanwhile, Russia outlasted the Czech Republic, 1-0, in a game as grueling as the conflict of 1968 between two countries, now defunct, that still reverberates in the No. 68 on Jaromir Jagr's jersey. Then came the United States, avoiding stupendous embarrassment against Germany, winning, 5-0. The Russians play the Yanks tomorrow on the 22nd anniversary of the huge upset in 1980. Those two teams are close enough that there can be no upset. But Canada will be skating on spring ice against Belarus, with the entire nation caught up in the result. Before yesterday I had a premonition of something horrible happening to a major democratic nation from the frozen north. I had envisioned bright Canadian red being stunned, but it turned out to be Swedish blue and yellow that went down right away. Still, there was such a sense of heightened expectations - gold or nothing - plus impending gloom and doom for Canada that I wanted to console my friends and neighbors in the true north strong and free. So I prepared a list of all the good things about Canada, so the folks up there could feel good about themselves just in case something bad happened. In no particular order, here are a bunch of reasons all of us will still love Canada, no matter what. 1. The anthem "O, Canada!" 2. Joni Mitchell, who wrote the lyric "Look at those jokers, glued to that damn hockey game." 3. Laura Secord puddings I used to bring home from Montreal back when there were big games. 4. Eh. 5. Whistler, British Columbia - especially downwind. 6. CBC. My wife, currently hanging out in Seattle, says the Winter Games are great on CBC. 7. The McGarrigle sisters. 8. Mordecai Richler. 9. Barbara Ingraham from Montreal, who taught me all about Lady Byng. 10. Al Arbour. If I were an athlete, I would have loved to play for him. 11. The Rocket. 12. The Pocket Rocket. 13. Cottages on the lake. 14. Dr. Ron Taylor. He could pitch, too. 15. Neil Young. 16. Baby Beluga in Stanley Park. 17. Margaret Atwood. 18. The Maple Leaf on the flag. 19. Mario Lemieux. 20. Oscar Peterson. 21. Réjean Tremblay, a sportswriter whose sitcom, "Lance et Compte (Shoots and Scores)," about a profligate center, began its new generation in Quebec last night. 22. Pierre Larouche, who to this day brags that Tremblay's series is really about him. 23. Richard Pound, who suffered because the International Olympic Committee delegates cannot tell a Canadian from an American. 24. Liz Manley. 25. Anne Murray, who never misses a Maple Leafs game when she is in town. 26. Leonard Cohen. 27. Ian and Sylvia, wherever they may be. 28. Wayne Gretzky. 29. Dave Semenko, right next to the Great One. 30. Lloyd Axworthy, public official. 31. The late Rick Danko of The Band. 32. The late Richard Manuel of The Band. 33. Robbie Robertson of The Band. 34. Garth Hudson of The Band. 35. Levon Helm of The Band, despite being from Arkansas. 36. Mike Bossy, scorer and character. 37. Robertson Davies. 38. Donald Sutherland. 39. Camil DesRoches, grand old publicist of the Canadiens. 40. Gordon Lightfoot. 41. John and James Coburn, zany twins from Toronto, who staged the Poetry Olympics in Calgary in 1988, the single best night I ever had at the Olympics. 42. Montreal in summer. 43. Quebec City in winter. 44. Toronto in fall. 45. Vancouver in spring. 46. Ken Dryden, goalie and writer. 47. John Hughes, father of Sarah. From the guest critic David Vecsey, hockey maven at CNNSI.com: 48. Tim Horton's on every corner. 49. Junior hockey on TV. 50. 5 percent alcohol beer. 51. Eight-pin bowling. 52. The rouge in Canadian football. 53. The portrait of Queen Elizabeth in the Winnipeg arena. 54. Moose Jaw. 55. Porcupine Plains. From the guest critic Allen Abel, Brooklyn boy and excellent journalist based in Toronto: 56. Filming an Inuit caribou hunt on the tundra east of Hudson Bay, for CBC. 56. Little kids' hockey. 57. Prairie summer nights. 58. Air Canada. 59. Bilingual food packages. 60. Toronto's ethnic neighborhoods. 61. Rollerblading on Toronto Island. 62. Everything about Vancouver. And a final two from me: 63. Aboot. 64. The gift burgundy ski hat with CANADA across the front that had our Olympic chief here, Kathleen McElroy, imagining she was from Toronto rather than Houston. Canadian garb is hip. Canadian skaters are chic. But Canadian hockey is everything, a very dangerous state indeed. http://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/21/olympics/21VECS.htm


Posted on Sat Feb 23 00:45:40 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tb073.proxy.aol.com (64.12.104.53)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA

I would love to contribute to this recent thread but......

COME ON SIXES, BABY NEEDS A NEW PAIR OF SHOES !!


Posted on Sat Feb 23 00:18:12 CET 2002 from cc5414-a.hnglo1.ov.nl.home.com (212.120.101.7)

Norbert

From: Hollande

John D. great, thanx!


Posted on Sat Feb 23 00:19:10 CET 2002 from (63.143.92.254)

Pete Rivard

From: Hastings, MN

Man, I been away too long. Almost missed this Pete Seeger/banjo thread. So before it fades from memory, Here's my tuppence worth:

Neither I, or any banjo player of any merit I ever met, ever considered Pete Seeger a "guru" of the 5-string. He played this silly longneck that he kept capo'd to the usual neck length for 90% of his tunes. And his playing was rudimentary, at best. Certainly there was nothing original in his style; it was a bit of this and a bit of that.

I'll bet I heard him play a few dozen times on the TV and once or twice in person and never once considered that the banjo thing might be for me. But it took precisely one song by Earl Scruggs onstage to blow me away for life.

My banjo gurus are Scruggs, Ralph Stanley, Bobby Thompson, Bill Keith, Tony Trishka, Courtney Johnson, Butch Robbins and Bela Fleck.

And Bela brings us to the topic of the "pretentiousness" of playing classical tunes on the 5-string. Anyone who can listen to Fleck's "Perpetual Motion" CD just once and not appreciate what the 5-string can do in the right hands has no ear for music atall.

Tonally speaking, the brightness and clarity of the banjo combined with it's brief sustain remind me of a harpsichord, and I believe J.S. Bach himself would listen to Bela with delight.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 23:56:14 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

SERGE: ME OLD COCK (Newfoundland Term...not dirty): I understand that you are putting together The New Vaudville Band once again with a blues re-make of Winchester Cathedral. Good luck on the Harp.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 22:51:26 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

I also wanted to say that I am honoured this Sunday night to be a presenter at the first Canadian National Jazz Awards to be held here in Toronto. CBC Radio is taping this event and I'll have a chance to see old pal Randy Bachman who has given so much back to guitar jazz greats. His label currently distributes the great Canadian jazz great, Lenny Breau and one of my 60's favorites, Howard Roberts. It was Mr. Roberts version of "Sac 'O' Woe that I ever heard. The highlight will be Mr. Oscar Peterson playing on a very special piano. I understand there are only a handful of these pianos in the world. I wish I knew the name. Any time Oscar sits down to play......I listen.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 22:47:23 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Johnny Flippo couldn't have said it any better; regarding Mr. Ry Cooder. I have had the pleasure of interviewing Ry on a few occasions. I still have hours of reel to reel recordings of him sitting in a radio control room at CHUM-FM with me in the 70's playing bottleneck guitar late at night. He has always given full credit to the original writer's no matter what he has done. His personal hero was Sleepy John Estes and he learnt a lot from that man. Mr. Cooder would never think of taking a "credit" no matter how he has changed the song. Mr. Flippo.a Great Post!!!


Posted on Fri Feb 22 20:42:12 CET 2002 from c5300-1-ip222.albany.thebiz.net (216.238.224.222)

bea

From: reflections
Web page

• NIGHT OF "THE BAND" MUSIC!!! •

GARTH HUDSON TONIGHT!!!

Also: Crowmatix - Tom Malone - Michael Falzarano - Larry Packer - Buddy Cage & More!

THE BOTTOM LINE in NYC - Info: 212-228-6300 (LINK ABOVE)

Friday - FEB. 22 - 7:30 PM & 10:30 PM

Let's show our support for THE BAND folks!

A rare live performance by our own GARTH!!!!!

Maybe we can help his family this way

LET'S GO WHOOP IT UP WITH GARTH TONIGHT!!!


Posted on Fri Feb 22 19:24:17 CET 2002 from (209.195.208.11)

bassmanlee

From: DE, still
Web page

AMG Link for O Sister!


Posted on Fri Feb 22 19:22:00 CET 2002 from (209.195.208.11)

bassmanlee

From: Back in DE
Web page

Struggling to keep up with y'all from the road. (See, I was in Virginia.) Peter V - shame on you! Crabgrass & Peter Stone, well said, although Sing Out! is still alive and kicking. (BTW picked up a replacement copy of their excellent "Rise Up Singing" book and noticed for the first time that Dixie is in it. The words look right. Haven't tried their chord transcriptions yet to see if they Joanied it.)

But I can agree with the big V when he says the GB influences the listening agenda. Not to mention purchasing decisions. To whit the high point of the trip was finding an independent record store with a decent amount of used and cutouts. In addition to new discs by Jonatha Brooke, Boz Scaggs, trumpeter Chris Botti, and Vasen, picked up two disks that might fit the interest the general GB. First was Micheal Martin Murphey's "Cowboy Songs". 21 tracks, 15 written by some guy named "P.D.". Oldies but goodies from the Country Western songbook, a different Americana. Quite enjoyable.

The second? A collection of BANJO MUSIC from Rounder/Easydisc with many of the names recently mentioned: Bill Keith, Tony Furtado, Tony Trischka, Bela Fleck, J.D. Crowe & New South, Ola Belle Reed, John Hartford and more. (See AMG link, above.) But no Mummers!

Also listening to "O Sister! The Women's Bluegrass Collection", another Rounder Records collection of female bluegrass pickers and singers, including Allison Krauss, Hazel Dickens and the Cox Family. (And there's that Furtado guy again.) Just grinnin' at the pickin' these days!


Posted on Fri Feb 22 18:45:43 CET 2002 from (66.200.102.18)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

Thanks Tendra! I'm sure I speak for all of us when I say that your website is a welcome addition to this guestbook, and its' tedious discussion of music, musicianship, and related issues. You've offered us a useful, productive, and uplifting alternative!


Posted on Fri Feb 22 18:30:28 CET 2002 from spider-wn014.proxy.aol.com (205.188.197.154)

Tendra King

From: USA
Web page

100 Casinos on the Internet - http://www.casinokats.com/


Posted on Fri Feb 22 16:49:08 CET 2002 from dialin-1729-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.7.205)

Gene

From: Dutchess County, NY, USA

One could argue that 'country rock' goes back to the '50s with Phil and Don, or Rick Nelson, maybe even further.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 16:44:51 CET 2002 from spider-wc052.proxy.aol.com (205.188.193.42)

Gary Seaman

From: Long Island,NY

I'm seeing this website for the 1st time. It's amazing. The last time I saw the BAND was in 1976 in upstate NY. Is there a complete concert archive list even if no tape from the show exsists? I'd love to see the details of the show I saw. Best Regards,Gary


Posted on Fri Feb 22 16:14:55 CET 2002 from host-65.subnet-76.med.umich.edu (141.214.76.65)

Steve Knowlton

From: Ypsilanti

Bob Fogerty is yet another brother. There were four or five of them. The story goes that when their parents divorced, the judge took each of them back in his chambers and asked if they wanted to stay with Mom or Dad. And all the brothers said they wanted to stay with each other.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 15:44:24 CET 2002 from abby13.revealed.net (208.16.227.204)

Mike

From: Midwest

Thanks Pat :) I guess I did spell "rock" wrong...I don't know what got into me. Me a genius? Hardly! I also noticed that I spelled "pardon" wrong too, lol! I spelled it "parson". Considering that my post mentioned Gram and Gene Parsons, what kind of slip is that? Or is it mere coincidence? Or both?

All this talk of country rock and banjos really sparked a re-newed interest in that music. You can't go wrong with "Sweetheart", "Gilded Palace Of Sin" or "Pickin' Up The Pieces". It also got me to thinking of Buffalo Springfield, who were teribly underrated. But out of the ashes came two great bands: CSN&Y and Poco. "Buffalo Springfield Again" has to be one of the best albums ever made...Definitely has some high points for Neil Young (Mr. Soul, Expecting To Fly and Broken Arrow). I'm outta here.

Mike


Posted on Fri Feb 22 14:58:41 CET 2002 from (12.34.17.194)

Johnny Flippo

From: Chicago Style Manual

Do you think I had enough commas in that last post?


Posted on Fri Feb 22 14:56:47 CET 2002 from (12.34.17.194)

Johnny Flippo

From: 24 hours from Tulsa

Originators v. Contributors...An interesting anomaly is Ry Cooder. He completely changes songs around to the point that, melodically and structurally, they're unrecognizable. His "Money Honey" sounds nothing like Elvis'. "How Can a Poor Man Stand Such Times and Live" is a million miles away from Blind Alfred Reed's original. Yet, Cooder still credits the original songwriters, and seldom, if ever, gives himself any writer's, much less arranger's, credit.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 14:14:27 CET 2002 from cust163.18.nw.tplus.at (217.76.163.18)

Georg

From: Austria
Web page

hi to all music-lovers around the world from austria


Posted on Fri Feb 22 12:45:56 CET 2002 from du45-250.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.250.45)

Ilkka

From: Living The Ice Hockey Blues
Web page

More Banjo: - In Bob Dylan's "Lay Down Your Weary Tune" the sound of the different instruments are desribed as the sounds of the nature. This is of banjo:

"The last of leaves fell from the trees
And clung to a new love's breast,
The branches bare like a banjo played
To the winds that listened best."
© 1964 M. Witmark & sons

(Beautiful.)


Posted on Fri Feb 22 10:10:07 CET 2002 from (62.30.0.2)

Al Edge

From: Bootle

Hope I can find some time over the weekend to add my fourpennyworth to the FANTASTIC stuff on here these past few days. What a Forum - and site - this is. Credit to everyone involved. Can't leave without the Boothill link to country rock. Notwithstanding our South Liverpool cousins could a thread be traced back to the North Liverpool Searchers with their then unique early sixties guitar sound - still so evident in young L'Pool groups today - rightly acclaimed by Roger McGuinn as a major influence on The Byrds own sound which clearly was still there when Gram came to the fore. Of course the influence for The Searchers - like the fab four - came up the Mersey from Noo YorK? Goes round eh?

One for the experts perhaps?

How far back is it possible to go with this? Is not the old Appalachian Hillbilly music surely the realistic springboard? Is Jethro not the missing link...? Or is it simply Pro-Magnum man?


Posted on Fri Feb 22 09:41:38 CET 2002 from du-tele3-159.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.159)

Peter Viney

Peter S-B's insight into the writing process was instructive. It made me think, how often is a song really "written in the studio" (or rehearsal room). Ever? It made me think of Classic Albums where Robbie describes writing "Dixie" on the piano, very quietly because the baby was asleep. Stuff that really is a co-written joint effort in the studio is usually a boogie! I suspect that the main flashpoint of inspiration most often comes alone. That's the point that Peter makes - both versions of Dixie, however different, are recognizably the same song. As i repeat every time the debate comes up, listen to Aretha Franklin, Diana Ross, Supremes + Temptations, Spooky Tooth, Jackie DeShannon - all doing 'The Weight' the year it was released. All that persists across the versions are the words and melody. Lots of different arrangments - and even strong variations in pace. Still the same song.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 07:52:43 CET 2002 from (194.100.60.131)

Kalervo

From: Suomi
Web page

Did I see all the banjo masters mentioned and didn' t see maybe the greatest of them all:Tony Trischka!!....Look his web site above.. Kalervo


Posted on Fri Feb 22 06:20:31 CET 2002 from dialup-65.56.132.75.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.56.132.75)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Of course, there was that Beatles group from England doing Honey Don't, Act Naturally, and I've Just Seen A Face a bit before the American rockers caught on. And Mike, I love the "orck" mistype. Just shows that genius can be quite accidental.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 05:31:41 CET 2002 from sid22.revealed.net (208.23.178.165)

Mike

From: Midwest

Long Distance Operator: The lineup for the Burritos was: Gram Parsons, Sneaky Pete, Micheal Clarke, Chris Hillman and Bernie Leadon. I wish I had that live recording. That'd be a treasure trove for Burrito fans. A live recording from the Parsons-era Burritos!!!

Crabby, actually Gram's pre-Byrds band "International Submarine Band" started that whole country-rock genre. The Byrds were popular enough to get noticed with "Sweetheart". Also, The Dillards were right in that same area pre-Sweetheart. And a band called "Nashville West", which featured future Byrds Clarence White and Gene Parsons also mined the country-rock genre before Sweetheart. There are many hints at The Byrds leaning to country before Sweetheart. Hell, even Clarence White made guest appreances on Younger Than Yesterday and Notorious Byrd Brothers. Songs like "Time Between", "A Girl With No Name", "Change Is Now", "Wasn't Born To Follow" and "Goin' Back" all have traces of the country-rock to follow in 1968 with Sweetheart. The saddest thing is that The Eagles got credit for the country-rock thing that happened. While Bernie Leadon (a former Burrito) was the most talented and had country-rock roots (a good friend of Clarence White and Gram Parsons), Randy Meisner came from Poco and they had similar roots in country-rock too. Speaking of The Eagles, there is a group that has wasted time (parson the pun) and talent over they years. If I want country-rock, I'll get some Burritos, Poco, and The Byrds. Eagles are more orck-based...Oh well...

Mike


Posted on Fri Feb 22 04:11:58 CET 2002 from cfa1.execulink.net (199.166.6.10)

Paul Godfrey

From: L O N D O N Canada

Truly a Golden Moment for our Women's Hockey Team at the Olympics.

A golden day of sorts for me. An outstanding (as in have been waiting) Christmas present arrived today. MOONDOG MATINEE.

My favorite song is Great Pretender. The remastered version simply jumps out at you.

Now for some Men's Hockey - Team Canada. Go for the Gold Guys!


Posted on Fri Feb 22 03:45:42 CET 2002 from spider-tp031.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.186)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

George probably didn't care about credit for something he added to a Lennon/McCartney song. That's the way he was. He would rather have had more space for his own songs on the records.

Mr Guerilla makes an interesting point, which I was actually thinking myself (I really was). When I look at the photo on the home page of this site - the Robbie in that picture seems pretty far removed from the RR of today. It seems like it's a photo of him as a kid or something. It's like, the other guys in the Band were all grown up but RR was still growing. He was the real thing back then, and he's a different real thing now - (there's a Dylan-esque ine huh?). In other words - Robbie WAS a mountain man, up in the Catskills (what a thrill), but he kind of grew up and left home to persue what he wanted to do. The other guys found their lot in life and were happy. We should just be glad RR was there to be a big part of what makes us come to this site everyday. That's why it bugs me when he gets bashed for being seen at an L.A. Lakers game in an expensive suit.

Back to CCR. Does anyone know who Bob Fogerty is? He is credited on some of John's records for diffent things. I always wondered if he's another brother.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 02:32:48 CET 2002 from dv236s69.lawrence.ks.us (24.124.69.236)

Dexy

I believe that U2 has a good solution to the group songwriting question. They list most songs as Bono/U2 or Bono/Edge/U2, meaning that whoever "originates" gets most of the credit and songwriting $$, but the partners who help "finish" the song are included as well. I've always liked the way Lennon/McCartney handled it, since as we all know, sometimes John brought the song to Paul, sometimes Paul to John, sometimes together, sometimes alone -- but they always had each other to play off of. However, I've also often thought that George probably should have had a 1/3 credit on some of them.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 02:08:31 CET 2002 from spider-loh-te054.proxy.aol.com (195.93.49.174)

Mr guerilla

From: London UK

Just wanted to say that I loved RR's performance at the opening ceremony. It's the first time I have seen any member of the band live, even on TV and it made me think how good it must have been to have caught them in the first or second incarnation. I thought he did a great job and its good those songs were heard by the audience they warrant. It got me thinking on the whole Robbie Levon thing and imho even if they were still friends I don't think Levon would have been there. I think the difference between Robbie and the others was that they embodied something wheras he was more transitory. Richard, Rick and in particular Levon were the real thing, and from the songs he wrote for them to sing I think you can see how much he loved them, Dixie being a great example. I think it is quite possible that at some point Robbie wanted to be Levon or very much like him. I don't think Robbie had the same sense of knowing who he was and that as time went on he wanted to find out. This lead him away from the collective of the band towards the various projects he has since undertaken. Watching him performing I felt like he had found his voice. Levon has always known the music he loves and wants to play, it oozes from him and I think that applies to his life too.

Anyway enough of my amateur psychology. I guess I am just trying to say I love them both and am insanely jealous of those of you who caught them when they were together. TLW and documentaries are no substitute for the real thing. Sorry if this is old ground but haven't been online for a while. Congrats to the women curlers our first gold since 84 and to the US and Salt Lake City for putting on a great games.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 02:07:43 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-004paphilp094.dialsprint.net (158.252.2.182)

Peter Stone Brown

From: philly
Web page

On the songwriting, originators and creators topic it's not all that cut and dry (or maybe it is). Now according to various things I've read on this site such as the John Simon interview a lot of bands today share the credits no matter what. That's fine.

But having been in a few bands where I was the primary songwriter, the question is where do you draw the line? I've brought songs to bands that I wrote long before the band was in existence. I've also written songs with someone else and at times shared credits when a substantial change was made, sometimes amending an already copyrighted work.

At the same time, I write a song. I play it for the band, we start playing it. Nothing in the words or music is changed. A guitar player may play a lead solo, but not really come up with a part. Someone else may bring in a song, I play a lead solo, but don't really change the song.

The person who wrote the other song could leave my band, form his own, he gets another guitar player who comes up with a different lead part on the same song than I did. Neither one of us sat down and wrote that song.

Or suppose the guitar player comes up with a whole other part that changes the song, and the bass player or drummer does nothing but play that part. In other words they did nothing to change the music and lyrics as presented. Did they write the song?/n As another example take for better or worse (probably worse) Baez' cover of "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down." The arrangement obviously is totally different than the Band's far superior arrangement, and in addition to getting the lyrics wrong (were they deliberately changed, or more likely misheard?) there are definite changes to the melody. Should Baez and especially the Nashville studio musicians who came up with that arrangement now be considered writers of that song?/n


Posted on Fri Feb 22 01:28:11 CET 2002 from akcf3.xtra.co.nz (203.96.111.201)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

I pretty much agree with Peter's comments on originators and contributers. There is a thin line between the two at times though. Was Garth an originator or contributer on Chest Fever? I'd say originator in that case. Certainly that song is a prime case where the performance is more important than the song itself.

As for encores - it's all part of the game.


Posted on Fri Feb 22 01:23:57 CET 2002 from 1cust191.tnt30.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.78.191)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

"Snippet" is a good description. In fact, if you blink you could miss seeing Gram Parsons entirely. The rest of the "camera work" during "Six Days On The Road" focuses on the audience - a great mistake and a great disappointment. Don't waste your time renting it just to see the Burritos.

BTW I seem to recall that there's a bit of banjo playing on the Byrds/Gram Parsons collaboration "Sweetheart of the Rodeo" - the album which launched the "Country Rock" genre - "I Am A Pilgrim" and Woody Guthrie's (a mate of Pete Seeger) "Pretty Boy Floyd."


Posted on Fri Feb 22 01:17:35 CET 2002 from syr-24-58-22-128.twcny.rr.com (24.58.22.128)

twohot

come and join us at www.cybertown.com and live in entertainmet music!!


Posted on Fri Feb 22 00:53:26 CET 2002 from h0050ba8ceef5.ne.mediaone.net (24.61.49.141)

Long Distance Operator

There's a snippet of The Flying Burrito Brothers in the watershed Stones film "Gimme Shelter". The segment is from the infamous Altamont concert in December 1969, with the band performing a snappy rendition of "Six Days On The Road". My question is: Who was in that particular Burritos lineup? I know the late, lamented Gram Parsons was pretty tight with Keith Richards, but was Gram in the group at that time? You can't really tell who's who in the movie.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 23:57:38 CET 2002 from du-tele3-028.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.28)

Peter Viney

For my encore on encores: Very interested in John Fogerty’s attitude to encores. In the early 70s the debate raged over theatrical performances on curtain calls, and the prevailing opinion was that they were definitely not “hip”. Last summer I saw a play where they solemnly announced before the play that the writer had stipulated no curtain calls. This had caused so much protest, that they had decided to flip a coin before every performance. Heads meant curtain calls. Tails meant none. Tonight, we were informed, there would be none. In the early 70s even the most modern dance troupes took multiple calls. Opera had multiple calls and bouquets. “Hip” theatre took none. Fogerty was probably allying himself with that mood. The show was designed as a complete entity. When it was over, it was over. When I was doing music and comedy drama shows in the 70s for students of English, we resisted curtain calls for several years. But four times a year our small company had to participate in “serious plays” with my boss (and the backing band was sent home for the duration). He was then in his 50s – as I am now - and brought on some of his old amateur theatrical pals for the choice parts. On those shows there would be six curtain calls at least, large bouquets for the women and imitation champagne to toast the audience, which we found excruciatingly embarrassing (as was the actual play in fact). I was often relegated from acting to lights for these occasions (not serious enough), so had full opportunity to observe. So I know how Fogerty felt about fake encores. Our solution for our own shows in the late 70s / 80s was just one call, instant 10 second black out, house lights on, then the band playing an instrumental as the audience went out. I have to say that Hamlet is spoiled when all the dead people get up and bow!


Posted on Thu Feb 21 23:23:43 CET 2002 from syr-24-169-66-92.twcny.rr.com (24.169.66.92)

Bashful Bill

From: Minoa,N.Y.

Saw the Indigo Girls in Albany a few years back, and people were calling out requests. At one point Emily said"We were going to play that one for an encore, oops, that is if you call us back out for an encore...". It was pretty funny. They ended up playing a cover of the Dead's Uncle John's Band for the encore. The Dead themselves often did covers for their encores. I recall them doing a killer versions of Baba O'Reilly and Satisfaction, leavin the fans happy.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 23:21:41 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

The Eagles are also embroiled in a nasty dispute. After guitarist & "shareholder" Don Felder was ousted from the nest about a year ago, he filed suit against the other two shareholders, Don Henley & Glen Frey. Talk about dirty laundry, but I guess that group has a long history of dissension.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 23:19:43 CET 2002 from du-tele3-024.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.24)

Peter Viney

Rick Roberts with the Flying Burrito Brothers was one of the best concerts I ever saw (1970? 1971? I think it was The Lyceum in London) and the third album, long unavailable until they put it all on a compilation recently is my favourite Flying Burrito Brothers album. I picked up two Rick Roberts solo albums on a vinyl a few years back. He was a truly wonderful singer and Colorado live still shines out as an onstage vocal in the It Makes No Difference(everytime) category.

Van's the man for pro encores. the band doesn't stop playing. He leaves the stage. Then comes back and does two. Three for an ecstatic audience (which it often is). Then he goes - and his car leaves the premises while the band are still playing out. No pretence about being dragged back. He knows he's coming back. I also think that doing 80 minutes on the contract then two encores (Dr John) therefore still finishing dead on 90 minutes isn't really right. The encores should be a gift on top of the contracted 90 minutes. (I've seen Van do 2 hours 20 minutes when the mood takes him). The standard contract will be 90.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 22:52:30 CET 2002 from (130.219.229.173)

BK

From: nj

The way I think I remember it, from a VH-1 legends show or something. Doug Clifford and Stu Cook wanted more input into CCR, and JF told them that if that’s what they wanted then they’d have to contribute 1/3 each to the songwriting. I can’t remember whether that was something they actually wanted or not. They may have wanted to act more as the contributers.

Ya know, I’m just realizing that 3 of my all time favorite bands (The Band, CCR, and Allmans) all seem to have bitter feuds between principle members. Maybe it’s my fault. I’m gonna have stop liking bands…….


Posted on Thu Feb 21 22:37:13 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-249.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.249)

Amanda

I have read all the posts concerning songwriting credits on this site for the last 4 1/2 years. I have asked questions privately of some and been answered privately. I know all about the old-fashioned way and the modern way of songwriting credits, I know what should have been done, I know what could of been done, I even know what wasn't done. I understand all about originators and contributors. Believe me...I've been through the mill on this one. I don't have any questions for anyone or need anything explained to me. I just want to say that I think it is a pretty cruddy and obnoxious aspect of the music business. I mean...musicians are artisis right? Most creative people live for their art as much as they live for anything else. It is a shame that there is a need for a book or a course regarding Business 101 for Musicians. I completely understand about watching out for what is yours as far as money and such. No one wants to live penniless. In a group setting, it must be terribly distracting for the originator to be constantly worried about his own interest, even though the songs come together because of combined efforts, unless of course there is a good deal more to the originator's agenda than just the love of the work. I think it is distressing that an originator could be in a creative process with other members of his group and in the back of his mind he is thinking...of course this is all his because he is a leader and these guys/gals that sing or play the instruments...well, they are replaceable by session artists or whatever. Call me romantic, Pollyanna, or maybe I just have scruples...whatever...I honestly don't understand how a creative, talented close knit group of musicians can come up with so many powerful songs and music and only one person walks away with the trophy. No wonder there is so many bad feelings and ill will among bands from the 60s/70s and present day...that we don't even know about yet. I guess if any of my sons head to the garage someday with a guitar in hand...I better go back to college for Business and Accounting.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 22:31:00 CET 2002 from dialup-64.152.160.222.dial1.newyork1.level3.net (64.152.160.222)

FrankDracman

From: LIC, NYC

I was inspired by a MugsPost "Forbert play Chicago- he did a song written in memory of Rick Danko with a chorus about Rick being down to earth and wild as the wind" I went to SteveForbert.com got 2 replys "Wild as the Wind" or "Hey Mister got a Mintue" song abaout Rick and what a great friend he was to all. the song: "Maybe you didn't know him, but he probably was your friend, chorus: "Hey mister, got a minute, that's what Rick would say." It's not yet on any recording, though.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 22:27:41 CET 2002 from (208.202.161.51)

thebassguy

From: Hard Bargain - NYC R&B powerhouse!
Web page

great site! LUV the Band, been a fan since 1971!! Please check out my site, thebassguy.com ! tbg


Posted on Thu Feb 21 21:43:27 CET 2002 from host-65.subnet-76.med.umich.edu (141.214.76.65)

Steve Knowlton

From: Ypsilanti

John D.: You're right that encores are phony if the group has kept back its hits/best loved songs. For example, the act Nickelback didn't play its only hit at a recent show, so of course they had to do it as an encore.

However, if the group has played its best and given the audience their money's worth, then an encore is a genuine honor from the audience to the group. I wasn't old enough to see any CCR shows, but on video their audiences are delirious with pleasure - those shows really moved them. And in that context, CCR doing an encore after 20,000 people swayed to every beat and even danced in the aisles would have been an genuinely friendly gesture toward those hard-working fans.

It's not like Creedence was about anything other than show biz, anyway - they were just good at it.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 21:39:38 CET 2002 from (66.200.102.18)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

Phony encores planned in advance? I was once at a show where the opening band (don't even ask, they are long gone and forgotten) was awful and booed during their set (nothing unusual). BUT, they had planned for an encore and CAME BACK! The audience was looking for vegetable to throw onstage!


Posted on Thu Feb 21 20:41:26 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

From: Toronto

Regarding Steve Knowlton's quote from John Fogerty saying that encores are "phony." I agree with Fogerty. I've had artists tell me how stupid they feel as they stand back stage waiting for all the clapping and shouting for a set amount of time to back on. The "encore" numbers are usually always included ahead of time. In other words it's part of the spectacle of show business.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 20:40:00 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tg023.proxy.aol.com (64.12.102.158)

calvin

Ya know Dexy, from what I always understood Bartley, Clark, and Roberts always felt Firefall got slighted-they saw themselves as a damn fine country rock Jam band who had a few light rock singles and that got them labled. Whether that is true or not, accord to the bio on their home page (yep even Firefall has a page) that is the story they are sticking to. Bartley is still recording with a revamped Firefall, and to my surprise the 90 albums got good reviews as grittier country rock than in their heyday. That whole sound firefall/poco/eagles/SHF/Mannassas/Byrds/Burrito Brothers seemed to change members with each more than most people change their socks.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 20:26:36 CET 2002 from (142.76.70.52)

Rick K

From: The Blue Goose

I'm no expert, but I seem to recall John Hartford was no slouch on the Banjo . . .

and a pretty fair songwriter, too (Glen Campbell's "Gentle On My Mind" I beleive was his composition).

and I think (?) he wrote comedy for the Smothers Brothers & Glen Campbell . . .

Dileas gu Brath

Rick


Posted on Thu Feb 21 19:42:44 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Rick Roberts was Gram Parsons' replacement in the Flying Burrito Brothers not the Byrds.

Here's a hard & fast rule about songwriting credits -- it's up to those involved in the creation process to make sure their contribution is recognized at the outset, BEFORE the song is recorded. You've got to be a hard-nosed business person and make sure you receive your credit IN WRITING when the copyright paperwork is filled out.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 17:52:13 CET 2002 from spider-wl041.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.36)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Peter Viney = great post. You really explained it well. Your post should be in a book on how to form a successful band (if it isn't already).

Having been in a couple of bands myself - the hardest thing is for the personalities to mesh. I was in a band with a guitar player who sang well, and wrote great originals, but he had no "people" skills. The last I heard he was managing a store in California. That's why my hats off to a band like Aerosmith. They went through a TON of ups and downs, but came out of it realizing what they have as a unit. They learned valuble lessons - and, incredibly, they are all alive.

Steve Knowlton = thanks for those thoughts from Stu Cook, and Doug Clifford. I'd never heard those before. I always pictured "Mardi Gras" as Fogerty stepping back and essentially saying - go ahead guys, do your thing. I don't have the album handy, but I believe JF only sings a couple of tunes, and they are the only ones anyone knows. With all due respect to Stu and Doug - the proof of who CCR was is the great album "Centerfield".


Posted on Thu Feb 21 17:18:37 CET 2002 from dv236s69.lawrence.ks.us (24.124.69.236)

Dexy

The Rick Roberts story, I think, is a pretty sad one. He was a real talent -- the Flying Burrito Brothers album with Colorado was really outstanding, with him taking the place of the great Gram. He did tour briefly with The Byrds I think, also replacing Parsons, but I don't believe he was ever an official member. Of course, he sort of sold out for the bucks with Firefall, but I can't blame him for that. Unfortunately, he's dropped off the face of the earth, while the other Firefall members (sans Byrds drummer Michael Clarke, who passed away) tour Casinos to this day. Last I heard, Roberts was in and out of half-way houses (allegedly, from an online board like this one).


Posted on Thu Feb 21 16:12:36 CET 2002 from host-65.subnet-76.med.umich.edu (141.214.76.65)

Steve Knowlton

From: Ypsilanti

There are some interesting books about Creedence: one is an oral history called "Up Around the Bend." In it, Cook and Clifford reveal that some of the animosity on their side came not from their unwillingness to recognize Fogerty's musical genius - they always count their lucky stars that they played with him - but that he took advantage of his musical dominance to exert financial, commercial and managerial dominance. For example, refusing to tour except on weekends. Proclaiming that encores are "phony" and refusing to come out again after the set. These types of decisions hurt the whole band financially, which may be why they were not inclined to help him later. Cook and Clifford also claim that the "Mardi Gras" debacle was a result of Fogerty imposing on them a requirement to write and sing, because he wanted to change the image of the group. Hard to say on that one.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 16:08:41 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

In answer to The Beav's question, Rhino/Warner has the DVD-A version of The Last Waltz slated for release on April 30. Rhino/Warner recently did an excellent job on the DVD-A versions of the Grateful Dead's "Workingman's Dead" and "American Beauty". Intrestingly, the surround sound mix, done with Mickey Hart's input, puts the listener in the drummer's perspective.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 10:15:32 CET 2002 from du-tele3-157.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.157)

Peter Viney

Songwriting credits post # 1037: The way I see it, in every creative field there are ‘originators’ and ‘contributors’. Some contributors are brilliantly creative people, but left to their own devices they just won’t come up with a new song (book / idea / script / photo/picture). ‘Originators’ are good at getting things started. Their best work is often when paired or grouped with the ideal ‘contributors.’ When the group falls apart (and they all do) the originators will continue, but the contributors will tend not to produce new ideas, even though their part in developing and enhancing the original ideas was so important. Art Garfunkel was a good example thrown in here. Even by “Bridge” he had lost interest though. His solo albums are full of exquisite vocals but deeply shy of originality. You have to see it the other way too. ‘Hearts and Bones’ was supposed to be a joint effort, but in the end Paul Simon eradicated Garfunkel’s vocal track. The songs were his. You can buy in a great harmony singer for the session (or do it yourself)– not one as great as Garfunkel perhaps, but one sufficient to carry the song’s aim. So why give up half the credit? And put up with the hassle? You can get on with the work without waiting for someone else to be free / turn up.

But when you come to CCR, Robbie’s remark about John Fogerty + sidemen is probably the story. Listening back, yeah, they were a great choogling band. But can’t you think of fifty American drummers or bass players who could have picked up the riff and played it convincingly? I mean, there was a time when every bar band could do a great Proud Mary, which lived or died on how well the vocalist could approximate John Fogerty. A lot of people could play it.

Bands start in an area. They expand beyond the area, and they realize that there are actually other great players out there. Their old friend who they always thought was the best (bass player / drummer / guitarist / keyboard player / horn player) they’d ever seen is truly great, but so are other people. To me, the bass player and drummer in the world who have given me the greatest listening pleasure are Rick and Levon. But look at Robbie’s early solo stuff – Manu Katche and Tony Levin. I’d back Levon any day in a battle of the drums against all contenders, but Manu Katche would still finish damn near the top of any list. Not that the point is ranking (and PLEASE let’s not get into ranking). Just that the ‘originator’, once reasonably successful, can call in great players. The failing is that these great players who are brought in, will never have the status to truly contribute in the same way as the original equal members did. They will be sidemen. And the originator, relaxing in the lack of hassle from true contributors, will probably be much happier with the boss + sidemen situation. They might actually enjoy the fact of playing with younger sidemen . BTW, Paul Simon has stuck by the same sidemen for long enough for them to have a creative contribution, I suspect.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 09:43:32 CET 2002 from dc-57-238.bpb.bigpond.com (203.40.57.238)

Bill

I'd say that the chief beauty of "Streets Of London" lies in its lyrics, as lovely as the tune is - borrowed or not. A really nice cover was done by Cape Breton's musical godfather, John Allen Cameron - produced by Anne Murray's production company.

Springhill, the Nova Scotia town that suffered the terrible mining disaster, is the hometown of both Anne Murray (Band links: "Tears Are Not Enough" with Richard M., and her dedication of one of her albums to singer Dianne Brooks, who sang on Robbie R.'s first recording) and Jackie Gabriel (Band link: sang with Hawkins for years in the mid-'60s).

Another Canadian disaster of the era was a bridge collapse in New Westminster BC, which was immortalised in Jimmy Dean's C&W hit, "Steel Men". The original version, though, was Toronto's first calyso record, by the Debonaires (sp?). It was a local hit on the Raleigh label that was at about the same time ('61) pressing the first Paul London and the Capers 45, featuring Garth H. (see Jan's discog.)


Posted on Thu Feb 21 08:19:53 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f1abf6.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.157.163.193)

The Beav

From: Canada (really!!)

Does anyone know if the Last Waltz is coming out in DVD-audio format? I heard it was, but i haven't heard any news in a while. Just wonderin'.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 07:30:04 CET 2002 from tayhou-207-218-229-131.ev1.net (207.218.229.131)

Laura

From: Houston

VERY EXCITED!! J.R.R. is going to be in Austin, TX for a Last Waltz promo deal at the Paramount Theatre March 15 with Martin Scorsese. It's part of all the South by Southwest concert events that will be going on that week. I will be there and really never thought I would ever see Robbie doing anything live. He will be the keynote speaker that night and they are going to show the movie in it's new release form. I'm so happy I get the opportunity to see this! For those of you who care, I will get back with you on how it all was. Hello to Donna in PA. and a hello to Acadian Ruby too!! Now that I have had a few glasses of Merlot..I'm going to be cheesey and watch "Carny". PEACE ALL!


Posted on Thu Feb 21 07:01:09 CET 2002 from 12-249-69-3.client.attbi.com (12.249.69.3)

Chris

From: Chicago

I met David Crosby once in Chicago after a CSN show at the Rosemont Theater. Someone asked about a Byrds reunion and Crosby said "I would love to...I keep asking, and talking about it but Roger doesn't want to do ANY of the old stuff."

Hey Butch...are you going to be at the Ozark Foothills Film Festival Tribute to Levon?... The little lady and I are thinking about catching the Texas Eagle down to Walnut Ridge, Arkansas and heading to Batesville to take in the show. It's been a long time since we've had a train ride and too long since we caught a Levon and The Cate Brothers show. Any thoughts on the setlist?


Posted on Thu Feb 21 04:49:45 CET 2002 from 0-1pool72-71.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.72.71)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

The CCR rhythm section (Stu Cook and Doug "Cosmo" Clifford) now tour under the name Creedence Clearwater REVISITED with a hired hand on lead vocals. I haven't heard them, but I imagine it is the same sort of oldies show that road warrior Paul Revere and his latest batch of Raiders put on, mostly familiar hits played close enough to the original records to please the audience. Believe me, that's more than I could do onstage and I have to give these guys credit (like I do Bob Dylan and Levon) for keeping their music on the road. It ain't easy.

That brings me to another point about Robbie's line in THE LAST WALTZ, listing the names of "the great ones" taken from us by the ominous-sounding "road." He mentions Buddy Holly and others who genuinely died on tour. But then he mentions Presley. The truth is that Elvis died on the toilet. I wonder if Robbie has avoided those since then as well...


Posted on Thu Feb 21 04:40:40 CET 2002 from dialup-65.57.15.200.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.57.15.200)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Doc, not to belabor the point, but no one person took credit for songwriting in The Band. Some of the members had co-writing credits with various people while one had co-writing and sole writing credits.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 03:59:53 CET 2002 from dialup-288.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.32)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

There's a great story about Garcia travelling in Ireland on a holiday in 1994...he arrived quietly......just another long-grey haired American dude, travelled up The West, was on the road, stopped for some sight seeing and came across some Irish Gypsy kids who were having trouble with a horse......apparently he took out his banjo, gently picked and strummed and, like, the horse chilled....dude.......totally.....

Dead-Head speak aside, that's a true story......

There's a fellow here in Ireland plays a mean banjo..Gerry O'Connor...put out a spacy album entitled "Time to Time" awhile ago

Where was this gig you saw Van and The Band at Alan? In The UK.....sounds like a blast!


Posted on Thu Feb 21 02:28:35 CET 2002 from 209.236.161.52.cnjnet.com (209.236.161.52)

Mike Lenahan

Check out website http://jerseyjamsfund.org/main.html Levon is playing on this new project " Jersey Jams, Jersey Cares ". with The Matt Angus Thing. Great local band from Clinton NJ. This cd sould be out very soon. The song is called "Understand". This is a must for any Band Fan.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 01:45:48 CET 2002 from dra-163.dhcp.umass.edu (128.119.99.163)

doc

From: western mass

Nick: On your question concerning the reason(s) for John Fogerty's animosity toward his CCR bandmates, I think the old "ego analysis" will help. Since I was a kid I've known that John was always bitter about the fact that the songs he wrote for the group will be forever known as "CCR songs" instead of "John Fogerty songs." Having emerged as a great songwriter, I guess he became really dictatorial in the studio and would not let the others contribute or become creative. I later learned that he also handled all their business dealings with Fantasy by himself. As far as he is concerned, it was his songs that made the group big and he should have complete control of everything - and I've heard him say this many times in recent years. His complete control of the band eventually fueled a lot of resentment leading to Tom's departure. Of course, John resented their resentment, but when he finally did relinquish much of his control to Stu and Doug, it resulted in "Mardi Gras" - an embarrassingly bad album.

I think the real clincher for John came in the mid to late seventies when he sold his rights to his songs to Fantasy/Zantz in order to get out of his contract with him. Without royalties or a booming solo career he was not doing financially well and none of the others, who were living on their royalties from 'his songs' - as he sees it, bothered to offer him any financial help. Despite an extraordinary brief reunion in the early 80's, I think that's what really lead him to vow to never play again with the others - but I could be wrong. In the end, it stinks for the rest of us.

I believe Tom died in 1991 of tb. According to John, Tom told him on his death bed that Zantz was his best friend or something to that effect. Ouch!

Well, that's the way I understand the whole Creedence controversy. It's unfortunate that egos have caused so many great groups break up or change to inferior line-ups. This is not to say that I don't believe John is the genius behind the group - he definately is. I just don't think being good at what you do should correlate with being a control freak or arrogant. Personally, having been in a band myself, I never quite understood how one person could get the all the credit for a song. When somebody came to the band with a new tune everyone followed along, but eventually everyone would add their own thing to it so that it inevitably became the band's song. Writing songs within a group can be a creative and interesting process - but it's ultimately a social process. I think the same even holds true for Simon & Garfunkel. Simon is very intellectual and he is the genius behind the duo, but, in my opinion, Garfunkel's vocals lifted those songs to new heights which obviously Simon could not have achieved on his own. As far as I'm concerned, if you don't like to share credit or mind if people are living off of "your" songs, then "BABY, DON'T DO IT! From the comments on this great site, it's sad to read about the tension between Levon and Robbie, but it's surely another clash of the egos. The members of The Band were such great musicians, it's hard to see in my opinion how one member should either receive or claim all the credit. Well, I think I've written enough. Take care.


Posted on Thu Feb 21 01:21:41 CET 2002 from dial2a-252.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.252)

Hi

My daughter for Christmas gave me a book which compiled articles and interviews from the '60's about the young Dylan which included the Ewan MacColl article from Sing Out..."a youth of mediocre talent."....The book's an interesting read in that it includes actual newspaper articles from the time...the New York Times referring to him as Bobby Dillon with Seeger and Bikel...


Posted on Wed Feb 20 23:58:12 CET 2002 from 66-106-4-126.customer.algx.net (66.106.4.126)

MattK

No mention of "Old Main Drag" is complete without mentioning Rod Stewart's seminal version...ok, maybe not. Still, just as it's embarrasing to admit my first exposure to "The Night The Drove Old Dixie Down," was via John Denver, as a kid I always associated "Dirty Old Town" with Roger Whittaker - at least until I heard Shane McGowan's somewhat grittier version with The Pogues on their excellent "Rum Sodomy and the Lash" album.

While "Dirty Old Town" is one of many highlights of the Elvis Costello-produced "Rum, Sodomy, and the Lash," their solid follow-up "If I Should Fall From Grace With God" is best known for "Fairytale In New York" - a duet with McGowan and Kristy MacColl, Ewan's daughter. Kristy, who died tragically a couple years back in a boating/swimming accident, was the wife of the album's producer, Steve Lillywhite. Lillywhite produced The Pogues' next album, "Peace and Love," which marked the beginning of the end for McGowan in the group as his drinking/drug abuse/belligerence left his vocals a mess, his songwriting weak, and The Pogues' in chaos.

Inexplicably (at least to me), "Peace and Love" enjoys greater favor than McGowan's last Pogues' effort, "Hell's Ditch." Personally, I think bringing in Joe Strummer to produce was a masterstroke that squeezed that last bit of greatness out of McGowan's life as "a Pogue" (after all, if you piss of Strummer, he'll just beat the crap out of you until you see things his way). It was on tour in support of "Hell's Ditch" (if I remember correctly) that McGowan became completely unmanagable and was fired mid-tour -- replaced by Strummer as front man for the remainder of the gigs.

Subsequently, The Pogues' devolved into a less-visionary, if more consistent, act as a pure Irish folk-rock ensemble, producing two more uninspired, McGowan-less records before disbanding in the mid-90s. For his part, McGowan reinvigorated himself and put out a terrific album, "The Snake," with a new backing band, dubbed "The Popes." The group has since produced a few albums, and I understand there is a forthcoming live disc. McGowan duets with Nick Cave on the latter's "Murder Ballads" album, which features a version of Dylan's "Death Is Not the End" off of "Down in the Groove."


Posted on Wed Feb 20 23:41:37 CET 2002 from 3cust162.tnt52.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.95.162)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn
Web page

I am particularly fond of the Gene Clark song "Changing Heart," one of his contributions to the Byrd's reunion album and a song about the fickleness of music fans. Soaring harmonies on the chorus which talks of how the public praises you when your "on top" and laments "but when you're singin' from your soul, they fail to see your final goal, they only tell you that you have a long way yet to go." No doubt a reflection by Clark on his own career. I hadn't heard this album since 1973 when I was living in London and found a vinyl copy here about 5 years back in a second hand store. I don't think it's ever been released on CD.

I loved Ralph McTell's "Streets of London" when I first heard it though my fondness for it waned after I realized that musically it is a ripoff of Pachelbel's Canon. You can hear a nice little audio sample (which works well) by clicking on the above Web Page link if you're interested. BTW McTell is not the only one to have ever ripped this off - it's a great piece of music. A piano interpretation of Pachelbel's Canon appears on George Winston's "December" which was mentioned here recently.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 23:03:34 CET 2002 from spider-wq064.proxy.aol.com (205.188.200.184)

Calvin

I've read a few places Dave that the 1973 "reunion" album wasnt a reunion at all, but a patchwork album thrown together by the record company to look like a reunion. Ill look up a source if you'd like. As great as the early Byrd albums are Im equally as fond of the McGuinn/White years, Clarence WHite is one heck of an underrated player. And the Gram Parson album doesnt need anyone to trumpet it, I can listen to Sweethearts of the Rodea every day.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 22:26:21 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tk053.proxy.aol.com (64.12.107.43)

butch

From: still in the mountains,,,

CORRECTION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

FRIDAY,,, The Trenton show @ Conduit is 11 pm,, NOT 11:30 pm,,

&

The BODLES show is @ 9pm,,,,,SATURDAY,,,,

SORRY for ANY INCONVENIENCE,,,,,,,, bd


Posted on Wed Feb 20 20:27:28 CET 2002 from on-tor-blr-ahp-13-117.look.ca (209.161.237.117)

Wittg.

From: Same old same old

Make that 'Springhill Mine Disaster" , not Springfield. The Simpsons came to Toronto last week and I'm obviously a bit overwhelmed.

4.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 20:25:58 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Gene Clark did indeed participate in several Byrd reunion projects. In 1973 all the original members recorded an album together that wasn't all that bad, however, the magic they once had was missing. Later, in 1979 & 1980, McGuinn, Clark & Hillman released two very disappointing albums.

As I mentioned awhile back, Gene Clark's best solo work, in my opinion, is his 1971 A&M "White Light" album. Produced by Jesse Edwin Davis, it features some great original songs, along with a fine cover version of "Tears of Rage".


Posted on Wed Feb 20 20:25:43 CET 2002 from a59107.upc-a.chello.nl (62.163.59.107)

Martin Alberts

From: Holland
Web page

Maybe your are interested in my updated Everly Brothers Curiosities site ? Have fun............


Posted on Wed Feb 20 20:12:49 CET 2002 from paprika.mcc.wwwcache.ja.net (194.82.103.142)

Roger Woods

From: Birmingham, UK

JQUEST - Ewan McColl wrote Dirty old town indeed, but Ralph McTell wrote Streets of London. Ewan McColl wrote a number of now classic folk songs including "The First Time Ever I Saw Your Face," "Dirty Old Town," "The Shoals of Herring," "Freeborn Man" and "The Manchester Rambler." He wrote plays and played the banjo too.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 20:11:08 CET 2002 from on-tor-blr-ahp-13-117.look.ca (209.161.237.117)

Wittgenstein

From: Go Canada !

Ewen MacColl definitely didn't write 'Streets of London'. That was Ralph McTell (no relation to Blind Willie). He did write 'The Springfield Mine Disaster' which was a well-known folk song about a horrible event in Nova Scotia in the '50's. MacColl also stands out in my mind for writing perhaps the most virulent attack ever on the young Bob Dylan. MacColl thought Dylan's lyrics were trash and wholly unpoetic. His diatribe may have been an influence on the famous 'Judas' shout at Manchester, this according to Greil Marcus anyway, but I don't agree. MacColl just couldn't stand the whole Dylan phenomena, while the other had to do with electric guitars and the Hawks. I can't remember for sure, but I think that I read MacColl's outburst in Sing Out magazine.

Roger McGuinn won't go out with Crosby and Hillman as The Byrds. He probably thinks that it's a no-win situation. It's nice to see that he and Crosby get along after all the acrimony in '67 and '68. I think it would be wonderful if they reunited and did a tour of small venues. But nostalgia is a tricky act to play. See Rick Nelson

Roger's up for a Grammy this year in the Folk category but the competition looks tough. Also, there's a lot of this Pete Seeger fellow on his new album.

That's 3 Bayou Sam.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 19:58:23 CET 2002 from spider-wg062.proxy.aol.com (205.188.196.47)

Calvin

Mike, Rick Roberts played and sang on the last Byrds album-although he was not credited as a member, at least that is what a few Roberts Bios Ive read have said. I wasnt too impressed by the 1990 songs on the Box Set. They just didnt seem to click together, im remember them being fairly savaged by the critics as well-frankly I always considered Gene Clark the glue of the original line-up, and he unfortunately never gets involved in those Crosby/Hillman/McGuinn projects.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 19:56:37 CET 2002 from dialup-63.209.89.238.dial1.losangeles1.level3.net (63.209.89.238)

jquest

From: San Cl;emente

On E. MacColl's "Sreets of London" - Wasn't there also a great version in the late 70's by Cleo Lane? We might have to get one of the Brits to answer.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 19:54:51 CET 2002 from 56k-la-02-17.dial.qnet.com (209.221.212.128)

Dave the Phone Guy

From: Mono Lake

I heard David Kemper play w/ Jerry's band and w/ Dylan. He is a very good drummer.

Band dynamics or something spoiled the soup mix, it wasn't Kemper's playing.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 19:24:59 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ti064.proxy.aol.com (64.12.101.179)

butch

From: up here in the mts.

ok,,,

Levon Helm & The BarnBurners,,,,,,,,,THIS WEEKEND,,,,,,,

FRIDAY,,, The CONDUIT,, Trenton , N.J.

one show,,, 11:30 pm,,,, ( sorry, i 1st thought there were 2 shows,, but only one,)

SATURDAY,,,,Bodles Opera House,,,,Chester NY,,,, time ???

special guest @ Bodles,, Jimmy Vivino on guitar & piano,,,

See Ya'll There,,, i hope,,,,,,,

Jan, hope youre having FUN !!!!!!!! bd


Posted on Wed Feb 20 19:17:12 CET 2002 from (212.153.193.19)

Ragtime

Thread: Banjo...

Jo met de banjo

En Lien met de mandolien

Kaatje met haar mondharmonicáááátje

A very dear song from the low countries...


Posted on Wed Feb 20 19:12:25 CET 2002 from inktomi2-cdf.server.ntl.com (62.252.32.5)

DAVID G.BARRON

From: NEWPORT, SOUTH WALES

ANY TRUTH IN THE RUMOUR THAT THE LAST WALTZ WILL BE RELEASED AS REMASTERED 5LP SET, IF TRUE IT WOULD BE QUITE SMALL CONSIDERING WHAT CAN BE PUT ON CD.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 19:01:48 CET 2002 from dialup-63.209.89.238.dial1.losangeles1.level3.net (63.209.89.238)

jquest

From: San Clemente

Regarding E. MacColl: didn'he write Dirty Old Town & Streets of London? Best covers I think: S McGowen & Liam Clancy. Bob Dylan on Liam Clancy: the ballad singer ever.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 18:47:20 CET 2002 from du-tele3-134.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.134)

Peter Viney

Some stuff about 6 months ag- Crosby has said he'd do The Byrds again (or at least a Crosby-Hillman-McGuinn). Either Hillman or McGuinn are the hold-out. Can't remember which.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 18:35:30 CET 2002 from du143-1.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.1.143)

Ilkka

From: Nordic Countries
Web page

Thread: BANJO - Welcome to my living room :-) (Click Web page link)


Posted on Wed Feb 20 18:29:09 CET 2002 from spider-tm022.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.52)

Bayou Sam agaion

From: ny

Y'know- IMHO - the other guys in CCR, while very talented, should be very thankful that they hooked up with John. On one of the last CCR albums (I think it's called Mardi Gras), John sat back and Doug Clifford and Stu Cook did a lot of the tunes. Well, the only ones that stood out were the couple that John sang.

I've always put Art Garfunkel in the same boat. The guy has an incredible voice, and he made "Bridge Over Troubled Water" his own. But when he wakes up in his upper east-side apartment and looks out over Central Park, I hope he appreciates hooking up with the great Paul Simon.

Funny story - I work as a photographer at a school photography company - and we do a lot of schools in NYC. We've taken Art Garfunkel's sons photo a few times. The little guy is almost an exact mini-replica of his dad - hair and all. It's cute to see. One time, Art called the office to discuss buying photos, and the girl who answered the phone thought it was a joke at first. Then when the Garfunkel's paid by check, we were bummed out because Mrs. Garfunkel signed the check.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 18:12:01 CET 2002 from spider-tm022.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.52)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

"The Ballad of Jed Clampett" (The Beverly Hillbillies Theme) was done by Flatt & Scruggs of course. There was even an episode of the show that they appeared in that I'd love to get a tape of if I can catch it on a re-run.

The great thing about John Fogerty winning his case against Fantasy Records was the fact that he went into court and defended himself by bringing a guitar and amp with him, and showing the jury how he writes songs and displaying a very logical reason why "Old Man Down The Road" sounds like "Run Through The Jungle" - the same guy wrote them both. I wonder if that court session was taped. I'd love to hear, or see it.

The story about John and Tom Fogerty is a sad one. They had a fued that makes the Levon/Robbie one look like nothing. I remember reading something about John visiting his brother on his deathbed, and Tom saying something about siding with Saul Zaentz as his last thought to John before he died. Very sad baggage for John Fogerty to carry around.

To shift gears a little - on his last album, Fogerty spent alot of time learning to play resonator slide guitar (commonly refered to as a Dobro) for that album. He does a beautiful song, the title of which escapes me now, to his wife in which he plays the Dobro on. I've always loved the sound of a Dobro myself.

Lennon played a mean Dobro on his song, "John Sinclair"


Posted on Wed Feb 20 18:04:38 CET 2002 from (66.200.102.18)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

Alan Edge: It's obvious that the horse in King Harvest was named 'Jethro' in honor of Stand Up, Jethro Tull's fine second album that year.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 18:02:36 CET 2002 from wcs2-pent-2.nipr.mil (206.38.114.100)

Nick

From: Virginia

Mike, thanks for the correction. I couldn't remember when Tom Fogerty passed away but based on the acrimony between band members, if his brother were alive he wouldn't have played with him anyway. I do know that John Fogerty had (has?) very bitter feelings against the other CCR members (including his bro). I've heard him say that but I've never heard any explanation as to exactly why. Does anyone know?


Posted on Wed Feb 20 17:47:15 CET 2002 from (205.245.52.66)

carmen

From: pa

Interesting info on Dylan

Wednesday, February 20, 2002 By Roger Friedman Bob Dylan | | Press Clippings Dylan: Things Have Changed Bob Dylan's preparing for his surprise appearance on the Grammy Awards one week from tonight on CBS. He's nominated for best album with Love and Theft, and he will perform, I am told. But to quote Dylan's recent Oscar-winning song, "Things have changed." One person you won't see next Wednesday night is drummer David Kemper. After five and a half years with Dylan's band, Kemper was abruptly dismissed last month without notice. Kemper, who used to play for Jerry Garcia, joined the Dylan entourage in 1996. He's been part of a tight-knit, small group who are responsible for the Grammy-winning album, Time Out of Mind, as well as the more recent one. According to sources close to the secretive Dylan inner circle, Kemper was told his services were no longer needed by a member of Dylan's management group. "Someone called and said, 'There's been a band change.' That was it." Kemper had received glowing reviews in the Dylan band and, I am told, had no idea he was being replaced. His successor is George Receli.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 16:52:31 CET 2002 from 0-1pool72-67.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.72.67)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Peter: Roger McGuinn, Chris Hillman and David Crosby recorded six new tracks for the Byrds' boxed set in 1990 and the quality was excellent. They have played surprise live appearances in L.A. a time or two since then but seemingly have no interest in recording or touring again as the Byrds. The last I heard--in a bizarre legal twist--the late Michael Clarke's estate wound up with ownership of the name of that band anyway, and some anonymous ensemble sometimes turns up on the Pollstar listings trying to pass themselves off as the Byrds.

The 1985 "Tribute to the Byrds" tour was wonderful from what I have heard. With Gene Clark, Rick Danko and Richard Manuel sharing lead vocals, what could have been disappointing? I'd love to trade for some good quality CD-R copies of any of those shows available.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 16:14:43 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Mention of Ewan MacColl sadly reminded me of his talented daughter, Kristy, who died tragically in December 2000. Her last recording, "Tropical Brainstorm", was released last year. The CD is a delightful mixture of dry British humour set to spicy Latin grooves.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 15:50:14 CET 2002 from dax48.revealed.net (208.16.227.191)

Mike

From: Midwest

Nick: About the CCR Hall Of Fame induction, John did refuse to play with his former bandmates, but not his brother. His brother had passed awy in 1990. CCR were inducted in 1993, the same year as Van The Man, coincidentally.

I'm sure John plays banjo. Check out the "Blue Ridge Rangers" cd on which he plas ALL instruments. Great album.

Calvin, I don't think Rick Roberts had any stint in The Byrds. You're probably thinking of The Flying Burrito Brothers with Roberts replacing Gram Parsons in late 1970. Also, Roberts and Michael Clarke were founing members of Firefall. As for John York, he'd previously played with The Mama's and Papa's backup band before joining The Byrds.

As for all of this banjo talk, it's pretty funny. I always like hearing that guy with the arrow and bunny ears playing "Foggy Mountain Breakdown". As for The Byrds, listen to just how good drummer Gene Parsons was on the banjo (Green Apple Quick Step and Bristol Steam Convention Blues). The guy had talent. I think I have a Parsons cd in my collection somewhere. McGuinn wasn't too shabby either. Also, Rusty Young of Poco was good too. Not to mention being an ace on pedal steel and running it thru a lelsie cabinet to make it sound like an organ! I think I have written enough for now. I'm outta here.

Mike


Posted on Wed Feb 20 14:17:16 CET 2002 from ppp-1-224.5800-11.telinco.net (212.1.152.224)

Al Edge

From: Boot Hill

Excellent point Nancy. A real social conscience amongst the post Thatcher/Reagan elite is as rare as Van Morrison grin at a handshaking liaison with a star struck Scouser!

Bill - it was indeed Manchester's own Ewan McColl who penned 'First Time', tho I doubt if even the writer himself ever dreamt his creation could soar as high as it did with Miss Flack's wondrous interpretation. Or was it Mrs Flack. Oh Well. Ah now Peter Green...

Peter - Re Jed Clampett - was Richard's poor demented cart horse in King Harvest named after Jeds own Jethro? Was he actually as nutty as Jed's own Jethro? Or was Jethro simply acting simply? Was the Beverley Hillbillies not completely true then in that case? Are we losing our own marbles? Should we be playing them instead?


Posted on Wed Feb 20 12:23:08 CET 2002 from dial2a-188.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.188)

Hi

Those quasi Byrds played the Horsemen Saloon near Woodstock in or around 1985. It was billed as a Byrds tribute but Richard/Rick did a couple of Band songs....me being a Byrds fan a short while back did a search and found Michael Clark's website which was a grim insight into his alcoholism and sad end.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 11:34:50 CET 2002 from i249-009.nv.iinet.net.au (203.59.249.9)

Nancy

From: Australia

Back to Pete Seeger for two seconds (promise).....better he be rich and privilaged WITH a social conscience than be rich and privilaged WITHOUT a social conscience :)

You don't have to be stony poor and wretched to be credible in efforts intended to improve the lot of others. History has any number of people from elite backgrounds who worked to bring about social reform. People from wealthy backgrounds often have the advantage of having assets such as money, time, education and influence which they can put to good use to bring about change. Compare this to the underprivilaged, who can spend so much time and energy on basic survival alone that there is nothing left for improving their lot in life, let alone fighting for a greater cause.

(Twenty seconds.......sorry)


Posted on Wed Feb 20 10:46:16 CET 2002 from du-tele3-043.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.43)

Peter Viney

Glad to see ‘The Ballad of Jed Clampett’ made it. Used to sing that while riding my bike to school.

The Byrds Tribute Band are bootlegged as Gene Clark “A Star For every stage” – see discography on the site. They also included short-term Band member Blondie Chaplin as well as Rick and Richard. Nicky Hopkins isn’t listed – even better for us, Richard was the keyboard player (at least on May 16 1985 in Evansville where it was recorded). John Yorke and Rick Danko both played bass and guitar, presumably alternating duties. They had originally billed the tour as ‘The Byrds’ which got shot down by Roger McGuinn, so they changed it to The Byrds Tribute Band. But the boot is credited as “Gene Clark & Friends”. As John Fogerty is in the news, it brings back that old Robbie quote that The Band were a group, unlike CCR who he said were John Fogerty + backing musicians. I’d say The Byrds were somewhere between the two, but in spite of such stellar members as Crosby, Hillman, Parsons, both Clark & Clarke, Clarence White, the only constant in their history was McGuinn, and the line up changed considerably. So while I think any three or four were justified as going out as “The Band” I do feel that a “McGuin-less Byrds”would be impossible to justify, even if it was Crosby, both Clark(e)s and Hillman. The only post 1973 line-up to use the name had McGuinn, Hillman and Crosby for an album (I think).

Alan brings back Nostell Priory 1984 – the other gig where Van played with The Band, doing two numbers. Haven’t seen him do Caravan for a long time. His band are famously expected to know as many numbers as Dylan’s. The possibilities list given to one recruit ran to over 200. I was reading the 2001 reviews in Wavelength, and don’t think it was there once. He has some numbers that turn up just once or twice a year, like Madame George, but Caravan seems expunged. Pity. Perhaps the expected acclaim for the TLW re-release will remind him to play it. Whenever he plays in this area someone shouts out “Radio!” between songs. By this he must mean ‘Caravan.’


Posted on Wed Feb 20 10:02:50 CET 2002 from (62.31.64.2)

Al Edge

From: Doddypool

For those who just may be interested - if my American friends aren't already burning effigies of a judge who marked their efforts at the banjo Olympics so disparagingly - the "Do not forsake me post" of 17 th Feb which got swamped in an avalanche of banjos was an account of a time I bunked [climbed over the fence for you folks] backstage at a festival where The Band - early eighties reincarnation - where appearing with Van the Man.

I went in search of the boys - saw them all from a respectful awe inducing and gasping distance [Garth in his caravan practising his alto sax, Rick and Richard regaling a group of friends with rick's arms rotatating like a windmill and him not keeping still for a minute or failing to laugh or smile for less than a few seconds].

The confrontation with Van was entirely unplanned as I scuttled up some alley to avoid a security man and came face to face with Mister Grump himself. Hence the piece. A pain in the backside for Van - a highlight of my sad life pour moi!!


Posted on Wed Feb 20 09:50:53 CET 2002 from h0050ba8ceef5.ne.mediaone.net (24.61.49.141)

Long Distance Operator

There was a quasi-Byrds lineup featuring Rick, Richard, and Nicky Hopkins?!? I'm shocked, and very intrigued! How did it sound? If anybody has any boots, I'd be very eager to arrange a trade! Shoot me an email if you're interested...


Posted on Wed Feb 20 07:45:05 CET 2002 from dc-58-115.bpb.bigpond.com (203.40.58.115)

Bill

Left Banke's Michael Brown was really Michael Lookofsky, whose father, Harry, plays on the Bobby Charles Bearsville LP co-produced by Rick Danko.

Didn't Seeger brother-in-law Ewen McColl write "The First Time"? The first version I heard was on the first LP I ever owned - Lightfoot's first solo. The definitive version for me, though, is Roberta Flack's - the highlight of her career as far as I'm concerned. Flack's partner shortly after that, Eric Mercury, was one of the greatest talents of the Toronto R&B scene when the Hawks were around.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 04:54:23 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp0773.dialsprint.net (63.187.11.11)

jeffrey

Didn't Jed Clampett write a tune called "Deliverance"?, which was then stolen by Pete Seeger,then adapted and arranged by Bela Fleck, that famous, sacriligious, jazz musician, who , rumor has it, has called Pete Seeger a"hick"? Just checking.........


Posted on Wed Feb 20 03:19:49 CET 2002 from 0-1pool72-1.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.72.1)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Speaking of the Byrds, Sundazed has just released a two CD set called THE PREFLYTE SESSIONS, containing an amazing array of the earliest recordings of the original five members of that seminal Los Angeles band. Lots of the tracks have never been officially released--and some I have never even heard on Byrds' bootlegs. The documentation in the 50 page booklet is as good as the best stuff from Rhino (and that's as good as archival music gets).

Thanks to an import sale at the online retailer CD NOW, I also finally picked up the 1973 reunion album titled simply BYRDS and an interesting European collection called THE BYRDS PLAY THE SONGS OF BOB DYLAN that includes bonus tracks not available on an earlier edition with the same title. One track that I don't think has ever appeared in the US is a fine live version of "It's Alright Ma (I'm Only Bleeding)" from the Clarence White-era Byrds.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 01:27:04 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tk022.proxy.aol.com (64.12.107.27)

Calvin

Dave, this is neither here nor there, but as Mike Clarke and Gene Clark were original members of the Byrds, with Gene being one of the primary songwriters early on, and Rick Roberts and John York both doing stints in the group, can it really be called a "tribute band"-I mean they were all legitimate members-Gene Clark one of the truly important ones.


Posted on Wed Feb 20 00:13:22 CET 2002 from spider-wa011.proxy.aol.com (205.188.192.21)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Actually, the banjo has it's roots back in Africa way before finger picks were invented. It was bought to America via the slave trade. Then it transformed into a popular instrument in minstrel shows. It wasn't until the late 1800's that it started to become the instrument we have today. Then there's four-string, and five-string......

It's too bad that some folks associate the banjo with Deliverance. It's probably "Dueling Banjos", and "The Ballad of Jed Clampett" that are the only tunes that non-banjo fans know (Eric Weissberg was correct Peter V.). You know what always bugged me - the cut of "Dueling Banjos" from Deliverance is actuall a banjo and a guitar. It should have been called "Dueling Five-Strings" or something.

Hey - two posts from 'ol Witt in about a week.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 23:29:55 CET 2002 from du-tele3-031.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.31)

Peter Viney

Hank: many thanks indeed. Lost your e-mail address. It's on non-stop rotation here.

We got right through the banjo debate without mentioning the original Duelling Banjos man from the Deliverance OST - isn't that Eric Weissberg (can't be bothered to lookit up)? I used to have the OST on tape, but never played it as it reminded me too much of the movie, which made me resolve to head for a crossbow if anyone ever said, 'Hey, we always handcuff ourselves to trees while listening to banjo music …" And no one mentioned the Dylan connection there. Or our very own Pete Rivard from the Guestbook. But enough on banjos.

At the Fogerty R&R Hall of fame induction, the three guitarists were John Fogerty on acoustic Bruce Springsteen on rhythm and Robbie Robertson on lead. Robbie sang with Bruce and John F on Born on the Bayou.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 23:11:52 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

John Fogerty's decision not to perform Creedence songs for many years was his by choice and rooted in the bitter history of CCR's contract with the Fantasy label. The acrimony between Mr. Fogerty and Fantasy impresario, Saul Zaentz dates back many years. Mr. Fogerty was not happy with the CCR contract they signed with Fantasy in 1964. They battled over royalties and other matters before Fogerty left CCR to pursue a solo career. In order to get out of his Fantasy contract, he unwisely gave up the publishing rights to his songs, subsequently leading to his later reluctance to perform CCR material.

If this wasn't enough, Mr. Zaentz later sued Fogerty over his solo recording of "Old Man Down The Road", asserting that it infringed upon Fogerty's previous song "Run Through The Jungle", to which Zaentz owned the copyright. So Mr. Fogerty essentially had to defend himself against the unique contention that he had plagiarized himself. Fogerty eventually prevailed, but it's small consolation to see his Creedence work controlled by others who freely license the songs for use in commercial advertising.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 23:05:57 CET 2002 from (12.34.17.194)

Johnny Flippo

Top 10 Banjo Players (in no particular order)

1)Charlie Poole

2)Tommy Thompson (no, not the politician)

3)Dock Boggs

4)Mike Seeger

5)Uncle Dave Macon

6)Fred Van Epps

7)Mark Ribot

8)Clarence Ashley

9)Gus Cannon

10)Walt Koken


Posted on Tue Feb 19 22:57:07 CET 2002 from dhcp58139.sunyocc.edu (204.168.58.139)

FUNK!!! freddy funk

From: checking my ol washtub full a minnows

VINEY??? Just curious. Have you ever considered taking up the banjo. You could skip the plays for serious banjo practice time.. DOCTOR PEPPER!!! Where are you??? HOME ALONE? Lets hear about it pal.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 22:54:30 CET 2002 from spider-ti044.proxy.aol.com (152.163.194.194)

Nick

From: Virginia

For the record, Fogerty won a million dollar lawsuit against Fantasy records and after the victory uttered the classic words in Rolling Stone, "Let's go have a drink on Fantasy records". Great songwriter of course. When Creedence was inducted into the R&R Hall Fogerty refused to play with the other members of Creedence (which included his own brother). He played with Springsteen and I think Duck Dunn and Steve Cropper (maybe even Booker T.). Hollow as hell but what a feud!


Posted on Tue Feb 19 21:50:48 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

It would be amusing if Robbie played on John Fogerty's CD, seeing how Fogerty's fans feel he has been ripped off by the music industry business types even more so than some of the members of The Band seem to feel they have been robbed. He makes nothing from his old Creedence tunes, will get nothing from the new box set release and for a while he could not even play his own songs in concerts.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 20:18:19 CET 2002 from (130.219.229.173)

BK

From: nj

Just read somewhere that John Fogerty is releasing a new CD this year on Dreamworks records. I wonder if RR has any involvement or not. It would be great if he were playing a little bit on it, although Fogerty generally doesn’t have guests on his records. But hey, ya never know….

I don’t know if either of them plays the banjo, though (JCF must… right?)


Posted on Tue Feb 19 19:09:55 CET 2002 from m198214176085.austin.cc.tx.us (198.214.176.85)

pehr

Dreamed last night RR came to town on tour in a bus with a pick up band of unknown rockers. He played some club with these guys and it was balls to the walls blues and R&B. It really rocked. He sang some but mostly did instrumentals. He was really dark, Dark shades, dark clothes and not really pleasant. He was on tour and hated it but had a job to do and they did a Link Wray kind of thing. loud as hell. He was the age he is now but kind of like the carny character, a little slimy. After the show I hung out with some of those guys outside the club. My twin sister came up to RR and unloaded on him saying all that spiritual Native american stuff was a bunch of crap, he was a lowlife creep and she layed it on really thick. Kind of blew my mind. Damn, but that was a hell of a show! club was about 1/2 full.

oh well thats about it. just checkin in.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 18:05:48 CET 2002 from on-tor-blr-ahp-12-115.look.ca (209.161.232.243)

Wittgenstein

From: from deep inside

I quite like Billy Bragg's version of "Walk Away Renee", the song written by Mike Brown of The Left Banke. Billy doesn't actually sing the song per se, but he tells a rather amusing and poignant tale of love gone bad while Duane Tremelo nicely picks the original melody on guitar. This appeared on a 6 track EP "Levi Stubb's Tears" back in '86

"Walk Away Renee" has had a good run since the original came out in 1966. The Four Tops gave it the Motown treatment and Ricki Lee Jones did everyone a service by recording it on her 10" LP "Girl At Her Volcano". Ricki actually enunciated the words so that the obscure lyrics could finally be heard. I always wondered why the original was recorded so muddily by The Left Banke. And yet, the song was burned into our brains, one of those classics of AM radio, the sort of piece that if it comes up while I'm 'driving along in my automobile', I feel glad.

That 'Byrds Tribute' band that David Powell mentioned below has definitely got to be the low point in the careers of all concerned. I mean I love The Byrds, but guys.....?!


Posted on Tue Feb 19 17:11:21 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

It's distressing to read that the sound of the banjo, unfortunately, reminds Chester of one of those boys squealing like a pig up in North Georgia.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 17:02:45 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Until the mid to late 1920s, the banjo, rather than the guitar, was the prominent stringed, rhythm instrument in jazz & pop bands. This was because the banjo was louder, if not brash, and could be heard amongst the brass & reeds. In the late 1920s, due to better microphones and recording techniques, the guitar began to take the place of the banjo. It was also around this time that the guitar began to be featured as a lead, solo instrument. Later, with amplification, the guitar became even more prominent and the banjo virtually disappeared from jazz.

I recently ran across a bootleg Byrds CD from a live concert at the Boston Tea Party in 1969. The Byrds line-up at that time featured Clarence White on lead guitar, Gene Parsons on drums and John York on bass, along with Roger McGuinn. In addition to "This Wheel's On Fire" and "I Shall Be Released", the Byrds also performed "Long Black Veil". The latter featured John York on lead vocals, rather McGuinn, along with White, Parsons and McGuinn singing harmony. Although I still prefer The Band's version, the Byrds rendition is quite good, with a terrific Tele B-string bender solo by Clarence White.

Bassist John York performed with the Byrds for just a little over a year, from 1968-1969. In 1985 he joined Gene Clark and Michael Clarke in the Byrds "tribute" band that also featured Rick Danko, Richard Manuel, Rick Roberts and Nicky Hopkins. With Rick handling the bass chores, John York played 12-string guitar.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 16:22:13 CET 2002 from 0-1pool216-38.nas32.somerville1.ma.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.216.38)

crow

From: landoftheband
Web page

Nice to see some discussion about Pete Seeger in the old GB. I had the privelege of recording a few sides with him in 1986 while working with singer/songwriter Denis Farley. Denis brought a remote truck to Pete's sloop club and we recorded a few of his tunes. Purely ad lib, he asked me if i had a song I wanted to record. I had just written one, but I thought it wouldn't be that easy to follow because of some quirky chord changes. I went ahead anyway and Pete just nailed it! He knew instinctively where it was going by listening to the melody and was right there for every change. I was quite impressed by his musicianship. The track was never released - I think I have a copy on cassette somewhere...One of Denis' songs from that session (Sandy Beach) is included on his "Moodswing Woogie" CD.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 14:50:06 CET 2002 from p508539e7.dip.t-dialin.net (80.133.57.231)

ulbiman

From: germany

Hello !! And if you don´t have enuff of that cool banjo stuff, go and get the "Pickin´on...." series by Dennis Caplinger and his friends they perform songs on a special bluegrass tribut album (each)from...Byrds, Pink Floyd, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Stones, Santana, ZZ Top ans so on..... So now let´s try another instrument or let´s talk about....??? Please notice that a new Neil Young cd is to be released in march !! Hey,hey, my, my rock´n roll will never die !


Posted on Tue Feb 19 14:49:33 CET 2002 from imsbbcf05c.netvigator.com (203.198.24.5)

Chris Far East

From: Hong Kong

Normally just read through the always interesting comments but seeing the banjo I thought I'd contribute something. Over Chinese New Year holiday in Hong Kong I brought 2 new CDs for listening pleasure: Gillian Welch and Ryan Adams. I must say the first appeals a lot more to me than the second. It just happens that Gillian Welch plays a fine banjo. Adds a lot of atmosphere and contrast to Dave Rawlings guitar. The first time I heard Ms. Welch was her stunning version of Gram Parson's Hickory Wind. One scribe described it as making the song sound "spooky and as old as the hills". She's a real talent! I'm also a professional musicain (guitarist)and teacher and have at times played the banjo in orchestral productions. In the 1920-40s composers often used the banjo to portray "the jazz age" and/or country "sensibilities". The Threepenny Opera by Kurt Weill and Crazy for You by George Gershwin are both productions I've played in recently. Like the mandolin it has a more metallic cutting tone than the guitar, and was not so easily swamped by the other instruments. We're talking pre-elecrtic guitar days here. Other famous 20th century composers such as Shostakovich and Hindemith also sometimes used the instrument in their scores. Ryan Adams work seems to be 60s & 70s pastich/retro. I think his influences are a bit to obvious and undigested. The only Band in fluence seems to be on a track which has got a "The Weight" feel. Give me the real thing, or someone like Lucinda Williams, any day.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 14:21:48 CET 2002 from spider-wg014.proxy.aol.com (205.188.196.24)

Brien Sz

From: Nj

Will the Circle Be UnBroken Vol.I is an excellent 2 cd set that has a great mix of Bluegrass and not overly twangy country music. You can hear Earl Scruggs do some magical banjo work as well as John McEuen BUT Banjo doesn't dominate this cd. No, you get a great assortment of some fine fiddle, dobro and mandolin playing as well. All of it performed by Old School Bluegrass folk such as Doc Watson, Roy Acuff, Pete "Oswald" Kirby, Vasar Clements, and Mother Maybelle Carter to name just a few. The Nitty Gritty Dirt Band realeased it in 1972. A 5 Star Effort!!!!


Posted on Tue Feb 19 09:30:50 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

SITE


Posted on Tue Feb 19 09:22:48 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

I like this sight but don't ya think were beating the hell out of Seeger and the banjo, maybe it's me I'm not a fan of either, I'm not a folk fan and everytime I hear a banjo it reminds me of the canoe trip the boys in Deliverance experianced, not exactly an endorsement for the banjo. staying awake rocking to a little Led Zep, Rock n Roll, how bout Bonham on the skins


Posted on Tue Feb 19 09:14:16 CET 2002 from (194.100.60.131)

Kalervo

From: Finland

Brown Eyed Girl: We' ll be friends, although Finland may surprise Canada in Olympics icehockey! Yes Israel Kamakawiwo'ole was a real fine artist. I hope to get his records more...I have one source from where I have ordered Hawaiian music...I just saw an amazing young Hawaiian ukulele star in a television concert (what a delight it was to see Na Leo, Cyril Pahinui and others live)...Thanks to people like George Winston (whose solo piano album December is one of my all time favourites Christmas records) Hawaiian music gets some recognition.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 07:30:13 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

Mark

From: Up North

Anybody got a copy of the Best Revenge soundtrack? Levon co-starred in this movie & sang (the song was played partially on the radio) Straight Between The Eyes. I'd like to get a first generation copy of this song. If you have it please email me & we'll work out a trade. Mark


Posted on Tue Feb 19 07:23:02 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

Cheney

From: Crandon

For those of you who are interested. There are some Man Outside (AKA Hidden Fear) videos at Half.com This is the movie (shot in Arkansas) that 4 of the Band members were in.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 06:01:39 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp72049.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.199.112)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

UKULELE PLAYERS??? Kalervo.....Since you really like Hawaiian music.....remember I posted before about Israel Kamakawiwoole? He performs a really pure version of OVER THE RAINBOW/WHAT A WONDERFUL WORLD....with a REGGAE GROOVE!.....When you listen to his version....you can feel his pain....I could sense he was hoping that things would change in his life.....He sounded hopeful.....but the challenges in his life were unsurmountable......Unfortunately he died in his late thirties from extreme obesity.....May 20/59-June26/97.....

Norbert:........only in Quebec....:-D

John Donabie: I teach Bob Marley 101.....;-D....For African Heritage month my class did an acrostic poem for Multi-Culturalism......and for the letter M......They came up with Music....Motown....Marley.....Mandela.....Malcolm X......Martin Luther King Jr........I have been reading daily a book on Martin Luther King Jr. and when Dylan's name was mentioned.....they all smiled.....because we have been singing GOD (I changed it to WE) GAVE NAMES TO ALL THE ANIMALS......another REGGAE GROOVE.....Now we're singing SUNSHINE REGGAE by Laid Back just because it's so uplifting.......Anyway, the Caretaker at my school who is of Jamaican heritage borrowed two of my Marley videos that I bought in NYC....since he dubbed for my friends Robbie performing at the Olympics.....He thought the Native Celebration featuring Robbie was absolutely amazing!!........He ended up making a tape for himself!.......He couldn't stop talking about Robbie and the Native dancers.......He understood......what was really happening that night...........However.......he didn't think too much about John and Yoko Ono in Canada which was on the same tape..............but......just for Crabby......I got him to tape a Religious Program right after the Robbie performances........just so he would really feel Irie!


Posted on Tue Feb 19 05:45:10 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

J ~t

I find a good strum incredibly soulful..especially in country music. I simply do not like the sound of a banjo being strummed...that's just not what it was created for.... it sounds unfinished. Grandpa Jones and Pete Seeger stuff just never rang my bell. You're right I do not play banjo..my timing sucks..but I do play guitar and strum the piano some.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 04:40:14 CET 2002 from dialup-65.57.11.104.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.57.11.104)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

In her wonderful book about all things bluegrass, Marilyn Kochman defines bluegrass as "a type of acoustic country music that has evolved from the string bands of the 1920s and 1930s." She also states that "Bluegrass is one of many modern forms of traditional country music--a music with roots extending back to the earliest immigrants from the British Isles." Although people place the birth of bluegrass as early as the late 1930's and as late as the early 1950's, Bill Monroe, the acknowledged father of bluegrass, started playing the WLS Barn Dance tours based out of Chicago in the late 20's early 30's. Besides playing an energetic style of string band country, Bill and his brothers also did some square dancing. There is a great story that Monroe rehearsed a band to his liking for a month for an appearance on the Opry in 1938. That supposedly was the coming out party for blugrass, which Monroe himself said was beyond the "old time" country fare of the day.


Posted on Tue Feb 19 00:00:54 CET 2002 from (62.30.0.2)

Alan Edge

From: Darlington - Pete Seeger/Sid Snot Vicious territory

And we now have the results of the Scouse judge [always open to a bribe - hmmph!]:-

Peter Viney - 5.9/6.0 - one tenth of a point deducted for bringing the fucking thing up in the first place

Yankeeddoodles - 1.0/6.0 - one point awarded to Crabgrass for at least having a sense of hoomer

Synopsis:

Who says the Brits don't produce werld champions. A truly breathtaking performance from a real British know it all. Took on a barrel-load of snarling Yanks and whupped their arses. Yeeha!!

This post btw is my pathetic Scouse attempt at a JOKE!!!!!

I know. I failed. I'll get me coat

:-(

Tomorrows subject; PAUL ROBESON - dig that crazy bass man!!!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 23:58:44 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

BROWN EYED GIRL.......I've been watching your knowledge of music. You should be teaching a course on the history of popular music.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 23:45:00 CET 2002 from bandfan.halden.net (195.70.189.163)

jh

This site will be "left alone" for the rest of the week, as your "janitor" is going to Finland to indulge in saunas, Linux security problems and vodka on ice. Please behave. The guestbook may be slowing down after a day or two if you guys keep up the pace we've seen here recently. If I don't find an Internet cafe or a wireless network to hack into in Helsinki, that is.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 23:36:39 CET 2002 from du-tele3-088.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.88)

Peter Viney

“It turned out nice again” - George Formby’s many hits include ‘Fanlight Fanny,’ ‘Banjo Boy,’ ‘When I’m Cleaning Windows’ (referenced by Van the Man), ‘Leaning on a Lampost’ , ‘Grandad’s Flanellette Nightshirt”and ‘Mr Wu’s A Window Cleaner Now.’ His influenced was limited due to the fact that his style was “difficult to copy” for various physical and musical reasons. I’m sure that all of us Brits are shocked to see him mentioned in the same breath as Pete Seeger, in that George truly was “of the masses and for the masses”.

The name “Darling.” See Rowan Atkinson’s “Blackadder Goes Forth” for why it’s unfortunate!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 23:33:53 CET 2002 from cc5414-a.hnglo1.ov.nl.home.com (212.120.101.7)

YES!!!!!!! Gotscha!

From: an empty barn, empty hands, looking up, smiling ......

Brown Eyed Girl ever seen the sun rise from behind a French mountain? ;-))))

Hey Ilkka, an old house, an old barn, and a lot of work! cheers!

The Band!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 23:28:12 CET 2002 from 0-1pool72-105.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.72.105)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Peter: what is unfortunate about the name "Darling?" The Dillards played a family of socially retarded hillbillies called the Darling family who played magnificent mountain music on the ANDY GRIFFITH SHOW, but I don't think they left a stigma on the name. They, of course, employed the banjo wizard Doug Dillard who later played with the Byrds and Gene Clark.

Back to the banjo thread, I forgot about Jerry Garcia's fine experiments on that instrument. I once saw him play with David Grisman and Old and in the Way at a mid-1970s bluegrass festival here in Virginia and Garcia held his own even though everyone from Earl Scruggs to Grandpa Jones were on the same bill...


Posted on Mon Feb 18 23:16:53 CET 2002 from 3cust75.tnt48.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.93.75)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

By claiming only 50% of the credit Seeger was far more generous than another songwriter we might mention!! And I guess without Pete The Band would've never recorded those great Willie Dixon tunes on "HOTH."

Pete's brother Mike Seeger was a founding member of the New Lost City Ramblers a very fine '60s folk band dedicated to shedding light on Apalachian "Old Timey Music" while Pete's sister Peggy moved to England and married folk traditionalist Ewan McColl - father of the late Kirsty McColl. So now there's a Pete/Brit connection as well!!

I think that pretty much wraps up the Seeger thread - now on to George Formby. Richard Thompson does one of his humorous little ditties, "Why Don't Women Like Me" and although he jokes about Formby having little musical talent I think he really does have quite a bit of respect for him. Formby, of course, played the ukelele - a more modern day American counterpart being the late Tiny Tim who, of course, recorded with The Band in the Basement. My guess is that Tim was turned on to playing the uke by Arthur Godfrey who is the only other ukelele player I can think of at the moment. However, I'm certain that this thread can be mined for several days and will turn up many others!!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 22:55:35 CET 2002 from spider-wq031.proxy.aol.com (205.188.200.154)

Harry & Mim

From: Bucks County, PA

Friends: On the banjo thread, although I do NOT consider myself a "deadHead", John Jerome Garcia (Jerry) did play a mean banjo. He started his musical life on the guitar in the late 1950's, and took up the banjo several years later. He became quite accomplished on the instrument and made several road trips to hear and tape his bluegrass idols (Bill Monroe, Ralph Stanley, etc.)

Garcia is "remembered" for his banjo expertise on recordings such as "Old & In the Way" and "High Lonesome Sound".

And Joan Baez would be recording "Waist Deep in the Big MUDDY", although "Bloody" would also be an appropriate title.

We are big lovers of both country & bluegrass music (yes, two VERY DIFFERENT GENRES); however, an upcoming show by Levon & the BarnBurners takes us to the heart & soul, the progenitor of so much American Music, the DEEP BLUES.

Hoping to see Guestbook folks at the Conduit in Trenton, NJ this Friday night for the BB's, we remain,

Mim & Har


Posted on Mon Feb 18 22:40:08 CET 2002 from du-tele3-160.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.160)

Peter Viney

And … icons in the gunsights, these are the bits he got from David’s quoted authors. Thomas Paine- self righteousness. Thoreau – who else could write about a year staring at a nondescript pond peppered with hot puns, ‘I have travelled many miles in Concorde’ must be quoting Rod Stewart there, Steinbeck- in his later years wrote a whole book about a poodle pissing on trees (Travels With Charley), Woody Guthrie- well, he was OK.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 22:18:10 CET 2002 from du-tele3-033.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.33)

Peter Viney

Peter S-B wrote: “Sing Out! Magazine, then the Bible of the folk community … echoed some of Peter Viney's complaints. The bi-line for the article was Seeger's wife, but Seeger eventually admitted he wrote it himself.”

That solves it then. I go away for a couple of days, come back and find Pete Seeger’s been posting in the Guestbook, using my name! What a swine! Then some new guy called Thomas Paine is posting about Brits too. Sounds as if he swallowed a dictionary. Does he mean cord or chord? Thought we were talking music. Bloody hell, don’t you guys appreciate all the tea we send you? Next thing, you’ll be chucking it into Boston Harbour.

Still amazed by the ire that dislike of Seeger arouses. May I commend the words of Bob Dylan? “Don’t follow leaders …”. I’ve got to say Pete Seeger seems to be following me around today somewhat spookily. I picked up that Glen Campbell 12 string album. It mentions Pete Seeger. It mentions Erik Darling, who can’t spell his first name and has an unfortunate second name. (“whose utilization of the 12 string guitar on Walk Right In brought it to the public’s attention.” ) I went to the record store to buy the new Lambchop album. There was Pete Seeger’s Tribute album leering at me from the folk selections rack. I didn’t succumb of course, but noted the not unexpected presence of the even more sanctimonious Billy Bragg. Looking up stuff on The Clancys. Damn me. There he was again. Still, I think I can safely say that his influence on Lambchop is between minimal and zilch. One thing about old Communists though is the desire to share and share alike – which seems to be borne out by the large number of “ands …” in Seeger’s writing credits! Seems like he was a skilled musicologist with an eye for talent. Only took 50% of the credit too!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 20:56:52 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

"...The last cord now is broken, the people of England are presenting addresses against us. There are injuries which nature cannot forgive; she would cease to be nature if she did. As well can the lover forgive the ravisher of his mistress, as the continent forgive the murders of Britain. The Almighty hath implanted in us these unextinguishable feelings for good and wise purposes. They are the guardians of his image in our hearts. They distinguish us from the herd of common animals. The social compact would dissolve, and justice be extirpated from the earth, or have only a casual existence were we callous to the touches of affection. The robber, and the murderer, would often escape unpunished, did not the injuries which our tempers sustain, provoke us into justice."
--Thomas Paine

Pete Seeger, for me, epitomizes the American spirit; often stubborn, cantankerous, radical to the extreme, but always fiercely independent in the pursuit of justice. To truly understand his music, one must realize this. Mr. Seeger, throughout his life, has used the art of music as a form of expression to provoke social consciousness, and as a weapon against all forms of tyranny which oppress the human spirit.

Part Thomas Paine, part Henry David Thoreau, part John Steinbeck and part Woody Guthrie, Pete Seeger found a way to use music for a higher purpose, beyond the commercial restraints of corporate control. Above all, he found a way to get others to sing along with him and enjoy the message, as well as the music.

"Tolling for the rebel, tolling for the rake
Tolling for the luckless, the abandoned & forsaked
Tolling for the outcast, burnin' constantly at stake
An' we gazed upon the chimes of freedom flashing."
--Bob Dylan


Posted on Mon Feb 18 20:30:37 CET 2002 from dial2a-59.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.59)

Hi

PSB's comments about Seeger helping Hopkins, Dixon and other artists reminded me he also helped Rev.Dan Smith and wrote the liner notes on his first album in '71...by the way very much worth checking out....


Posted on Mon Feb 18 20:00:04 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-002paphilp138.dialsprint.net (168.191.210.202)

Peter Stone Brown

From: philly
Web page

Crabgrass, thanks for the mention of the rock and roll hall of fame site.

Concerning the Lucky Strike thing which I doubt happened since the Weavers were blacklisted, the truth is Seeger left the group in 1957 simply to pursue a solo career. The Weavers probably due to the blacklist did not perform all that frequently and their label Vanguard had a habit of releasing albums long (sometimes years) after they were recorded. They also stretched out Seeger's departure over two releases (integrating songs Seeger recorded with that of his replacement, Erik Darling), so it was a long time before Weavers fans were aware he was no longer in the group.

Asides from "The Hammer Song," Seeger is actually responsible for quite a few hits.

As to banjo playing, as with every instrument there are various styles and techniques. Seeger uses the older frailing technique used by most banjo players until Earl Scruggs came along and changed everything with his 3-fingered style of picking.

Seeger has never been one to over-estimate either his singing or his instrumental work and actually doesn't take himself as seriously as many would think. In the mid-sixties, a rather stinging critique of all of Seeger's albums (which were easily in the hundreds) appeared in Sing Out! Magazine, then the Bible of the folk community, which by the way echoed some of Peter Viney's complaints. The bi-line for the article was Seeger's wife, but Seeger eventually admitted he wrote it himself.

Seeger is also responsible for bringing many artists to the forefront as he did with The Clancy Brothers. Some of these artists will surprise some here. The first time I saw Sam Lightnin' Hopkins was at a Pete Seeger concert. Hopkins said it was his first time out of Texas. And he did the same for many other artists including Memphis Slim and Willie Dixon.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 18:47:46 CET 2002 from ppp-3-173.5800-12.telinco.net (212.1.142.173)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

George Formby anyone?

:-)


Posted on Mon Feb 18 18:37:08 CET 2002 from 0-1pool75-180.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.75.180)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Bob Dylan once described Pete Seeger as "saintly" and the two times I met him I understood exactly what Dylan meant. On the other hand, Seeger does--as someone said here--"walk the walk." When asked where he stands on the political spectrum a few years ago Pete simply said, "I am a Communist." I'm sure he wasn't trying to drum up support for Castro or China, just getting some long-due revenge on phonies such as Joe McCarthy and the other assholes who tried to end his career in the 1950s.

Another great day of vindication for Pete Seeger and his music was when the Kennedy Center Honor was bestowed on him a few years ago. The words and music of Roger McGuinn were especially moving that night, and Pete's influence on the Byrds, Arlo Guthie and Dylan are immeasurable.

On the banjo thread, I have to mention Zal Yanovsky of the Lovin' Spoonful and Lowell "Banana" Levinger of the Youngbloods. Levinger's style was one of the quirkiest I ever heard--much like his unusual electric guitar approach. His style was distinctive on both, and especially good for a guy whose real job was as keyboard player (remind you of anyone we know?).


Posted on Mon Feb 18 17:26:15 CET 2002 from 3cust170.tnt52.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.95.170)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn
Web page

I was pretty flipped out after checking the Pete Seeger link at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame site recently mentioned by another poster and didn't realize Pete was an inductee. And I'd forgotten that Seeger had written "The Hammer Song" with Lee Hays - the song which launched the career of Peter, Paul & Mary. Also interesting was the notation that Seeger left the Weavers in 1959 after refusing to record a Lucky Strike cigarette commercial with them. (As I recall, Ronald Reagan did a TV cigarette commercial back in the '50s.)

Anyway, I suggest you check out the link if you haven't yet done so. I've repeated it in the above Web Page.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 16:35:25 CET 2002 from spider-tm033.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.58)

Strummin' Sam

From: ny

C'mon j~t - I wasn't trying to be a guitar authority. I can play guitar, and a little banjo. I have this trigger reaction to the attitude that "faster" or "more" is always better (when it comes to music :-)). There are several different styles of banjo playing. I find it fun to strum the thing, as well as play three-finger style.

Years ago when I was pestering my older uncle to show me something on guitar, he told me that everyone wanted to just play flashy leads, and nobody concentrated on good rhythm playing. That's when I discovered great rhythm playing like Lennon's playing on "All My Loving", and Buddy Holly on "Peggy Sue."

On a diffent subject. I'm typing Levon's interview from the Max Weinberg book so I can send it to Jan for consideration on this site. I'm probably better at pickin' the banjo than typing - so it's taking awhile. It's got some great Levon thoughts in it. Too bad you can't strum a computer keyboard. Wait - let me try = o'pisdjgopijpetogkawEf\er]][re[awawe.

Nah. That's no good.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 16:10:51 CET 2002 from garco.cpe.newsouth.net (64.90.4.86)

Mike Carrico

From: Georgia

On Ringo's recording of "Sunshine Life For Me", on which he is ably assisted by 80% of our guys (where was Richard?), there is a banjo to be heard - played by David Bromberg.

I'm not the biggest Pete Seeger fan, but I respect him for his body of work, and for his speaking out on and standing up for what he believes in. He walks the walk. And I'm still waiting for Joan to cover his "Waist Deep In The Big Bloody"...


Posted on Mon Feb 18 15:59:45 CET 2002 from (216.125.170.206)

Mugs

From: Joliet, IL

I saw Steve Forbert play Saturday evening at Schuba's in Chicago, and he did a song written in memory of Rick Danko with a chorus about Rick being down to earth and wild as the wind. Are any of you familiar with this song?


Posted on Mon Feb 18 15:32:46 CET 2002 from gateway.uhn.on.ca (205.211.160.1)

Dr. J.

From: TO

The actor, George Segal, ("Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf with ET, RB, and SD, other movies and TV of late) plays a mean banjo.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 15:22:00 CET 2002 from zorg138.revealed.net (208.243.237.138)

Mike

From: Iowa

Banjo players? Roger MGuinn wasn't too shabby of a banjo player. But check out Gene Parsons' work. Now there's a hidden talent...drums, sings, banjo, harmonica, etc... n\ Crabby, Steve Martin compared to Wayne Newton? Weak argument on your behalf. Seek out side 2 of "The Steve Martin Brothers" (1981 Warner Bros). All banjo playing. I think he even does a Scrugss tune also. That guy could do more than "strum" a banjo. Side 2 of that album had damn good playing on it. Too bad The Band didn't incorporate one into their arsenal of instruments...I can sort of picture Robbie on banjo and Levon on mandolin, lol! Another feud! Oh well...Tax time here.

Mike


Posted on Mon Feb 18 15:10:25 CET 2002 from host-65.subnet-76.med.umich.edu (141.214.76.65)

Steve Knowlton

From: Ypsilanti

Reaching back a few posts, one thing has always bothered me about "Ohio": the syntax. They sing, "Soldiers are gunning us down, should have been done long ago". I know it's not what they mean, but hearing that, I think, "The soldiers should have gunned us down long ago?"

BTW, don't the "Nixon's coming" sentiments seem a bit feverish considering the times, when Czechoslovakia, South Africa, Chile and other places were showing what a real military crackdown looks like?


Posted on Mon Feb 18 14:56:07 CET 2002 from spider-te041.proxy.aol.com (152.163.195.191)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA
Web page

The most obvious benefit of this Guestbook and its diversity of visitors and musical opinion is the opportunity to learn more about the musicians who shape and reshape our world.

The site above is from the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and provides a nice overview of Pete Seeger's career.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 14:40:25 CET 2002 from gateway.uhn.on.ca (205.211.160.1)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto

Some find preaching, social comment, and finger-pointing offensive or not to their individual liking. Nevertheless, this material is often the fabric of what socially conscious songs concern themselves with. Its obviously hard to come across pleasantly when it is a sermon which is being delivered. It may not be pleasant, but those sermons are important, even by the sometimes imperfect individuals who give them. Hearing the concern is probably in the best interests of those that hear them, if they are receptive. If they are not receptive, there is nothing which is going to make a difference. Now, the medium (the beauty of the melody, the playing of the instruments, the singing voice, the way the words are put together etc..... that is another matter entirely. I am not a huge Peter Seeger fan (though I appreciate his contribution to the medium and even admire some of his playing), but being receptive to the challenge of improving my social consciousness, I admire his efforts. The same goes for my clergyman, even though religion is not my forte. If this sounds like preaching or finger-pointing, my sincerest apologies.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 14:33:41 CET 2002 from (66.200.102.18)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

'Another Pleasant Valley Sunday...Rows of houses that are all the same, and know one seems to care...' The Monkees. I guess they were communists too! Don't know enough about Pete Seeger or banjos to join the fray, but I'll leave the performer with some artistic license and not take every lyric at face value. Just got back from a weekend in Charleston, SC. We were staying at the staid Mills House but were psyched that it was blues weekend, celebrated in their courtyard too. Two of their performers were great, with one dedicating a set to Koko Taylor and performing Strawberry Wine! Another did some Clarence 'Frogman' Henry, who I just found out is performing at the New Orleans Jazz Fest. the same days I am there.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 14:28:10 CET 2002 from host-65-164-8-8.co.erie.ny.us (65.164.8.8)

G-MAN

Sat. nite, 2/16, Jim Weider and the Honky Tonk Gurus put on a super show at the Town Crier; hope it was recorded this time!!!! Sid "El Sid" McGuinnis joined the crew, as did the one and only, Tom Izzo!! Hope some GB'ers can make their way to the show at Tribeca Blues!! We know ALL the Road Warriors will be there!!! Thanks Gurus for the GREAT shows!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 14:03:56 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp69001.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.187.112)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

BANJO MUSIC: Doc Watson.....Lonesome Banjo
Pete Seeger....OLD TIME RELIGION....Band connection....Rick Danko....TLW

April 13, 1972 Pete Seeger in Rolling Stone...."Some may find them merely diverting melodies. Others may find them incitements to Red revolution. And who will say if either or both is wrong? Not I."

April 1999....Pete Seeger travelled to Cuba to accept the Felix Varela Medal, that nation's highest honour for "his humanistic and artistic work in defense of the ENVIRONMENT and AGAINST RACISM."....Yes....Pete stood for something....when most sit on the fence or don't stand up against anything.....I think saying nothing when injustices occur is just as political as standing up for something.........:-D.....Peter Viney also stands up for something.....great taste in music....If he doesn't happen to like Seeger....so what? We're all entitled to like whoever rocks our world.....aren't we?


Posted on Mon Feb 18 13:53:30 CET 2002 from du-tele3-099.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.99)

Peter Viney

The Clancy Brothers & Tommy Makem at Carnegie Hall is one I have on genuine 60s vinyl and CD. Bob Dylan rewrote two of the songs (The Parting Glass became Restless Farewell, and The Patriot Game became With God on Our Side). He was close to the Clancy’s at the time though I’m sure he’d cite an earlier obscure version. But a lift is a lift. If rock composers do it they end up in court. If folksingers do it they’re “drawing upon tradition.” As a 16 year old I thought With God on Our Side a great improvement, but I now realise that The Patriot Game is less “sanctimonious”(you said it Crabbie, not me). The Patriot Game was played throughout the brilliant play “Lieutenant of Inishmore” which I saw last summer. It’s back in London at the moment and will tour. It’s one of the major plays of the last few years, one of the funniest and certainly the most gory. As to With God on Our Side, the version Daniel Lanois produced for the Neville Brothers has to be the definitive version of the song. Funny, playing the Clancy’s CD this morning – as so often reminded to listen to stuff by the GB- some of the banjo playing is pretty much the kind of strumming that I don’t like (Legion of the Rearguard). But The Parting Glass is at least as good a song as Restless Farewell too- whenever we play any one of three versions, we end up playing all three. My wife believes The Dubliners version to be far superior to the Clancy Brothers (the voice sounds genuinely old and wasted), and we also check out the Dylan version in comparison. Another thing that comes out is how thoughtless some of the revivals of old IRA songs would sound nowadays. It’s all very well standing in Carnegie Hall shouting “Three cheers for the bold IRA!” to major applause, but not so funny if you know some innocent who was killed or maimed by IRA bombers in the 80s or 90s. Of course The Clancy Brothers were singing songs of the 1920s orv 1930s , often with comic intent (Johnson’s Motor Car) rather than about modern urban terrorists.

Just to be even-handed, Billy Bragg is vastly more offensive to my ears than Pete Seeger!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 12:51:57 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

Yes...but that not all Robbie done was just strum. For someone that has "Strapped On Enough Guitars To Know" as Bayou "What's wrong with strumming" Sam has....well...enough said.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 11:48:40 CET 2002 from vir.apex.net.au (210.9.66.10)

Bill

My favourite song about suburban conformia is by the Bonzo Dog Band: something like "My pink half of the drainpipe keeps me separate from you".

A great great rock song with banjo is "Dig A Hole", a minor hit by the Hans Staymer Band around '72 or '73. They rate a mention in Jan's discography because their first LP includes a version of "WS Walcott Medicine Show". Though Vancouver based, the group included two phenomenal players from the SW Ontario sub-Hawks circuit - guitarist (and banjoinst) Ed Patterson and organist Robbie King. Between Ontario and the Staymer Band they were in a hit Motown group, Bobby Taylor and the Vancouvers, with Tom Chong of Cheech and Chong fame. Far out!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 08:07:12 CET 2002 from spider-wk032.proxy.aol.com (205.188.198.162)

Donna

From: PA

Friday night, at Mexicali Blue's, Jim Weider and The Honky Tonk Gurus, were on fire! Just pure talent on that stage!

3/1, The Gurus will be playing Tribeca Blues! Brown Eyed Girl, get your dancing shoes on! Any other GB'ers going to this show?


Posted on Mon Feb 18 07:59:38 CET 2002 from spider-ta064.proxy.aol.com (152.163.205.74)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

......and Bill Keith.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 07:57:46 CET 2002 from spider-ta064.proxy.aol.com (152.163.205.74)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

j~t = do you actually play the guitar or banjo - it sounds like you don't. Check out Robbie's strumming on "Who Do You Love.". Just as important to the tune as the leads.

Another great banjoist - Don Reno. Also, Roy Clark.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 07:31:55 CET 2002 from 1cust117.tnt48.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.92.117)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

I'd forgotten about Steve Martin who plays banjo expertly as does Wayne Newton. I saw Wayne do his Vegas show as a free concert about 18 years ago on the plaza of the now vanished Twin Towers. No, I'm not a fan of his but he can play banjo quite well - I was surprised.

As for Bela Fleck - he can play well but the banjo just isn't a jazz instrument (unless it's a tenor banjo in a Dixieland band). His attempts leave me cold.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 07:22:07 CET 2002 from pool-207-68-84-230.char.east.verizon.net (207.68.84.230)

The Doctor

From: WV
Web page

Hi to all! I am looking for copies of the Bands shows from Mountain Stage in 1994 and 1995. I would especially like the complete tape of the 1994 show with Cowboy Junkies and Kieran Kane. Thanks for your help.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 07:08:33 CET 2002 from 1cust113.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.113)

jeffrey

One more time, on the subject of banjos and who can really play em.......www.tonyfurtado.com nothing like you've ever heard.........


Posted on Mon Feb 18 06:45:54 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

That gray haired guy with the arrow thru his head always reminded me of Pete Seeger to...had about as much musical talent also. There is a big dfference between "strumming" a banjo and playing a banjo just as there is a big difference between "strumming" a guitar and actually playing one ! I owned one John Stewart record back in the late seventies...all the titles to the songs had the word "Wind" in them....I never owned another.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 06:31:53 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

BAYOU--- Agree on Neil's Ohio, exactly what I had in mind when I was commenting on his latest...A little more on Ohio, I was watching a csny bio and according to Crosby when Time mag did the cover story of Kent with the pic of the young woman kneeling over a dead student he brought the magazine over to Neil's house, according to Crosby Niel looked at the Cover went for a walk in the woods and when he came back, penned on the inside of the mag was Ohio, Crosby imediatly called Nash and told him to get the studio booked asap, they recorded it the next day and the rest is history. Won't get into the debate on who can sing and who can't other than I agree with whoever wrote in here in regard's to Dylan, does he have a great voice and the answer to that is no, can he sing, absolutley, who could sing his music better than Dylan ?


Posted on Mon Feb 18 06:19:28 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

Ed Blayzor

From: NY

It`s not Peter V.`s attack on Pete Seeger`s music that has upset a few of us, its his attack on him as as person.Trust me Peter V. Seeger does not act "holier than thou", if anything he is very encouraging of younger musicians like myself,and of all types of music- not just "folkies". In general Peter V. I enjoy most of your posts here in the GB ,this time you should have thought a little before posting. One question Peter V., are you a musician? BTW last night the Honky Tonk Gurus smoked the Towne Crier, I`ve seen this band too many times to count and they still just amaze me.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 06:09:41 CET 2002 from 209-239-207-10.oak.jps.net (209.239.207.10)

Phil

From: Ca

There was a gray haired guy in the late 70's who played the banjo with bunny ears and an arrow thru his head. He was pretty good. What ever became of him ?


Posted on Mon Feb 18 05:24:39 CET 2002 from spider-wg053.proxy.aol.com (205.188.196.43)

Rick S.

From: Suffern, NY

Best Gurus' show ever at Towne Crier, Pawling on Saturday night. Place was packed. The look on Sid McGuinness' face as he watched Jim Weider play said it all.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 05:12:59 CET 2002 from spider-wg031.proxy.aol.com (205.188.196.31)

Brien Sz

From: nj

Good banjo playing i can handle - it's those damn bagpipes that have me runnin for the hills - sounds like a bag full of kittens being tossed from a mountain top as they bounce there way down to the valley floor.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 04:34:30 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

Wasn't it Pete Seeger that upon hearing Dylan and The Hawks first playing at Newport ran to his car, rolled the windows up tight and held his ears and screamed ! If you're going to talk about "guru's of the banjo" mention Ralph Stanley or Sonnie Osborne for god sake ....and please try not to clump bluegrass and country music in the same catagory.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 03:54:45 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-001castocp0340.dialsprint.net (63.187.1.86)

jeffrey

I think to sum up the banjo/ Seeger controversy, Whaddya call a banjo that ends up in the dumpster. Perfect pitch! Did I get that right.........???????????


Posted on Mon Feb 18 02:45:42 CET 2002 from 3cust40.tnt38.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.87.40)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Like it or not, Pete Seeger is one of the great father figures of folkdom carrying on Woody Guthrie's legacy after his illness and inspiring the early folk music gatherings around the fountain in Greenwich Village's Washington Square Park which also helped popularize the '50s Beat Poets and writers. Bob Dylan certainly gleaned and synthesized elements of both in his music while Peter, Paul & Mary melded the "beat look" with the folk song tradition. Prior to Dylan and PP&M there would have been no Kingston Trio popularizing folk music (and bringing acoustic intruments into the mainstream - incidentally, John Stewart much discussed here of late played banjo during his many years and albums with the KT and wrote many of their best original songs) had there been no Weavers (Pete's early '50s folk group). Hence, there would have been no "Folk Boom" in pop music (which took over the airwaves when early rock and roll had petered out (no pun intended, I swear!!)

The Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem (Makem plays banjo btw) were brought into the spotlight by guess who? Pete Seeger! Pete played banjo on their first album (and huge commercial success) "The Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem at Carnegie Hall." (I recall an Irish teenage friend of mine who loved the Clancy's but didn't relish the idea of "commie" Pete Seeger playing with them. Eventually, he became a priest - my friend, not Pete Seeger). There was a PBS documentary on the Clancy's and Tommy Makem a few years back and Dylan was interviewed on camera for a minute - he said he was a big fan of theirs.

Deadheads - didn't Jerry play banjo? Another banjoist, original Incredible String Band member Clive Palmer - their first album was voted the Best Folk Album of 1965 in Britain as I recall.

Some folks would probably label lots of Dylan songs as "sanctimonious." Maybe "When The Ship Comes In," "With God On Our Side," "Masters of War," "Blowin' In The Wind." If someone's dream is to live in a little box or own a condo that's fine - but maybe they should be exposed to a bit of what else is out there in the world. The point of "Little Boxes" is that we're all going leave here in one so why not explore life a little more before we wind up there? As Dylan once said, "I'll let you be in my dream if I can be in yours."

Crabgrass has spoken!!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 02:37:44 CET 2002 from dialup-64.158.84.92.dial1.buffalo1.level3.net (64.158.84.92)

G-MAN

BTW--Jim Weider and the Honky Tonk Gurus,,and friends put on two killer LIVE shows!Thanks for the GREAT time(s)!!


Posted on Mon Feb 18 02:12:15 CET 2002 from on-tor-blr-ahp-12-41.look.ca (209.161.232.169)

Wittgenstein

From: A box

I'm really enjoying this Pete Seeger controversy. With regards to "Little Boxes", it was written by a Communist. Have you ever seen pictures of Russian suburbs? They're full of big boxes! And all look just the same.

I remember reading that The Kinks Ray Davies bummed out a lot of people in Britain with "Shangri La", another sort of put-down of middle class conformity. Of course, God Dylan (Godzimma?) always put the middle class dream down "Try to be a suck sess" but no one here wants to admit that, just as we don't think that "Mr. Jones" could ever refer to ourselves. Cause we're too hip right?

Anyway, I'm just coming down to the demonstration to get my fair share of abuse. I'd like to point out that for a lot of people from my generation, the long, strange musical trip began with Pete. I've read Crosby's book "Stand And Be Counted" and you know he admires Seeger because Seeger always took a stand, used his music to advance civil rights, integration, peace, and the environment. (I love Chuck Berry too, but what did he ever stand for? Rockin' in Boston?) Pete Seeger popularized the 12-string guitar, as played by Leadbelly, and developed quite a nice personal style, as in "Living In The Country". My first instrument was the 5-string banjo and like everyone else Pete's red book "How To Play...." was my teacher. He never claimed to be the bluegrass virtuoso that Scruggs is, but he plays various styles well enough to sustain a sixty year career.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 01:50:11 CET 2002 from ip245.halifax9.dialup.canada.psi.net (154.5.34.245)

Pam Marsh

From: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
Web page

Hello to Levon from Nova Scotia. Pam Marsh here, I met you at the Misty Moon in Halifax when you were playing with the Cates. The owner of the Moon, Terry, introduced me to you and the Cates. I must say we had some interesting conversations!! You signed your autograph, to Pam , don't ever give up , your pal, Levon Helm. I still look at it when I get discouraged and it helps me to move onward!! Thanks. I want to thank you and the Band for all your hard work and the wonderful music which resulted, it has been a source of inspiration to me all my musical life. I have my own CD now, and one of the songs called Rest Easy is inspired by the Band. Thanks for that too. I would like to send you one, if I could get an address. I have a web site, which I entered in the information section - check it out if you can. Again, Levon, thanks for the music and all the best to you and yours. Pam Marsh


Posted on Mon Feb 18 01:47:30 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Brown Eyed Girl: Thanks a million for the birthday wishes!!

I have been listening to "Mud Acres" most of the day...thanks to the wonderful person who sent it my way. I would say that Bill Keith is damn good on banjo!

Gee...I really wanted that Pete Seeger/Sex Pistols video...


Posted on Mon Feb 18 01:26:47 CET 2002 from cpe0000e8c550f8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.157.156.144)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto

Banjo: "Old Man"-- Neil Young & The Stray Gators. A beautifully laid on banjo. The song would be lessened without it. Incidentally, one of the backup band played the banjo when Neil sang "Old Man" at CSNY concert at the Air Canada Centre last week. A real treat. Incidentally, I agree regarding the Dillards.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 01:17:23 CET 2002 from akcf3.xtra.co.nz (203.96.111.201)

Rod

From: NZ

I should have also mentioned the Pogues whose use of the banjo I really like - especially on If I Should Fall From Grace With God. Ther are probably heaps of others.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 01:13:05 CET 2002 from 24-196-225-108.charter-georgia.com (24.196.225.108)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga

Last night another magical live music event, the ever talented and one of the world's best bass players, Victor Wooten, entertained a crowd of about 2 million of his fans in an old, movie theater converted to a Playhouse. Ready, 15 bucks for a show that lasted over 3 hours. Not only is Victor a talent, his two other brothers were part of his band, Reggie on lead guitar and back up vocals and Joseph on keyboards, besides backing and sometimes lead singing. Victor's other brother, Roy, also know as Futureman, was not in attendance, nor was his other brother, who may have been home watching all the nieces and nephews. So far this month, The Bob Dylan Band Review, The Victor Wooten Family, and this Thursday, John Hiatt, what a month. So what's the point, well, all the "Critics and poets" on this site, you can can make all the observations and criticisms, but funny, how so many criticize what they don't understand. Music, talent, entertainment, since when was there a judge to give a score as to one can sing or not. Live music is so invigorating, and such a life form that has no rating. let's just enjoy, and if some like to talk about this or that, then that is fine, but to do so from the walls of your aboad, without venturing out to the venues, well, that is like driving a car on a nintendo game.

By the by, look for a new Bela Fleck and The Flecktones CD coming out soon.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 01:12:42 CET 2002 from akcf3.xtra.co.nz (203.96.111.201)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

I've missed most of this discussion on Pete Seeger and banjos . The banjo is alot the the accordion in that it gets a bad rap due to it's association with certain types on music. While the accordion has managed to filter into the fringes of rock music and the blues the banjo seems destined to be associated forever with folk and country music. I think I've heard it being used by The Who and Neil Young but not many others.


Posted on Mon Feb 18 00:50:54 CET 2002 from parachute1-156-40-64-122.net.nih.gov (156.40.64.122)

Jonathan Katz

From: Columbia, MD [just south of Baltimore]

Lil’s entry on Dylan's singing got me thinking about baseball managers [pitchers and catchers have reported to Spring training - so hope “springs” eternal even in Baltimore where the ownership will ultimately sink the ship]. Some of the best managers never made it to the big leagues [e.g. Weaver, Lasorda]. Yet they knew the game with such passion that they could manage a team and make them play above their talent level. Absolutely!

As for ‘Little Boxes,’ I think the point is that the lyrics ARE sanctimonious. I’m sick of those that impose their sense of value on those that buy into a particular dream. Those that struggled to buy their little box made of whatever deserve to enjoy it without some privileged fake [or un-privileged genuine] denying its value.

As for Bach on the banjo: How about Bela Fleck’s “Perpetual Motion?” It is an accomplishment to play that music on that instrument. But I agree with Bayou Sam, Scruggs is the Guru.

Now - back to lurking!


Posted on Sun Feb 17 22:25:13 CET 2002 from du-tele3-096.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.96)

Peter Viney

Dave Z - Burl Ives. Generally, yes. But I do still have my original single of “Funny Way of Laughing” somewhere. The only one of The Band who ever ventured into the territory to my knowledge (Ives-Seeger) was solo Rick Danko. Even so, his version of Blue Tail Fly was infectious and full of natural warmth and bonhomie. And it was Rick. And I’d listen to Rick singing the Yellow Pages. Anyway, I've said much too much this weekend. Will try to be quieter this week.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 21:43:14 CET 2002 from spider-tp041.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.191)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Geez - do we need to form a support group for people who can't handle the fact that Peter dosen't care for Pete? We'll get through this. C'mon, group hug :-)

Hey Peter - grab that Dillard/Glen Campbell album. Sounds like a good one.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 20:59:58 CET 2002 from spider-te063.proxy.aol.com (152.163.195.203)

Dave Z

From: Chaska, MN

I'll always looked at the Cros as a folkie... he likes harmonies like the Weaviers, no?... he does that whole political thing... hangs with folkie Neil... I'm surprised you don't like Seeger too, Peter V. but everyone is entitled to their tastes (Does Burl Ives bug ya too?)... Those Arlo & Pete shows I saw were among my most treasured... and that Weavers documentary wasn't half bad either... Peace people...


Posted on Sun Feb 17 19:10:53 CET 2002 from du-tele3-168.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.168)

Peter Viney

Richard P: I’ve made a mental note to think three or four times before attacking classic American artists I don’t appreciate. The Seeger firefight pales against the Hank Williams Snr one – which was started by my peripheral remark after a discussion on Jnr (“If the South would have won”). On Hank Snr, I was persuaded by the barrage of abuse to buy a Greatest Hits and I did eventually get into it, so I’ll cross him off the dislikes list. I also bought a George Jones, tried hard, still didn’t like it particularly. You missed one classic - I enquired a few months ago whether it was worth buying a ticket for the Willie Nelson tour. I’ve tried there too, and though the odd thing sticks, his habit of just failing to get familiar melodies right irritates me. Think I’ll go and see him anyway, see if I change my mind. Hope I do.

BTW, nothing against banjo – but I just prefer it by the Dillards (or Earl Scruggs). I saw an interesting old World Pacific album in a secondhand store on Saturday – only £2.75 too. It was folk classics for 12 string guitar – featuring Glen Campbell on 12 string with Doug and Rodney Dillard. It looked as if it were early 60s and also as it were a 12 string guitar promo item. Think I might go back and get it tomorrow if it’s still there.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 18:43:04 CET 2002 from cache-bas-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.224.1)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

DO NOT FORSAKE ME OH MY DARLING

The odour hung ominously in the air. Fear? Perhaps. Foreboding? Maybe. Stale hamburgers? Possibly so, even here in this dark corner of nowhere.

Call it what you will. We shall never really know for sure. That night in that narrow alley, whatever it was stalked nostrils desperate for something fresher.

Yet, in those moments that followed no change would come. No fresh pastures would materialise out of the thin air. The protagonists at either end of that alley were already set on their destinies. It was too late to stop now. Two worlds were about to collide. Two lives mapped out eons before were now ready to discover what had laid in store for all those years.

Either side of them the ramshackle shanty pulsed with offers of refuge. Lights shone from caravan windows. The shadows formed offered them an escape. Beseeching them to accept a way out. Yet, in reality, the flickering lights merely emphasised the steely resolve etched deep across each of their faces. The easy option was spurned. The get-out clauses rejected out of hand. These were men who simply never turned back. This was their Tombstone. Their Dodge City. This was their alleyway of fate.

As they drew nearer, their eyes met. Bizarrely, it revealed disparate appetites for the momentous rendezvous about to unfurl.

The one oozed relish. The other, meanwhile in stark and sobering contrast, reeked of dread.

It was suddenly clear the stench of foreboding had emanated from one source alone; that those seemingly corresponding resolves had been fed by differing fuels. At once, an upper hand had been established. The rule of the jungle would apply here as anywhere. And this alleyway was no place for the faint-hearted.

The protagonist relishing his fate was now sprightly, hungry even; seemingly eager to pounce. The other was cagey, as if almost frozen in the glare of the spotlights from those caravan windows either side. He glanced almost desperately either side at the lights that shone on him. Now he would have taken any one of them to make his exit. To transport him away in some mythical ray. Now he prayed for a door to open to invite him in. Any light. Any door. Anything. A hole in the ground, even, to swallow him.

It was too late now. Perhaps, it had always been too late. The sprightly one, the younger of the two was too nimble. Moved far too fast. Even before his older adversary had time to realise what was happening, he had flashed out his arm from his side and grasped the hand of his adversary with as firm a handshake as he could conjure up.

"Don't mind I hope Van, lad. Respect mate!"

As they loosed go after what was a vigorous shake, the younger man walked off into the night. Smiling. Content. An over-enthusiastic fan off perhaps to bother others of similar repute amidst that backstage shanty. Garth? Richard? Rick? Meanwhile, Van Morrison stared disbelievingly at his hand; moulded as if putty. He wondered to himself whether he'd ever be able to play the piano again.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 18:17:55 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp70775.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.194.108)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

HAPPY IRIE BIRTHDAY TO THE TWO J'S DOWN SOUTH......JAKE AND JOEL.....FUTURE BAND FANS!


Posted on Sun Feb 17 18:16:53 CET 2002 from spider-wk082.proxy.aol.com (205.188.198.187)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Crabby says, "I love the way Dylan can't sing and wouldn't change it for the world....". Perfect description.

Seeger is NOT the guru of the banjo - Earl Scruggs is.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 17:56:19 CET 2002 from st-catherines-ppp112481.sympatico.ca (216.209.140.110)

Richard Patterson

From: POINT/COUNTER-POINT

PETER VINEY: You cloth-eared yob (meant affectionately) . Regarding PETE SEEGER. Once again, you add to the list of classic American artists that you cannot appreciate. (A list that includes George Jones and Hank Williams Sr.).

Peter Stampfel (Author of the Harry Smith liner notes - and a fine banjo player) clarifying a misquote from a 1981 interview: "He says I hated Seeger--nonono! I hated banjos until I heard Seeger play a 5-string. I wasn't aware of 5-strings, although I heard the Weavers do Tzena Tzena Tzena on the radio in 1950 or '51. I didn't know that was a banjo he was playing. I never heard of 5-strings until Seeger. Seeing him play live in the '50s was a real epiphany. He seemed more good than just about anyone I'd ever seen or heard of."


Posted on Sun Feb 17 17:48:48 CET 2002 from spider-wm034.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.164)

Brien Sz

From: nj

I don't see anything wrong with being a 'little box' or living in a 'little box'and I don't mind the structure of life that has afforded me my little box. Hell, it's my box and i'll decorate it the way I want to! And being it's my box, I find it unique and special, it knows no bounds expect that which i put on it! - So I ask who are these folkies who protest without a viable solution that moves beyond theory? Profess they're way of thinking is the way the world should be - - that flawed quasi-socialist, Star Trek Next Generation Utopian sit around the camp fire and mock the middle class, deride the corporate structure and claim they're way is the way of virtue..., Let me stand shout from the hilltop, my voice be heard by all "I AM A LITTLE BOX AND I LOVE IT! FLAWS AND ALL, I EMBRACE THEE - -wheww, too much coffee this morning.

On a slighty saner note: I just finished reading "Founding Brothers" an excellant look at important segments of the lives and events of the Founding Fathers of America. I find the command of language these gentlemen, Adams, Jefferson, Washington, Madison, Franklin, Burr and Hamilton had, to be extraordinary. Eloquent in one sense and a grammarians nightmare in another. Their use of anecdotes and metaphors is stunning. To have had so many brilliant minds converge in this tiny span of time to form the "thought" of a free government by the people and how they hammered away at each other in beautiful oratory and letter writing to keep this new 'working theory' alive is simply mind boggling - both serene and viscious.

By the way - When i was in the 5th grade, we used to sing "Little Boxes" in music class. It was cute then and it was an archived memory until the recent slew of posts.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 17:47:57 CET 2002 from dial2a-109.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.109)

Hi

Did anyone catch Sheryl Crow on Bravo last week? I believe she said the demo Dylan sent her of Mississippi did not have him singing on it, no wonder it hasn't been booted...


Posted on Sun Feb 17 17:38:14 CET 2002 from bandfan.halden.net (195.70.189.163)

jh

Btw, Ilkka and other Finnish friends, I'll be going to Helsinki next week, attending a USENIX conference and relaxing. Any site regulars up for a beer or something while we're there?


Posted on Sun Feb 17 17:32:18 CET 2002 from bandfan.halden.net (195.70.189.163)

jh

Web page

Ilkka,

I agree, the Opera web browser is highly recommended, both for Linux and Windows. It's available for free from http://www.opera.com/. And now, back to the olympics. Time for the Norwegians to rake in more medals.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 17:15:45 CET 2002 from du-tele3-008.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.8)

Peter Viney

“Live at the Darlington Conservative Club (29.2.79)” – I can only do copies for the first ten applicants. And some of the language (Bells of Rhymney) may be offensive to miners, like Idris Davies the guy who wrote it in the first place. Most of what Sid says is a bit ‘strong’ obviously, but remember that a lot of these expressions like ‘It’s in C, you f+++ing old tosser’ and ‘1, 2, 3, 4 and 4 means you start strumming, ******* ***** *****,’ are meant affectionately in Britain, though the remarks addressed to the photo of Margaret Thatcher on the wall are probably just deeply filthy and offensive anywhere.

I’m sure Ilkka has tapped into my subconcious for the second time in two days and that the caricature of the progressive and didactic elementary teacher is what is getting to me. What with the dreams of Joan Baez and Pete Seeger which cannot be described, it’s time for a bit of hypnotic regression therapy.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 17:09:37 CET 2002 from notebk1.wdse.org (131.212.19.70)

Marsen

From: N. Minnesota

Good Grief! What a topic! It sure is interesting to see the emotions running wild about Pete Seeger. I'm actually quite suprised to see that Peter V has such a dislike for the guru of the banjo. I do however see the tounge-in-cheek humor, and take no offense, even though I do respect Pete Seeger (granted he doesn't get played at my house much). The thread did get me thinking though, about the fact that I was exposed to that type of music well before I got totally hooked on The Band. It all started when I began borrowing my uncle's early Bob Dylan albums, and playing them until the grooves wore out. At the time I was not yet familiar with his "electric" albums, and developed a deep love of his acoustical stuff. I guess you could say I was a purist folkie. (and that was about the time I first heard Pete Seeger) When I started to listen Bob's electric albums, I was totally shocked! My first impression was sheer dismay at the thought of Him radically changing the course of his music. I really did feel betrayed, and tried to forget Bob's musical expantion and kept listening to the old stuff. As I grew older, I found myself gradually accepting the "new" stuff, and read a Biography on Bob. It was then that I had discovered THE BAND! I actually stopped reading the book, and went down to my local library ( I was a kid then)and rented Big Pink on vynil. From then on I was hooked!!! Music had become a big part of my life then and I can honestly say that The Band helped me get through those tough teenage years. So, ironicly after finding The Band, I found myself really loving Bob's electric music, and rock and roll in general. So all these years later, and I'm a bigger Band fan than ever, and play them fifty to one over Bob now, and am hardly a "folkie" anymore. Nevertheless I still remember my early roots in music which led me to The Band.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 16:03:22 CET 2002 from du205-3.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.3.205)

Ilkka

From: Nordic Countries

Thread: PETE SEEGER - Folk singer MALVINA REYNOLDS wrote in her 60's song 'Little Boxes':

Little boxes on the hillside
Little boxes made of ticky tacky
Little boxes, little boxes
Little boxes all the same.
© 1962 by Schroeder Music Co., Berkeley

Then follows a description of the white middle-class monoculture society where all go to the university, all play on the golf course, have pretty children who all go to summer camp, and then to the university and into business, marry and raise a family. And they all get put in boxes.

This is one of those great folk (or protest) songs which feel helplessly out-dated today. On the same time, their impact was enormous. You have only to read PETER VINEY's post where he still feels the hurt of being (almost) personally attacked by PETE SEEGER, the caricature of a progressive and didactic elementary school teacher.

PETER VINEY shouldn't take it personal. Although PETE SEEGER might have had the song in his repertoire as a common protest song this song is more _specific_. If you leave San Francisco via 19th Avenue, which turns into Highway 1 south of the city, you'll pass ridges of boxy houses in pastel and off-white tones referred by MALVINA REYNOLDS in this particular song. The sight is both outstanding and horrible against the diversity in the San Francisco Bay Area. Nothing to do with the sights in England. If you want to see English "boxes" drive to the south for a couple of hours and visit Carmel. ...Hmmm... maybe not Peter Viney because this is the JOAN BAEZ town ;-)

Thread: BROWSERS - I recommend a Norwegian browser. It gives a special feeling to visit this site using it. (I won't tell the name of the browser because I don't want to promote a commercial product here. The name has something to do with La Scala and Metropolitan.)


Posted on Sun Feb 17 13:38:21 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan Edge

From: Diddypool

PETE, SID AND THE LADS

Profound thanks owed to Peter Viney for sending me the video of that '79 Pete Seeger/Sex Pistols concert up at Darlington. Nice one Mister Viney sir!

Got to say from the outset I found the entire thing scarcely believable. Truly incredible stuff. And at the local Conservative Club too. Just goes to show, I suppose, rock 'n' roll really does know no boundaries. Political or otherwise. I mean who the fuck would want to go to Darlington anyroad?

Now I'm sorry to say I was too busy spreading whoppers up in the Outer Hebrides of Scotland to catch that famous mid sixties Newport Festival gig with Bob and his boys. The one when the archangel of folk opted to go live. Literally. By all accounts, though, it was pretty electrifying stuff.

One thing's for sure, however. It cannot have surpassed this gig of Pete jamming with the Pistols. No way. All that blue spiky hair. Wow! How did they do that? A surge of juice through Pete's ukelele? Oodles of gel? Don't suppose we'll ever know now with Sid gone and all.

So many highlights of course. Too many to mention here. Not least those in everybody's hair. The thing which really stood out though - again apart from everybody's hair - was the finale. That jam on "Little Boxes". UNREAL!!

Take me to the River Hudson little darlin!!

Or the Mersey for that matter! Mercy Murkey Mersey! Those screeching harmonies on the line "all made out of ticky tacky". Can rock get any better than that ?? And then, as if to bind it all together, those giant rolls of sellotape enveloping everyone at the very end?

SURRENDER to me baby and let me wrap you in these loving rolls! Too much sticky man! Or what.

And then that snatch of the interview with Sid and Pete in the bar afterwards. Crazy. That interviewer sure found out just what puke and punk were all about after Sid and Pete let rip all over him. And just after telling him not to take seriously anything that came out their mouth as well! Poetic irony or what?

One question for the real afficionados, though. Something I really would like to know the answer to. That huge solid silver safety pin through Pete's nose? The three foot long one?

Did it affect Pete's sinuses? Only the reason I ask is I wouldn't mind getting one meself like. Thing is I suffer a bit from the old sinusitis and I just wondered how Pete fared with it. Does anyone know if he still wears it? Was it a proper safety type or one of those that just looks as if it's real?

Final thing. I thought that was a nice touch of Alice Cooper after the show was over. When he walked round with that billboard proclaiming how much he really like skool. Nice one Alice love. Er lad. Whatever. Brought a sort of symmetry to the occasion I felt. The demise of anarchy perhaps?

By the way, anyone know if a reunion tour is planned?


Posted on Sun Feb 17 13:19:36 CET 2002 from (64.80.240.46)

Lil Again

Well gee... thanks Mr. Paige for bumming me out even more with those wonderful sound clips you sent to Jan from the Last Waltz tribute concert in Chicago. Just as I was feeling better about not being able to be there.... :-)


Posted on Sun Feb 17 12:20:25 CET 2002 from (64.80.240.46)

Diamond Lil

This latest thread about Dylan's singing got me thinking here about songwriters and singers on a whole. I've always thought that some of the best songwriters never made the best singers.. yet all of them could sing their own stuff with such passion that it sounded great regardless. Dylan is one example. Not the classic singer, but a poet who puts such feeling into his songs that he's the only one you want to hear do his stuff. Same with the likes of Carol King or Neil Young. Would they be up there in the top 10 best singers of all time? No. Can they sing? Absolutely!

I remember over the years hearing from several friends who thought Rick Danko couldn't "sing". Imagine that!! I guess the sound of a voice is all in the person listening to it. As Ragtime just said (hellloooo down there :-) .. if it moves you and makes you feel something.. that's all that matters.

Have a great day everyone. Hug Jan.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 11:56:53 CET 2002 from du-tele3-152.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.152)

Peter Viney

I know and you know that there are two Seegers. One is known to family and friends and fans, and I know absolutely nothing about this man. Some of you do on a personal level and were offended. My profuse apologies for this. I’d mentioned him peripherally, got knocked for doing so and tried to explain myself. My response to Ilkka’s humorous comment (waking up between Baez and Seeger)was intended to be light too.

The other Seeger is a “public figure” and public figures are open to public criticism. The public figure travelled with Guthrie, was heroic in the McCarthy era, and is acknowledged as one of the founders of the folk revival without whom … etc etc, and is revered by people like McGuinn and Crosby. I very much like The Byrds versions of Turn, Turn, Turn and Bells of Rhymney. On the latter, any claim that Seeger “wrote” it, carries the same weight that saying Paul Simon “wrote” Scarborough Fair or Dylan “wrote” Restless Farewell or With God On Our Side does. I happen to think Seeger’s performances on TV and record are awful, and I find his public persona objectionable. I am not alone. I had never looked at the Rolling Stone Record Guide entry until now I’m sure … but guess what? The exact same word ‘sanctimonious’ is used (and by an American critic):

‘His entertainment, while educational, can also be preachy and sanctimonious on political issues’ (Rolling Stone Record Guide).

On Carnegie Hall 1968 “I don’t think Pete Seeger was too thrilled to see us at first, but the audience was warm … and Bob tore it up!” (Levon Helm)

“The whole folkie thing was still very questionable to us – it wasn’t the train we came in on. (Dylan)’d be doing this Pete Seeger suiff and I’d be saying ‘Oh, God!’ (Robbie Robertson)

‘The point was to sing (songs) in exactly the same style… to emphasise the brotherhood of man and to make it very easy for the masses to sing along … That was the Pete Seeger philosophy …’ (Joe Boyd).

Boyd puts the finger on it. It’s patronizing. No wonder the guy would have to prove he could play Bach on his banjo while dumbing down to simple stuff for the “masses”. Most of those 40s and 50s campus socialists were (a) not of the masses themselves (b) patronizing. We had a lot more of them here than you did in America! I guess he had novelty value in the USA. Susan makes the point, ‘Little Boxes’ is at root a class put-down from a priviliged elite, of which Seeger was a member.

The Newport 65 story is most Dylan books, and can be traced back to noted folk producer Joe Boyd who was working at the sound desk himself and an eye-witness. He was the actual go-between between the desk and the “Board”. Pete Seeger and Alan Lomax were the ‘baddies”- Lomax more violently than Seeger, and Peter Yarrow was one of the ‘goodies’ giving Lomax the finger when the “Board” (Seeger, Lomax, Bikel) “ordered” the sound turned down.Yarrow was also on the ‘board’ and declined to allow this. Seeger then left – was last seen striding towards the car park, while Lomax (“gnashing his teeth”) seems the more likely candidate for the axe story. No one was closer to the event than Boyd was.

And ever on to “Mississippi”. Don’t forget that Dylan gave the song to Sheryl Crowe, and her version was released two or three years earlier. I got fascinated with comparing them when ‘Love and Theft’ came out. At first (for about a fortnight) I prefered Sheryl Crowe’s version. I feel that she found a chorus instrumental tune in there that the mid-60s Dylan would have added to the song – or Al Kooper or TheHawks would have added it for him, and that was an achievement. After I’d let the Dylan creep in there, I much prefer his version.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 11:26:22 CET 2002 from schltns-3.demon.nl (212.238.196.9)

Ragtime

Re "singing"

Are we talking about intonation, vocal "purity", using your voice like your teacher would want you to: well then Bob Dylan, or our own Richard Manuel, can't "sing".

Are we talking about soul, emotion, the ability to touch people right in their hearts by means of that undefineable power that's in your voice: well then they are the greatest singers in the world.

Yes they can sing.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 09:07:09 CET 2002 from cranberry.cache.fi.jippii.net (195.197.160.12)

Kalervo

From: Suomi

Bob Dylan can't sing..How narrow-minded people can be...Listen for instance his albums from the flamenco soul period (Decade, Street Legal), the exceptional vocals all around, especially Changing of The Guards.Someone has said that the human singing voice is usually at its best at 35,like Dylan was then...But old Bob is still a wonderful, imprecise, strong vocalizer....


Posted on Sun Feb 17 07:55:36 CET 2002 from hse-toronto-ppp178546.sympatico.ca (64.229.83.135)

Blind Willie McTell

Dylan can sing. 'Course he can. Love and Theft proves it.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 06:52:41 CET 2002 from 3cust160.tnt48.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.93.160)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Hey, don't get me wrong!! I love the way Dylan can't sing and wouldn't change it for the world. And although I think Mariah Carey CAN sing - I can't stand hearing her do so. Very perplexing.

For the record, I do care what the British rock critics say - especially when I agree with them.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 06:47:58 CET 2002 from cfa1.execulink.net (199.166.6.10)

Paul Godfrey

From: L O N D O N
Web page

Stanley...great to have you back on the GB.

When I first heard them I really thought Dylan and Kristoferson could not carry a tune. Consider...they are Originals. They are their own personalities. Caught Dylan at least three times with the Band and Kris doing a concert just after Terry Fox died. He intro'd a song by saying: "This is for Terry Fox!" Then he sang "Why Me Lord".

With the passage of time I have come to better appreciate both entities and how they have become apart of our lives.

John, John, great Pete Seeger post. Shine On everbody.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 06:35:27 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-002paphilp133.dialsprint.net (168.191.210.197)

Peter Stone Brown

From: philly
Web page

Viney, again your comments on Seeger are groundless and totally stupid. Seeger didn't then and still doesn't have any qualms about rock and roll. You do not have the slightest clue what you are talking about, so your silence in this matter would truly serve your better interests.

As to British rock critics, what the hell do they know?


Posted on Sun Feb 17 06:35:08 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

When my ears hear the sound of Joan Baez or Pete Seeger I know exactly what a cat feels like when it's fur is rubbed backwards.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 06:07:56 CET 2002 from wwwcache.lanl.gov (128.165.156.80)

Kay

From: New Mexico

Bill:

Roger Tillison has just finished a new record, produced by Walt Richmond of The Tractors (who also played with Rick Danko). Recorded at Richmond's studio in Tulsa, the CD is 10 songs, all original except for Son House's Pony Blues with Jr. Markham on blues harp. There should be more info on Roger's website one of these days. I heard some of it in the early stages and I thought it was pretty great.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 04:48:16 CET 2002 from parachute2-156-40-65-138.net.nih.gov (156.40.65.138)

Jonathan Katz

From: Columbia, MD

I’m not sure what “singing” means to Crabgrass or anyone else. But IMHO Dylan can indeed SING. I don’t mean that he hits all notes in an anticipated or traditional way – but he conveys a feeling better than most. Virtually any Dylan song out there loses significantly when someone else sings it. Just compare the recent “Mississippi” by Sheryl Crow and the one by Dylan. Its no contest – Dylan’s version reduces Crow’s to just a bit of pop – reminiscent of Joan’s version of “Dixie.”


Posted on Sun Feb 17 04:22:35 CET 2002 from cpe0000e8c550f8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.157.156.144)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto

Reflections: 1) "Dylan can't sing". It all depends on what your perspective is. Are we talking about Pavarotti, Diana Krall, the ability to sing in some predefined acceptable way that appeals to the masses. Is that what "can sing?" has become? Or, is singing defined by style and performance and personal identity? Cohen CAN sing. Young CAN sing. Waits CAN sing. And Dylan CAN DEFINITELY sing. 2) Robbie Robertson: With the dirt of SKATEGATE still polluting the air of the Olympics (there is still a lot of cleansing before there should be any comfort, despite the individual righting of a wrong), Robbie's presentation and the honouring of the aboriginal PEOPLE stand in direct counterpoint to each other. Robbie's performance was understated and the effect of the entire thing was sublime. Still the best thing I have seen yet at these Olympics.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 02:24:26 CET 2002 from i249-009.nv.iinet.net.au (203.59.249.9)

Nancy

Hi Bill Munson:

I'm an Aussie and I'm here (seem to be the only one left writing to the GB). When the reissues hit local stores (?)last year, the guys there told me sales were great, so I can't understand why there aren't more of us writing.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 01:52:10 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-001ilurbap064.dialsprint.net (158.252.113.48)

Susan

From: East Central Illinois

Well, "Little Boxes" is a bit of a class put-down. That sort of thing was all over the American Left in the 60s, or at least the left-leaning university community. I first heard it when I was 18; I remember being uncomfortable with the song, and not understanding why people thought it was so great, but I was not enough of a cultural analyst to know just why.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 01:34:13 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

Stanley Landau

From: Toronto

Mr. Paige: Thanks very much for providing the cover of King Harvest. Who are these guys? They're amazing.


Posted on Sun Feb 17 00:39:58 CET 2002 from cache-mtc-al05.proxy.aol.com (64.12.96.234)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

What's wrong with strumming?


Posted on Sun Feb 17 00:17:12 CET 2002 from dv128s68.lawrence.ks.us (24.124.68.128)

Dexy

The idea that "Dylan can't sing" is pretty absurd.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 23:48:23 CET 2002 from pad-cache2-1.cache.telstra.net (165.228.129.12)

Bill

I'm of the view that an artist who's achieved real things early on should be remembered always for those achievements and not expected to excel for the rest of their days on earth. Pete Seeger and his chums in the Weavers helped to achieve, it seems to me, real social improvements in the US in the '40s, '50s and early '60s - much much more than any of us here can claim. Plus he turned a bit of the bible into one of pop's lovelier songs, "Turn Turn Turn". "The Bells of Rhymney" (sp?) is not too shabby either. Plus dedicating one's declining years to saving a river must rate as a good thing too, even if it means playing folk fests to collect money for the cause. Oddly enough, the paragraph after the excerpt from the Tillison bio that I posted last time talks about Tillison's work on the Hudson with Seeger.



Posted on Sat Feb 16 23:35:55 CET 2002 from du-tele3-039.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.39)

Peter Viney

But … finally … Seeger would definitely have booed the Band in 1966. My case rests!


Posted on Sat Feb 16 23:31:08 CET 2002 from du-tele3-039.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.39)

Peter Viney

Phew! Stirred up more this time than last time. BUT I will maintain that he's a holier-than-thou dullard who can't sing and everything I've ever heard from is awful. No, I didn''t know he didn't write 'Little Boxes', so I'm 100% wrong, but he is to blame for spreading a trite and inept song. BTW, while it is probably even worse to quote "the majority of rock critics" I would wager anything that I am repeating the opinion of the average (British) rock writer - see virtually every comment I've ever read this side of the Atlantic. Maybe he has this icon thing in the USA which has intangible connections, but from a distance … well, I had my say! I'll go and listen to Visions of Johanna, and possibly Newport 65.

As to playing Bach on the banjo, my reaction is Why? It sounds perfectly good on the instruments it was written for. Playing Bach on a banjo is exactly what I'd imagine him doing. Pretentious. Bet Woody Guthrie or Bob Dylan never thought it the appropriate thing to play.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 23:23:44 CET 2002 from cc5414-a.hnglo1.ov.nl.home.com (212.120.101.7)

Norbert

John D, thanx for that great post.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 23:08:11 CET 2002 from 1cust174.tnt52.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.94.174)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

As most of us know, Berkeley's Malvina Reynold's wrote "Little Boxes" a clever little tune about the encroachment of conformity in our modern day lives and very influential on the thinking of the '60s which was largely a rebellion against conformity. Malvina was in her '60s at the time and couldn't sing either - probably never could. Yet, she also wrote the beautiful and powerful landmark environmental song "What Have They Done To The Rain?" Libba Cotton couldn't sing either but wrote the classic tune "Freight Train," was Peter Seeger's nursemaid to boot and probably helped him learn to "Cotton Pick" though she was lefty and played guitar upside down. Pete's "Waist Deep In The Big Muddy" was a powerful anti-Vietnam War protest song with some great fingerstyle playing.

I don't really see what it proves to say that Dylan wrote "Visions of Johanna." Obviously, one doesn't need to be a great singer to create a great song or melody (Hoagy Carmichael and Robbie Robertson come to mind). McCartney and Lennon were Dylan fans and yet both of them could really carry a tune.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 22:09:40 CET 2002 from notebk1.wdse.org (131.212.19.70)

GRUB

From: The Hotel

I think ol'Pete says it best with what His Banjo reads: "This machine surrounds hate and forces it to surrender."


Posted on Sat Feb 16 21:30:26 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

From: C A N A D A

A few years back when my son was full of protest and he wanted to go busking for a career, he always used the phrase, "Don't let The Man get you down." He was always talking about "The Man"....in other words the establishment. Billy Bragg was the hero of his generation and his other hero was Pete Seeger of my generation.

My wife and I were at The New Orleans Jazzfest and I saw my son's hero Pete Seeger. I asked him if he would sign an autograph to Jimi with the phrase, "Don't Let THE MAN Get You Down." He did so with a smile and never questioned me as I looked rather embarrassed for asking a rather silly question. I've never forgot his kindness and passion.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 20:08:11 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-002paphilp217.dialsprint.net (168.191.210.233)

Peter Stone Brown

From: Philly
Web page

Peter Viney, it is you who is the sanctimonious one in your attack on Pete Seeger who is anything but sanctimonious. You don't know what you're talking about on a musical level.

While Pete Seeger stums on many songs, he is hardly a strummer as a musician. But you wouldn't know this since your opinion is already formed and you wouldn't bother to take the time to listen. Anyone who can play Bach on the banjo is not a strummer. Your comment about Seeger never murdering a Band song because they're too hard to play and the lyrics too complex is beyond all bounds!

The whole Seeger at Newport thing has been distorted way out of proportion over the years as to what actually happened.

Seeger did not write "Little Boxes," and your comments on the song reveal you totally misunderstood the point of it.

By the way, the Band (or Hawks) played with Dylan not the other way around.

You clearly don't get it and you would be well served to keep your unfortunate knee-jerk reactions to yourself instead of viciously criticizing what you obviously do not understand.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 18:10:03 CET 2002 from du-tele3-141.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.141)

Peter Viney

Ilkka: If I woke up between Pete Seeger and Joan Baez … first I’d decide it was time to become teetotal. I’d never drink to excess again and pray that I’d been in closer proximity to Joan than Pete. Both get minus points for being sanctimonious on record, and Seeger never murdered a Band song (they’re too hard to play and the lyrics are too complex) but having seen Joan interviewed on TV I thought she was enormously likeable and she definitely has a sense of humour, and she’s aged most gracefully. If my heart survived the shock, I think I’d put ‘Royal Albert Hall- Disc Two’ on the CD player full volume, tell Pete Seeger to p*** off (if he hadn’t fled already at the first notes), and then I’d make a good pot of coffee, and look forward to a breakfast chat with Joan. I’d try really hard to avoid telling her what I think of her version of Dixie, and steer the conversation towards less controversial matters. I’d hope to hear some revealing and funny Dylan stories. But I probably wouldn’t ask her to sing me a song.

On the whole though, I’ll try to contain my more extreme dislikes. Certain artists cause a kneejerk reaction in me, and Pete Seeger is definitely an “Aargh! Pass the earplugs! Get me out of here!” Sorry, can’t help it. I picture him in make-up with a big photo of Woody Guthrie saying, ‘Make me look like that.’ But he’s not Pol-Pot or Stalin. So apologies to those who do like him.

Crabgrass’s point is fair about Dylan’s voice, but then again he wrote ‘Visions of Johanna,’ and Dylan played with The Band (I think of it that way round, of course rather than ‘The Band played with Dylan.’). Pete Seeger wrote ‘Little Boxes.’

On Robbie, from what people have said, the USA didn’t get the full uninterrupted broadcast. Canada and Europe did, and there’s much more acclaim as a result. I’ve watched it several times with unabated pleasure. As Sam says, it was just fantastic to see him up there playing.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 17:30:57 CET 2002 from 3cust28.tnt30.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.79.28)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Surely, Dylan is a hero to the great majority of present day singer-songwriters and "folksingers" both well known and unknown - yet most of them would probably be of the opinion that Bob can't sing.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 17:06:12 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

Ed Blayzor

From: NY
Web page

Peter V: while you have your right to your opinion of Pete Seeger, I have seen Pete play many times and recently got to play with him myself(at a Clearwater benefit),he can still captivate a room.While his voice is not in the best shape anymore you hardly notice.Yes he has some silly & goofy tunes he performs but has written some of most socially conscience & important songs,that no doubt had its influence on a young Bob Dylan. Rick Danko used to say"we`re here to help the neighborhood" - well i`m glad Pete Seeger is a member of my neighborhood because he is still active in a lot local organizations.Appleseed recordings have 2 very good Pete Seeger tribute cd`s out and are working on a third,vol.2 has a DFA cover (Andersen & Fjeld using Rick`s guitar) of Snow,Snow.Appleseed is also about to release DFA-One More Shot cd here in the states.Above is a link to Appleseeds site alot great artists are on this label including John Stewart.Lastly I hope to see some GB people at the Gurus show tonight.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 16:46:58 CET 2002 from spider-wg054.proxy.aol.com (205.188.196.44)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Hey Ben - when you come to the guestbook, does it bum you out if you can't find a post that affords you the opportunity to hammer someone or rub their opinion in shit? Just curious. Have a great day.

As a Band, and Robbie fan - it was just plain NICE to see him there with the strat around his neck, and singing for the world at the opening ceremonies. Without analyzing it to death - wasn't it just plain COOL to see Robbie playing? Sure, it would have been nice to see more of him on camera, but it wasn't a RR show, so it was understandable.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 16:23:15 CET 2002 from du35-3.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.3.35)

Ilkka

Peter Viney, what would be your first words if you'd wake up between Pete Seeger and Joan Baez? Just curious.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 16:22:53 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp1167.dialsprint.net (63.187.12.151)

Jeffrey

"....Pete Seeger- we had this talk once before. I’m intrigued by the idea that I have an “anti-folkie” hand, but if a superior, boring and sanctimonious prat with a banjo is folk, then sign me up for the anti-folkie league.....". I mean ,Jesus, Peter! That's someones child you're talking about!


Posted on Sat Feb 16 15:33:02 CET 2002 from cache-mtc-al05.proxy.aol.com (64.12.96.234)

Rick S.

From: Suffern, NY

Good morning Woodstock, Dutchess Co. and Connecticut communities. Come out tonight to the Towne Crier, Pawling at 9 PM and support the local heroes, Jim Weider and the Honky Tonk Gurus. They've been gearing up for this concert and had a helluva warmup in Teaneck last night. Scheduled to sit in tonight- Sid McGuinness. Rumor legendary Tom Izzo may set down his Michigan St. whistle and replace it with the harp for some numbers.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 14:20:45 CET 2002 from du-tele3-120.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.120)

Peter Viney

Pete Seeger- we had this talk once before. I’m intrigued by the idea that I have an “anti-folkie” hand, but if a superior, boring and sanctimonious prat with a banjo is folk, then sign me up for the anti-folkie league. I was perplexed that Crosby – who really can sing - chose a man who can’t sing as a hero. I think I like folk – if that’s early and late Dylan, Bert Jansch, Fairport Convention, Eliza Carthy, the Chieftains, and The Clancy Brothers. I can even see virtues in Peter, Paul & Hairy (and do own their “Best of …”). But if ‘folk’ is actually Pete Seeger then maybe you’re right and I don’t. Was it Robbie or Levon who said that The Hawks never rated strummers? Surely he was in their minds. I always felt that the ticky-tackiest most supercilious performance I ever saw was Pete Seeger on Sunday Night at The London Palladium singing ‘Little Boxes’ and ‘What did you learn in school today?’. So, what if you’d dreamed and struggled to buy your little box made of ticky-tacky? Who was this priviliged fake crapping on your dream? Did this man in his fake workingman’s shirt have ANY sense of irony? Or ANY sense of humour? Woody Guthrie was the real thing, but this guy probably spent an hour a night ironing his collar so it didn’t lie flat, and carefully picking the stitching out to simulate wear and tear. We debated the Dylan at Newport reports once before, and I still see the image of Pete Seeger, tears streaming down his face, attempting to cut the cables on the electric Dylan with an axe as a perfect representation of the myth. Whether it’s actually 100% true or not doesn’t matter. It SOUNDS as if it should be true and encapsulates Pete Seeger for me. Ben, your entry sounds to me as if you would have booed Dylan at the Manchester Free trade Hall! Bring back Freewheelin’! Get rid of the band! Judas!

And back to last week, wasn’t Robbie (like Eliza Carthy) bringing an electric vision and technical know-how to a genuine folk music? OK, the dancers’ costumes were pure Disney, but these were real people, and watching the Native American lady wailing along with him was exciting. Someone said before that only high-profile Native Americans were on the stage. But what would you expect at such an event? “Low-profile Native Americans”, or someone famous who could mix Native American themes into a 21st century arrangment with wide popular appeal? I realize more and more that Robbie has fans to whom The Band is unknown, or a piece of background information. A couple of years back I was talking to a group of people in their 20s who were Robbie fans but had hardly heard of The Band. He does have his own music now.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 14:15:39 CET 2002 from pad-cache2-1.cache.telstra.net (165.228.129.12)

Bill

Two things, the first short, the second long. Short: are there still any Australians here in GuestbookWorld?

Long: I'm sorry if someone mentioned this already, but I just stumbled, by doing a Google search on "Sandy Konikoff" (amazing!) and found the following Levon-related paragraphs from Roger Tillison's bio at rogertillison.com:

"Roger eventually moved to the Villa Carlotta in LA where he participated in bathroom jam sessions with his friends and neighbors - including Rolling Stones tenor saxman Bobby Keys and Levon Helm (drummer for the Hawks-soon to become The Band). Those three, along with Davis and bassist Gordon Shryock nearly didn't return from their one and only formal gig. In a rough neighborhood in Watts only one year after the riots. Roger and Jesse Ed soon returned to Lawton, where they had a standing gig as a folk rock duo at the Gallerie for eight months or so.

"Through his association with Levon Helm, Roger moved to Woodstock, NY, for a time, playing at the Sled Hill CafÈ and hanging out with the other members of The Band – Rick Danko, Richard Manuel and Garth Hudson. During this period, Roger also played with other various musicians, including Paul Butterfield and Rod Hicks, and at benefits for the Hudson River Cleanup Project with Odetta and Pete Seeger.

"In December, 1971 Jesse Ed Davis called Roger back out to LA to record Roger Tillison's Album for Atlantic Records. Also featured on the album were Stan Szelest , Sandy Konikoff, Larry Knechtel, Billy Rich, Don Preston, Joey Cooper, and Jim Keltner. After declining to tour without his band, Roger went back to Lawton."


Posted on Sat Feb 16 14:06:46 CET 2002 from a59107.upc-a.chello.nl (62.163.59.107)

Martin Alberts

From: Holland
Web page

You will fins an album of Jonas and Don Everly on my Everly Brothers Curiosities site. Have fun........


Posted on Sat Feb 16 13:04:31 CET 2002 from (200.201.133.140)

Carlos Barros

From: Brazil

I really apreciated The Band's site. I got a lot of lyrics about my favorite songs. I would like to thanks to all the people that contributed for its creation.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 12:08:04 CET 2002 from stargate-46-185.salzburg-online.at (213.153.46.185)

Luke W.

Amanda, thank you very much for your comments on "Sweet Dreams..." If I get it as a birthday present, I will also post a few comments about it.

Maybe a stupid question, but... Is the Band fanzine "Jawbone" still being published? If so, is it possible to contact the editor online?

Luke


Posted on Sat Feb 16 10:30:47 CET 2002 from (64.80.240.7)

Diamond Lil

Geez... big time insomnia tonight (this morning?) I'm _still_ up around the time I'd normally be _getting_ up. Very strange.

Had a very nice chat with some nice folks for a few hours. Very rarely am I in the chatroom during the night.. and it was a pleasure to find some fun people there. One of the big conversations was of the show at the Bottom Line in NYC on the 22nd. Can't wait to go. Should be a great time. Band tunes.. and a horn section as well. Anyone else going?

And now.. a pot of coffee later.. I'm going to try and sleep awhile. Yeah right :-) Have a good morning everyone. Hug Jan :-)


Posted on Sat Feb 16 05:51:33 CET 2002 from 2cust13.tnt38.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.194.247.13)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Even as an atheist I have to admit that Pete Seeger's environmental song "God Bless The Grass" has been one of my favorites ever since I first heard it. Pete has grown old with grace and dignity never losing sight of what really matters on this little planet.

The prospect of a TV movie about The Band thoroughly intrigues me. I still pick Justin Timberlake to play Bob Dylan and, of course, Britney Spears would make a great Sara when the Woodstock / Basement Tapes segment is shot.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 04:27:56 CET 2002 from cache-mtc-al05.proxy.aol.com (64.12.96.234)

Brien Sz

From: nj

Don't look now Ben but I think your Left is turning into a Right


Posted on Sat Feb 16 03:58:27 CET 2002 from spider-wa054.proxy.aol.com (205.188.192.44)

Ben Pike

From: Cleveland Tx

Whooaa, that "Last Waltz" sounds mighty interesting, hope the mix is good and the price is low. Once again, Peter Viney tips his anti-folkie hand, if someone took the ideals of "Freewheelin" and "The Times They Are a Changin", and walked the walk, rather than opting for a fashionable existentail hipper than thou rock critics wet dream, that would be Pete Seeger. I've had a lot to gripe about with the far left of late; but I'll still take them over that discusting "Triumph Of The Will Meets Walt Disney" shlock Robbie Robertson partisipated in the other night.

One might also forget Seeger's influence on the Byrds, not just "Turn Turn Turn" but "I Come And Stand At Every Door." Kind of a downer, but maybe the "Silly Love Songs" fans can check out the bass lines.


Posted on Sat Feb 16 02:56:11 CET 2002 from cache-mtc-al05.proxy.aol.com (64.12.96.234)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Chester = I know what you mean about what the kids are learning. Actually, what they see in most of sports is sad. People not honoring contracts - going for the money only - biting peoples ears off. Just today, they found a dead guy with a gunshot in his cheat, at the home of a big-name basketball player (Jason Williams I think). Also, yes-Neil Young does have a way of capturing the feeling of something like Sept 11th. He also nailed it three decades ago with "Ohio". I remember a great story told my David Crosby, where the C.S.N.Y. song "Our House" was climbing the charts - and the Kent State shooting happened. Neil was so affected by it that he penned the great tune "Ohio" and they recorded it. Then with with Grahm Nash's blessing (Our House was his tune), they released it and it blew past "House" on the charts. I just remember Crosy noting how cool it was for Nash to not complain, because he felt strongly about "Ohio". Not too many musicians like that on the charts these days it seems.

Jennt T = nice vinyl haul you made. I got the same thing when CD's came along. People would give me their records - and turntables. To them, it was just an old format that they weren't going to play anymore. I happily relieved them of their cumbersome records, and I ended up with about half a doizen turntables. I still enjoy spinning a record sometimes.



Posted on Fri Feb 15 23:32:24 CET 2002 from du-tele3-022.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.22)

Peter Viney

Musing on celebrity here. Nothing to do with The Band, so scroll on. I’ve just sat through probably the worst-written play I’ve seen in 10 years (Ira Levin’s ‘Deathtrap’) – and I see about 25 plays a year. Sad to watch David Soul in such an awful part. He didn’t shine, but it was hard to see how anyone might have. The only fun moment was a genuine Starsky & Hutch smile in the muted curtain call – and the celebrity of that 70s classic brought some bizarre characters out of the woodwork to watch. The last time I was so disappointed in a performance was another of my screen favourites, Gene Wilder, who was appallingly, stunningly bad in ‘The Front Page’ in London a few years ago. Guess screen actors should stick to the screen at the end of the day. But neither had chosen good plays by any standard. Why do they perform in such crap? It’s like The Band covering Chirpy, Chirpy Cheep Cheep.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 23:15:53 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

I can't help but comment on the figure skating debate, not that I actually care but I just cant help but wonder what were teaching our kids, I for one taught mine that life isn't fair and sometimes your going to get skrewed and their isn't shit your going to be able to do about it, I don't know I guess I'm old school, to me a far better protest by the norskis would have been to refuse the silver, that to me says more than complaining until if I heard this right the norskis will get the gold but the russians still get to keep theres, did I miss something here, how is this a victory for Canada? Gold is for the best, the message that Im getting is that its no better than a tie, hardly what Canada has been arguing all week, to me they caved, thats why that night at the medal ceramonie they should have declined the Silver.....


Posted on Fri Feb 15 22:11:50 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Somehow I can't help but think of that old saying about what a wild bear does in the woods. And it doesn't have anything to do with making music.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 20:29:03 CET 2002 from a010-0035.blgs.splitrock.net (209.254.61.35)

Jack Straw

From: "somewhere in the middle of Montana"

JUSTICE FOR THE CANADIANS! A rare thing in these modern times.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 20:07:24 CET 2002 from bob22.revealed.net (208.16.227.25)

Mike

From: where it's cold
Web page

This country bears thing...I'll play along :) If Ted = Robbie and Fred = Levon, then does that mean Zeb = Rick? After all, it says Zeb plays fiddle. Well, Rick played it on Rag Mama Rag. And does Tennesee = Garth? Ok, I know it's fiction. But where would Richard be? I mean, the manager of The Country Bears, that's Albert Grossman. Ok, I'm just toying with the notion. I forget who posted it but it'd be too painful to see a biopic of The Band. I think the music more than speaks fo itself. Enough from me, for now.

Mike


Posted on Fri Feb 15 19:36:28 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.39)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

Speaking of a movie loosely based on the Band, the other day I was wondering what if VH1 made a movie that was TIGHTLY based on the Band, as in a (probably unauthorized) bio? Would it be too painful to watch? I have wasted an embarrassing amount of time watching that sort of thing and find that when I actually care about the band or artist it IS actually painful to suffer through their trials and tribulations. Even the one on the Monkees killed me, and it was pretty bad.

And if such a movie were made, who could the actors be?


Posted on Fri Feb 15 19:21:27 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.39)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

I just want to share my good fortune--my best friend Patty had me over today to go through her vinyl collection which she never plays anymore, not having a working turntable. Now Patty and I have known each other for 10 years yet for some reason we never talk about music, and I had no idea what she would have. Here are just some of the treasures I got for free today:

Santana

In My Own Dream, Put It in Your Ear, Golden Butter (Butterfield Blues Band)

One Way Out (Sonny Boy Williamson)

Bad Luck and Troubles (Memphis Slim)

Taking Care of Business (James Cotton Blues Band)

Woodstock

Anniversary Special (The Earl Scruggs Revue)

Hootin' and Hollerin' (Brownie McGhee and Sonny Terry)

Papa John Creach and Zulu

Natural Boogie (Hound Dog Taylor and the HouseRockers)

Plus some Earth Wind & Fire, Rufus, AWB and Stevie Wonder, as well as two Leo Kottke albums which my husband will love, a live Lynyrd Skynyrd with Free Bird (which was my prom theme, though the band Sunshine Balloon unfortunately didn't know it and never played it the whole evening) and Duane Allman, an anthology which includes Aretha's cover of The Weight.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 19:12:05 CET 2002 from du-tele3-113.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.113)

Peter Viney

I think this Country Bears album will open a feud between the Teddites and Fredonistas. I can see it all being played out here. Ted was great at salt Lake City last week …


Posted on Fri Feb 15 17:23:00 CET 2002 from spider-wo052.proxy.aol.com (205.188.200.42)

franko

From: boston

You know what happens when you have too much honey.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 16:48:16 CET 2002 from a010-0021.blgs.splitrock.net (209.254.61.21)

Jack Straw

From: "somewhere in the middle of Montana"

For those who prefer the copy and paste option for posting, I find it easier to use an e-mail editor for composing and spelling. It is less cumbersome than MS Word and mine is usually running.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 16:40:49 CET 2002 from dhcp215127.sunyocc.edu (198.242.215.127)

FUNK! freddy funk

From: myaluminumstarcraft

PATTY WALSH Hey? Would you be the same Patty Walsh who has a brother involved in the politics "game"?


Posted on Fri Feb 15 15:15:41 CET 2002 from citrix2.doc.state.vt.us (159.105.102.7)

John Cass

From: VT

Just wanted to let the GBers know that tickets for the Jim Weider & Honky Tonk Gurus are on sale now for Saturday March 2 at Jilly's in Rutland VT. Tickets are only $5.00 and Jilly's is a great place to see a show.. The number to call is 802-775-6919. Rutland is very close to Killington and Pico ski area.. so come to VT listen to a great show and do some skiing. The Amtrack drops you off a block from Jilly's if you choose to take the train. Hope to see some GBers there.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 15:14:49 CET 2002 from dv132s69.lawrence.ks.us (24.124.69.132)

Dexy

Web page

Sorry, more Furry Bears news. The above link takes you to a news release that really lays it out. The Brown Furry Album, fans including The Beatles and Clapton, a "country rock" band that broke up in the '70s due to personal discord gets brought back together for one big charity concert.... Wow. That's pretty weird. Can't Levon and Garth do a cameo??? (funny feeling someone else has that bagged)


Posted on Fri Feb 15 15:11:50 CET 2002 from dv132s69.lawrence.ks.us (24.124.69.132)

Dexy

Web page

Had to get more information on the Hiatt / Disney movie "based loosely on The Band." The above link takes you to a Disney site about the film.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 15:04:44 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Good thought Peter. Mine is still doing it....so it must be some bizarre setting in my browser that has happened. I hate it when you go along for years and everything's fine and then this happens and you say "What did I do differently" Might have something to do with my Firewall protection.......anti virus stuff.....who knows?


Posted on Fri Feb 15 14:21:54 CET 2002 from cache-mtc-al05.proxy.aol.com (64.12.96.234)

Donna

From: PA

Thank you Jan for posting the pics of Robbie at The Winter Olympics! He looked and sounded great!!! Bob Costa, however, a bit annoying, did give a nice plug to Robbie! It would of been much more enjoyable if the camera man, would of kept the camera on Robbie a little more and less on the skater's.

I'm getting ready now to go see Jim Weider & The Gurus, tonight in New Jersey! They are an awesome band and always worth the trip to hear them play! They will be singing some of their new tunes off their Cd, "Remedy." When this Cd is released, take my advise and buy it! Their songs "Blues Condition" and "Hidden in Plain Sight" are among my favorites! Trust me, go out and see a Gurus show and purchase their soon to be released Cd! I hope to see some GB'ers at the show tonight!

Wishing Everyone a Great Weekend!


Posted on Fri Feb 15 10:30:30 CET 2002 from du-tele3-129.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.129)

Peter Viney

John D- easiest way is not to compose in the Guestbook "entry box" but to compose on a different WP document - but it's hardly worth it for short posts (and I'm not doing it now). The loss of data after hitting "Back" has happened to me once or twice in the past, but not consistently - and not today, I just tried it a few times.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 07:48:11 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

Ed Blayzor

From: NY

John Hiatt said he recently composed the music for an upcoming Disney cartoon "The Country Bears" whch he describes the story as "loosely" based on The Band. Bonnie Raitt, Eric Clapton,& Don Henley will be singing and doing the voices of a few of the "Bears".


Posted on Fri Feb 15 06:37:49 CET 2002 from c5300-1-ip55.albany.thebiz.net (216.238.224.55)

"Red"

From: Woodstock, NY

Great site. Will visit many times over...


Posted on Fri Feb 15 06:33:06 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Bayou-- Ine heard Youngs "lets Roll" and its a great song, the man has a way of writting the right song for the times and he still rocks out with the best of them. I'm looking forward to hearing his latest as well


Posted on Fri Feb 15 04:08:59 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp1179.dialsprint.net (63.187.12.163)

to john donabie

Hey john , I have also had problems on occasion with this guestbook,exactly as you have described. I suspect certain members of the community take that as a blessing! Nonetheless, I will persevere with my unique form of propaganda, occasionally mixed with doses of truth(and justice!) Semper Farcissimuss!


Posted on Fri Feb 15 03:29:14 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

Looking for the soundtrack album to a film released in 91 called "Ballad Of The Sad Cafe". Can anyone suggest a place on the net where maybe I could get my hands on it...checked everywhere I know. Thanks.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 03:19:52 CET 2002 from host150.wpsic.com (208.255.5.150)

absinthe_is_esoteric

From: USA
Web page

Im just bummed that Waylon Jennings died. A true American hero/role model didnt even make the front page.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 02:17:45 CET 2002 from proxy2o.dpn.deere.com (192.43.65.245)

Mike

From: somewhere, anywhere

John D. Thanks for TLW songlist. Like Pat, my only gripe is the omission of Georgia On My Mind. Ok. so I am greedy too :) The omission of King Harvest and The Last Waltz/Evangeline from the concert are ok by me. I was never crazy about either of them. I'll stick with King Harvest from Rock Of Ages. Still, it's a lot to be excited about. And if your list doesn't change, then it's darn near the entire show! And that's a plus. Oh well, I can still wait I suppose.

Mike


Posted on Fri Feb 15 02:17:09 CET 2002 from 64-80-55-144-access.surferz.net (64.80.55.144)

Diamond Lil

John D: Not sure what the problem with previewing posts is, but I've had the same problem many times and it always seems to correct itself in a day or so. Until then, know that some of your posts are keeping some of mine company somewhere in the Bermuda triangle of Jan land.

Have a good night everyone.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 01:42:36 CET 2002 from spider-to034.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.59)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Dave Hopkins = looks like a great song by Neil. I'm also glad that "Let's Roll" will be on this new album. Have you all gotten to hear that song? This looks like a good up-coming album by Mr. Young.


Posted on Fri Feb 15 00:24:13 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Any computer geeks out there? I mentioned this on the site and to Jan and he figures it's a problem in my browser somewhere. As of yesterday when I preview a posting and try to go back a screen to edit my comments, there is nothing there. I've gone to other sites that have to remember the previous page and I have no problem. Any thoughts on why all my original information disappears so I can't edit my post before submitting. Just started yesterday. Thanks to all the computer geeks that may be able to help me.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 23:32:08 CET 2002 from w12.igs.berkeley.edu (128.32.52.72)

Dave Hopkins

From: Berkeley, CA

Neil Young is playing a new song called "Two Old Friends" on the current CSNY tour which is also scheduled to appear on his upcoming album "Are You Passionate?" (due March 26). I thought I'd take the liberty of reprinting the lyrics below (courtesy of hyperrust.org) for reasons which will become obvious when you read them:

Preacher went up to the Golden Gate,
And met God there,
With the glow of love in his flowing hair.

I'm dreamin' of a time when love and music,
Is everywhere.
Can you see that time comin'?

No my son that time has gone,
There's things to do.
The world has changed since I first met you.

Back when The Band played Rock of Ages,
In their prime,
And the old juke joint was rockin'...

Oh Lord there's so much hate,
In a world where we're from another place.
Show me how to live like you.
See no evil, hear no evil,
Feel no evil in my heart.

In my heart, in my aching heart.
In my heart, in my heart,
In my old black heart.
In my heart, in my heart,
In my beating heart.

Sky had turned a lotta shades of gray,
As they walked on,
And a gentle rain fell down on them.

They found faith in the way things are and,
The way things change,
And they said goodbye like two old friends.

Take me up to the mountains high,
Or a building top where the spirits fly.
Show me how to be like you.
See no evil, hear no evil,
Feel no evil in my heart.

In my heart, in my aching heart.
In my heart, in my heart,
In my old black heart.
In my heart, in my heart,
In my beating heart.

Oh Lord there's so much hate,
In a world where we're from another place.
Show me how to live like you.
See no evil, hear no evil,
Feel no evil in my heart.

In my heart, in my aching heart.
In my heart, in my heart,
In my old black heart.
In my heart, in my heart,
In my beating heart.



Posted on Thu Feb 14 23:18:33 CET 2002 from du-tele3-156.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.156)

Peter Viney

Mojo has 100 rock stars choose their all-time heroes this month. Only Travis chose The Band:

Neil Primrose: One of the people I could single out is Levon Helm of the Band, just a great drummer and a great singer. And I think the simplicity of The Band has been a major influence on Travis. Robbie Robertson just looks so suave and cool.”

Other interesting choices: Paul McCartney picked John Lennon; Bo Diddley picked himself- The Clash picked him too, Alice Cooper chooses Frank Zappa (who he recalls blowing Jimi Hendrix off the stage), BrianWilson chose Phil Spector, Emmylou Harris chose Neil Young, Mick Jagger chose Chuck Berry, Keith Richard chose Muddy, David Crosby- really perplexingly to me- chose Pete Seeger. Hendrix, Elvis, Dylan and James Brown all get multiple votes.

Thanks John D for TLW listing - so the rehearsals story is confirmed. Great! (More Van!)


Posted on Thu Feb 14 22:13:10 CET 2002 from 24-196-236-100.charter-georgia.com (24.196.236.100)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga

Great news has just flashed accross my screen, Mr. Mark Knopfler and his band have been in Nashville for the past weeks working on his 3rd solo(how can you be solo with a band) album. Supposed to come out in the Fall , with a tour in the Spring of 2003 to follow up the album. Best place for info is from Guy Fletcher web site. Only negative is that the DVD of The Sailing to Philadelphia tour has been put off till after the album is finished.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 21:31:08 CET 2002 from (209.166.233.21)

Jon Lyness

From: New York City

Thanks, John Donabie...what a track listing! Fantastic!


Posted on Thu Feb 14 17:53:21 CET 2002 from tres01.ashe.miami.edu (129.171.41.240)

otoole

Being a huge fan of the Basement Tapes I was shocked when I saw an MPEG of Beautiful Thing under Richard Manuel's name in the audio files recorded in 1967?!? For all my computer's high falutin' capabilities I can't seem to download the file. Is this truly a basement tape? If so why isn't it on the Genuine BT's, and does anyone know where I can find it?

I enjoy Eric Clapton's version but I always thought it could lose the female back ups on the chorus. I'd love to hear a more 'raw' straight band version-especially basement tapes style.

By the way I picked up a used copy of the Across the Great Divide box set yesterday for a measly $23 -in perfect condition. I loved the liner notes. Despite being a bit skimpy on rarities and unreleased stuff I'm very happy with it. The track listing seems a bit random at times..but ah well - hopefully they'll do better with the next one Robbie's been mentioning. Maybe they'll even put some Band versions of 'Little Birds' or "Davy's on the Road Again" "Snow" or anything else they've got we don't. Though always good...it feels like a great time to be a Band fan.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 17:31:20 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

Anyone from New York City area interested in seeing the Gurus in Teaneck tomorrow night? I have a car but my license is suspended, so if you have a license you can drive. Or if you are driving, maybe I could hitch a ride? Please advise.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 17:07:25 CET 2002 from ares.tdsb.on.ca (207.35.188.13)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

I've lived with Guyanese and Jamaican people and I have visited Jamaica a few times....My love of Reggae in particular and Patois is evident...as well as a lot of my students come from Caribbean countries so the lingo is evident......Here is an example of a poem in Jamaican Patois for my Students and all the Reggae lovers out there.....

BYE NOW

Walk good
Walk good
Noh mek macca go juk yu
Or cow go buk yu.
Noh mek dog bite yu
Or hungry go ketch yu, yah!

Noh mek sunhot turn yu dry.
Noh mek rain soak yu.
Noh mek tief tief yu.
Or stone go buck yu foot, yah!
Walk good
Walk good


Posted on Thu Feb 14 16:57:36 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

The shock of the news of Waylon's death is still sinking in. The big hoss has gone across the great divide. His music has always meant a lot to me ever since I first heard that wonderful voice on the radio, as a kid living in a country town in north Georgia. That man could flat out sing anything he set his mind to.

As a teenager, I used to drive most of my firends crazy when I switched to the country station on the car radio. Country music, it seems, wasn't "cool" enough for them back then. But, whenever they heard a Waylon song, they'd inveterately ask -- "who's that guy, he sure can sing?" I'd just say, "that's Waylon Goddamn Jennings".

You'll probably read many fine tributes about the man. Perhaps his own words told his life story best, when he sang:

"Lord, it's the same old tune -- fiddle and guitar. Where do we take it from here? Rhinestone suits and new shiny cars, it's been the same way for years. We need a change."

"Somebody told me, when I came to Nashville, 'Son, you finally got it made. Old Hank made it here and we're all sure that you will, but I don't think Hank done it this-a way. Nah, I don't think Hank done it this-a way' "

"Ten years on the road, making one night stands, speedin' my young life away. Tell me one more time, just so's I'll understand. Are you sure Hank done it this-a way? Did old Hank really do it this-a way?"

"Lord, I've seen the world with a five piece band, lookin' at the backside of me. Singing my songs, one of his now and then, but I don't think Hank done 'em this-a way. Nah, I don't think Hank done 'em this-a way."

Waylon sang the songs his way, and he could sing them like no one else. I don't care who's in whatever Hall of Fame thing -- Waylon Jennings is still The King.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 15:42:39 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.53)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

I know this accent and speech talk isn't Band related but I'm going to bring it around you'll see. Like Matt K I think it is very sad to lose regional expressions and accents, and find them so interesting, especially the more colorful expressions. Unfortunately my own accent is now so goofed up that it prompts people to ask "Just WHERE are you from?" I started off with a Southern California thing from 18 years in Eagle Rock, LA, then went to college in Chicago with lots of New Yorkers and Midwesterners, then spent six years working in Boston where I picked up some strange sounds and wicked good expressions--like "skeevy" which comes from an Italian root and means disgusting, as in "what a skeevy guy." And now 11 years in Cincinnati has given me an odd little twang on top of it all, though I can't get used to the formation "the floor needs swept," "the house needs cleaned," etc. which you hear all the time here.

Anyway, in listening to Rick Danko's (and maybe also Richard and Robbie's speech I'm not sure) there is a funny way of pronouncing the letter T which I think is a Great Lakes thing--it is almost a th sound but not quite. I know people from Buffalo that also pronounce it that way. Levon certainly uses a lot of colorful expressions. My favorite expression is "hotter than a hootowl" which a friend from Missouri uses and which makes little sense.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 13:45:11 CET 2002 from (205.211.160.1)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto

I saw CSNY last evening. Superb 3 hour + show. NY at his absolute best. Harmonies superb. Stills in remarkable voice did a blues number with Booker T and the others which was a standout. Eight Miles High for the encore. A searing Rockin' In the Free World and an exuberant Woodstock. Wooden Ships, Carry On, Long Time Gone... Old Man, Southern Man and of course Almost Cut My Hair (David Crosby as vital as ever. And Graham Nash the anchor for this still vital foursome. If they are coming through your area, my advice is not to miss this. Its well worth it. They were having fun and it showed. I've never seen Neil so relaxed. The most amazing thing to me is the acoustics in the Air Canada (hockey) Centre. Maple Leaf Gardens was never like this. I thought the Dylan concert sound was a fluke. This is a great large venue for music. Congratulations whoever put that place together soundwise.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 11:50:21 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Always liked Waylon, close friends of mine saw him and Willie at a casino here locally last fall and could tell he was feeling poorly then, but never the less went out and put on a good show, but it was apparent to my friends then that he was in a bad way


Posted on Thu Feb 14 06:58:36 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

I always enjoyed the Civil War album produced by Paul Kennerly. Waylon Jennings done some good guitar work on that record.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 06:23:51 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp70717.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.194.50)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

I tried to reach you
On VALENTINE'S DAY
But how can I reach you
When you're soooooooo far away?
..................
I bring you this cross
I carved out of wood
I'm just trying to tell you
That I'd change if I could
...........
Robbie Robertson....Breakin The Rules....1991....Storyville


Posted on Thu Feb 14 06:07:29 CET 2002 from dialup-63.208.70.159.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (63.208.70.159)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Many thanks to John Donabie for posting the LW disc lists. All I can ask (and it's greedy, I know) is where's Georgia? I don't care that the first line is missing.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 05:41:46 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tg012.proxy.aol.com (64.12.102.152)

Dave Z

From: Chaska, MN

Ah Man, Waylon has passed on... I always loved that green album he did with Willie... btw it was my Mom's album too not mine...

I hope none of you all got that bad stomach flu going around... I just got over it... One minute your perfectly fine... and just an hour later the hard cold floor in front of the toliet feels like your best friend... I lost 10 lbs in 1 day... Had to take my baby girl to ER... she got ear infections from all the purging... I'm all better now, the others not far behind... We think maybe it had something to do with an Olympic ice skating event... Ah, it's soooo easy to joke after you've come back... Well, I've missed two days of school and work... not to mention all the lively discussion herein... so I think I'll go read some Harry Potter 4... with Sea in the background... Keep going for Gold... Levon, Garth and the Robster... We luv ya all...

P.S. - Shouldn't the Guru CD be coming out soon? I'm looking forward to that first off...


Posted on Thu Feb 14 05:26:02 CET 2002 from spider-tk021.proxy.aol.com (152.163.206.181)

Calvin

I'm sure many of you are aware of this but there is a multi volume dictionary that just covers american words that arent universal, one of my Profs in Grad School was heavily involved in it, and it is quite fascinating reading. You'll find references such as Devil's Strip-The area of grass between the sidewalk and the road-Northern Summit County, Ohio. It's a lot of fun. Band related notes, I purchased today a CD of a Byrds concert from 1969, I didn't notice till I got home they do a Version of This Wheel's on Fire-can't wait to hear it-it is the GR Parsons/McGuin version of the group. When I heard Jennings had past away I tuned into a few country stations hoping to hear some of his tunes, perhaps some Highwaymen, but alas not much more than a mention. Is it me or when "country" music became pop with fiddles and Steel Guitars, (Ala Faith Hill, Garth Brooks, Shania Twain) a whole lot was lost in the transition? Give Waylon, Willie and the Boys any day to some of the stuff that passes for country today. You'd think with the popularity of the soundtrack to Oh Brother Where Art Thou the programmers for "country" stations would realize there is an audience for roots country, but alas, no.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 03:00:04 CET 2002 from ppp57.ac1.56k.execulink.com (209.239.5.57)

Paul Godfrey

From: C A N A D A

Oh my. Waylon is gone. As a young dj in Chatham Ontario in 1967 I got to Cobo Hall for one big time country show. Tammy Wynette sang, Harland Howard was in the audience and to my surprise and everlasting gratitude the Outlaw himself shook my hand backstage and sat for in interview for a good 15 minutes.

He was humble and appreciated all of the good things that had come his way and still took the time to talk with his fans...even a lowly dj.

I feel much older tonight. God speed to that mansion in the sky.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:59:16 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Wow I had no idea it was going back into theaters. Thanks for the info Amanda. I've always thought it was a beautiful name since I had a boyhood crush on Amanda Blake who played "Miss Kitty" on Gunsmoke. My wife's name is Amelia. Just a couple of "Big A's"


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:55:31 CET 2002 from dial2a-66.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.66)

Hi

John, TLW is being screened in big cities around the country including NYC in the same theater I saw it (the Ziegfield) when it was originally released. I forgot its name and even forgot its ornate architecture until I read about its rerelease.....also thanks for the info. about where to pick up Bunky and Jake (Amazon)...


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:55:09 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Now that the info is getting out......this is the way it looks at this stage

Disc 1
1. THEME FROM THE LAST WALTZ - with Orchestra
The Concert
2. UP ON CRIPPLE CREEK
3. THE SHAPE I’M IN
4. IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE
5. WHO DO YOU LOVE – with Ronnie Hawkins
6. LIFE IS A CARNIVAL
7. SUCH A NIGHT - with Dr. John
8. THE WEIGHT
9. DOWN SOUTH IN NEW ORLEANS - with Bobby Charles
10. THIS WHEEL’S ON FIRE
11. MYSTERY TRAIN – with Paul Butterfield
12. CALEDONIA - with Muddy Waters
13. MANNISH BOY – with Muddy Waters
14. STAGE FRIGHT

Disc 2
1. RAG MAMA RAG
2 ALL OUR PAST TIMES - with Eric Clapton
3. FURTHER ON UP THE ROAD - with Eric Clapton
4. OPHELIA
5. HELPLESS - with Neil Young
6. FOUR STRONG WINDS - with Neil Young
7. COYOTE - with Joni Mitchell
8. SHADOWS AND LIGHT - with Joni Mitchell
9. FURRY SINGS THE BLUES - with Joni Mitchell
10. ACADIAN DRIFTWOOD
11. DRY YOUR EYES - with Neil Diamond
12. THE W.S. WALCOTT MEDICINE SHOW
13. TURA LURA LURA (THAT’S AN IRISH LULLABY) - with Van Morrison
14. CARAVAN - with Van Morrison

Disc 3
1. THE NIGHT THEY DROVE OLD DIXIE DOWN
2. THE GENETIC METHOD/CHEST FEVER (Excerpt from Movie Soundtrack)
3. BABY LET ME FOLLOW YOU DOWN - with Bob Dylan
4. HAZEL - with Bob Dylan
5. I DON’T BELIEVE YOU (SHE ACTS LIKE WE NEVER HAVE MET) - with Bob Dylan
6. FOREVER YOUNG - with Bob Dylan
7. BABY LET ME FOLLOW YOU DOWN (Reprise) - with Bob Dylan
8. I SHALL BE RELEASED (Finale)
9. JAM #1
10. JAM #2
11. DON’T DO IT
12. GREENSLEEVES (From Movie Soundtrack)

Disc 4

The Last Waltz Suite
1. THE WELL
2. EVANGELINE - with Emmylou Harris
3. OUT OF THE BLUE
4. THE WEIGHT - with The Staples
5. THE LAST WALTZ REFRAIN
6. THEME FROM THE LAST WALTZ

Concert Rehearsal
7. KING HARVEST (HAS SURELY COME)
8. TURA LURA LURA (THAT’S AN IRISH LULLABY) - with Van Morrison
9. CARAVAN - with Van Morrison
10. SUCH A NIGHT - with Dr. John
11. RAG MAMA RAG

Studio Ideas
12. MAD WALTZ (Sketch track for “The Well”)
13. THE LAST WALTZ REFRAIN (Instrumental Version)
14. THE LAST WALTZ THEME (Sketch Idea)

Dedicated to the memory of Rick Danko and Richard Manuel


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:55:04 CET 2002 from cache-mtc-al05.proxy.aol.com (64.12.96.234)

Brien Sz

From: Nj

Quick Concert Update: My wife and I just got back from our Pre-Valentine dinner at a wonderful Rock/Blues club The Crossroads, where they serve GREAT Cajun food, and on the list to play: Jim Weider and the Honky Tonk Gurus, March 9th. It's a Saturday night - show starts between 9:30 and 10pm. The Crossroads is in Garwood, New Jersey, Exit 137 off the Garden State Parkway on Rt. 28, 908-232-5666. The place has a great bayou decor, Fantastic Food!!!!! We're Going (as of this writing)

Butch - - this would be a great venue for Levon and the BB's also!


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:51:20 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

John D: The Last Waltz is making it's theatrical debut April 12 in San Francisco then on to New York City, Los Angeles,Seattle, San Diego, Chicago, Boston, Philadelphia, Toronto, and Washington, D.C. You are lucky to have the opportunity to see it in Toronto. I only mentioned Memphis because I will be there around that time and because of Levon's popularity in that city and his involvement with the Handy Awards and Blues Aid. I feel like a screening would go over well in Memphis, but unfortunately they didn't choose any Southern cities. Thanks to you and Big Red for mentioning Waylon Jennings. Most gals love outlaws and he was one outlaw that changed country music. I'll never forget that he sang "Amanda" and made me feel special when I was a little girl...especially at that time when my name was unpopular and considered old-fashioned.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:45:13 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

Anyone notice tonight that if you hit your back button to where the "Preview" is for editing......that your post has gone and it has reset itself?????????


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:22:56 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

AMANDA: I must have missed something. I knew all about the DVD and CD release of TLW; but nothing of the "big screen" debut. I didn't know it was going back into theaters and why Memphis? I'm afraid I've missed a few things here. Thanks Amanda. Always enjoy your posts.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:18:20 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

From: C A N A D A

God Bless Waylon. The respected journalist Chet Flippo said tonight he was the original outlaw. He was the first to record in Nashville using his own band and the first to start bucking the system. He received many awards including landing in the Hall of Fame last year and refused to go to any of them. After giving up his seat to The Big Bopper in 1959, Waylon went back to Texas as a DJ. It was, of all people, Herb Alpert who coaxed him out of retirement to record a folk album for A&M; which included "Don't Think Twice, It's Allright. Diabetes and other problems took him today. A true country legend. R.I.P. 1937-2002


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:17:56 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Alan...does scouse mean drunk, smashed, looped ??? ;o)


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:16:12 CET 2002 from spider-wm012.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.152)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

MattK: just wanted to say I appreciated your post on accents and have to agree wholeheartedly from my experience. Even in VA there are so many accents from county to county even.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:15:31 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Web page

I am glad someone finally recognized all the distinctive dialects of the Southern United States. That's right....we're not all related ;0)! Levon definitely has that Arkansas Delta twang and is lucky to have it in his possession after all the years he has lived in New York. I think I lost part of mine somewhere in Texas :o( . The Gullah dialect here in coastal South Carolina is one of the oldest and the most incredibly difficult to understand...yet so lovely to the ears. Oh...speakin' of Arkansas...I'll be in the foothills of the Ozarks in April for the film festival honoring Levon. The big screen debut of the re-mastered Last Waltz will occur right around that time...I wonder why they aren't bringing it to Memphis? Oh well...when I weigh the two events...a tribute to Levon means much more.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:00:52 CET 2002 from spider-tk071.proxy.aol.com (152.163.206.206)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

I blew Yoko's lyrics. It's "we're all water from different RIVERS...."

I'm sorry - I'm such a wanker. I should have my bum kicked.

If anyone dosen't know what I mean by "blew" Yoko's lyrics - e-mail me and I'll explain it to you, :-)


Posted on Thu Feb 14 02:00:51 CET 2002 from akcf3.xtra.co.nz (203.96.111.201)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

Robbie promises us some unheard of stuff from TLW suite which sounds great to me. I always thought The Well in particular was under rated. Maybe not the best lyrics Robbie has written but certainly some great playing from Garth and Robbie. As for The Weight I musb prefer the TLW version to the original.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 01:56:30 CET 2002 from pool-151-204-118-16.ny325.east.verizon.net (151.204.118.16)

Big Red

Bad news from the land o' country: Waylon Jennings has gone to the great gig in the sky. He was 64. It sure was a good ride, pardner....


Posted on Thu Feb 14 01:53:02 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan edge

From: Diddypool

Are you Scouse then Sam lad? :-]


Posted on Thu Feb 14 01:45:47 CET 2002 from spider-wl052.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.42)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

"We're all water from different oceans, that's why it's so easy to meet. '

"We're all water in this vast, vast ocean, someday we'll evaporate together."......-YOKO ONO

Did I just quote Yoko? God help me.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 01:41:58 CET 2002 from spider-wl052.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.42)

Bayou Sam

From: born in the Bronx

Hey all dis tawk about da langwidge stuff is un-freakin' baleevabull. I dawt dis was abowt da muzic 'n all. Will yooz all cool it an jus relax or supmn? I meen, wearall heer in da same wirld ain't we. Even dat chick frum Japan powsted in heer. Dat wuz cool, rite? :-)


Posted on Thu Feb 14 01:07:43 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

At the very least I certainly think we all need to get a grip.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 00:50:51 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

I think it's about time us wankers pulled ourselves together :-)

Just a thought.

I'll get me coat.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 00:35:07 CET 2002 from syr-24-95-166-152.twcny.rr.com (24.95.166.152)

Patty Walsh

From: Otisco Lake

I cannot believe my eyes. The Fred Funk I know would never say such things.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 00:28:06 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-2nd-24-31-154-219.maine.rr.com (24.31.155.219)

MattK

The language thread reminded me of a Band-related story.

When I was a kid, my parents took me to see "Coal Miner's Daughter" at an area theater. My father was raised in southwestern Virginia in the same Appalachian coal mining region at the same time as Loretta Lynn(they're about the same age). In fact, Lorreta grew up only a few miles over the Tennesee border from my dad's home in Lee County, VA. My dad's stories of growing up "farm poor" are reminiscent of what you see in the film, and he was impressed with how faithful the film was in depicting that way of life. Levon, he said, reminded him so much of his own father that it was eerie.

The only thing that really bothered him, though, was Levon's accent. While it was obvious to him the guy was Southern, dad was perturbed through the film that Levon "didn't talk right" for someone from that area. He didn't know exactly where he was from, but it was clear to my Dad that he wasn't from Appalachia, much less the Smokey Mountain coal towns that he knew well. For some reason, Tommy Lee Jones' Texas accent was less of a problem for him, probably because his character didn't seem so familiar.

Most Americans (much less folks outside the US) presume that anyone with a "drawl" is speaking with the same "Southern" accent. Outside of the South, very few can hear the difference between a Carolinian, a Georgian, and a Virginian, much less a Texan or Oklahoman. Below the Mason Dixon, the differences are anything but subtle.

Similairly, most people outside New England presume anyone dropping their "R"s gives them a New England accent. Truth be told, spend anytime here, and within a sentence you can tell if someone is from Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, Rhode Island or Massachusetts (Connecticut too, but many New Englanders have ceased to view CT as a New England state, and think it should be officially annexed as a suburb of NYC). These accents are tremendously distinct - Rhode Island accents are so obvious, your hair stands on end.

Mass. makes a great example of a place where the accents are even more distinct by area. Someone from South Boston sounds nothing like someone from the Cape, much less the Kennedy-esque accent most folks think of as "typically Boston." Central Mass. residents in Worcester (aka "Woostah") sound distinct from Western Mass. residents of Springfield.

Sadly, homogeny threatens these distinctions as people move and are less and less native to a single region or state (such as myself). The days of knowing which block in NYC someone grew up on from their accent is rapidly becoming a thing of the past.


Posted on Thu Feb 14 00:27:02 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Nancy...... I took your thick american in the right context, just having fun also....believe me I didnt take it serious.....heck Im not serious when I should be, have a good one


Posted on Thu Feb 14 00:12:19 CET 2002 from i249-009.nv.iinet.net.au (203.59.249.9)

Nancy

From: Australia

Of course I don't find my American friends to be "thick"!! Far from it. Alan's posts reminded me of minor past confusions I've had when using colloquial terms, and I was looking at our differences with tongue firmly in cheek. A mild attempt at humour.................


Posted on Wed Feb 13 23:48:08 CET 2002 from dialup-64.158.84.50.dial1.buffalo1.level3.net (64.158.84.50)

G-Man

Friday 2/15,,Mexicali Blues, Teaneck, N.J.....9 pm,,,,,, Jim Weider, Randy Ciarlante and THE HONKY TONK GURUS!! Any language, any dialect,,,,,,gonna be some HEAVY RR/RB!! Hope to see a whole lot of GB'ers at the show!!!!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 23:29:47 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-2nd-24-31-154-219.maine.rr.com (24.31.155.219)

MattK

Nancy's comments vis-a-vis arguing that somehow the colloquialisms of the Australian dialect is a more worthy variant on the mother tongue than American english is ridiculous. Peter or Alan can speak to this better, but my experience is that Aussie and American english are both considered somewhat crude in the birthplace of our shared anglo-saxon-norman language.

Bellicose, loud and obnoxious are stereotypes both Australians and Americans (specifically, the US out of respect to our Canadian friends) enjoy from a British perspective. Of course, like all stereotypes, they reveal more about the person doing the stereotyping than they do about the person being stereotyped.

For the record, American dictionaries generally resist listing slang terms, unless it's to point out how words like "ain't" or "irregardless," which are ungrammatical, even if they are used commonly. "Wanker" is a word used commonly in the US, though it is not usually meant as an "endearment" (in the US, to "wank" is a colloquialism for masturbation). "Fanny" is a real word found in the US dictionary, meaning "buttocks" - in Britain, I understand it's a slang term for female genetalia, comparable to "beaver" in the US. There are tons of these types of dialectic variations - petrol vs. gas, fag vs. cigarette.

As some have pointed out, variants occur even within a given country, sometimes even a city. Here in the US, in some areas when you go to the "liquor store," they put your "pop" in a sack; in New England, when you go to the "package store," they put your "soda" in a "bag." In some bars, when ordering a beer, you ask your waiter "what's on tap;" other places, you'd ask "what's on draw;" in others it's "what's on draft."

Probably the only thing that's unique to the US (and North America in general) compared to Australia is we're influenced by a broader range of languages here due to a broader multi-cultural experience - english is the primary language, but there are tons of American words appropriated from German, French, Spanish, Native American, Gaelic, ad infinitum. My mother is part Hawaiian, and terms like "kapakahi," (f**ked up or crooked) "maca piapia," (eye boogers) and "ipo" (darling) were in common use in the house I grew up in. I don't assume others are "thick" because they aren't familiar with them.

But if you think english is difficult, then you don't get out much. The variations in Spanish within Latin America, much less compared to Spain are even more significant. French, Quebecois and Cajun are all theoretically the same language, but a Montrealer in Paris or New Orleans is going to have some rough moments trying to communicate. Then you have Chinese, where the dialects are so distinct that a Mandarin speaker is going to find a Xiang speaker unintelligible.

Variety makes the world go round. Get over it.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 23:21:45 CET 2002 from du-tele3-097.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.97)

Peter Viney

A bit more on TLW (see also What's New?) - Wavelength (the Van mag) quotes Robbie "a lot of stuff we didn't use on the album because it was already three albums long. But now some amazing things FROM THE REHEARSALS are gonna make the package really terrific." more than we expected then! But rehearsals of "All Our Past Times" and "Further On Up the Road" exist on an Eric Clapton boot-" Eric Clapton, The Band & friends" so perhaps it's those.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 22:46:42 CET 2002 from du-tele3-078.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.78)

Peter Viney

It’s all been said before, it’s all been written in the (guest)book. On Borderline’s “Sweet Dreams & Quiet Desires” Richard Manuel appears as ‘Dick Handle’ and Garth Hudson as ‘Campo Malaqua’ because Grossman wanted to hide their session work. Note the puns “dick handle” and “malaqua” (which is Greek, meaning “wanker”). ‘wanker’ has different weight in different cultures. I like the Cockney rhyming slang, ‘a right Barclays’ (or a right Midland). This stands for ‘Barclays banker’ which stands for ‘wanker’. When we discussed this once before, I pointed out that the mild American insult ‘jerk’ stands for ‘jerk off’ … which means ‘wanker’ so is equally rude. Don’t get me on to a ‘right berk’.

Dialect experts have pointed out that while someone from London might find extreme Glasgow difficult, and someone from Boston might find West Texas difficult, in practice a Glaswegian and a West Texan have no difficulty in communicating, because both will modify their dialect to enable mutual comprehension.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 22:33:23 CET 2002 from bandfan.halden.net (195.70.189.163)

jh

Nomi,
I also hope to see some pics of Robbie at the Olympics soon. Any web sites out there with photos from the event?


Posted on Wed Feb 13 20:24:23 CET 2002 from (63.66.135.217)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

Bassmanlee: sorry, haven't been paying attention to the Charlottesville area recently. Just got back from CA, heading to Charleston, SC, then to Orlando/Tampa end of month. Musically I'm saving my pennies for Jazz Fest in N'awlins for 5 days in May. If you're in the Richmond area someday email me and we can hit a brewpub. Main St. Brewery, Richbrau, and Legends' Brewpub are highly recommended. Got our eyes set for 7/4 in Charlottesville at Oakencroft Winery, which is having an outdoors 'Blues & Wine' day.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 19:51:17 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-002ilurbap180.dialsprint.net (158.252.113.220)

Susan

From: central Illinois

Well, bassman, at least you understood the words the contractor was saying, even if you did not get the meaning. Sometime in the mid-70s I went along on a weekend band gig in Sikeston, Missouri. This is about 300 miles south and west of my home terriorty. While the band set up in the hotel bar I did my womanly duty and checked out the food and lodging situation. A couple of people were very enthusiasticly telling me about motels and restaurants in town, and I was doing my best to follow them, but I only understood a bout half the words. The accent was just too different for me to follow, although we were all native English speakers. We drove around town until we found food, and spent the night in the railroad hotel on the upper floors of the bar. Only $4 per night, and bathroom down the hall.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 19:26:15 CET 2002 from dialup-349.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.93)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

David Powells eulogy of Dave Van Ronk was one of the most beautiful posts I've ever read in here.....

I met Dave Van Ronk in Greenwich Village in 1987......he was in a songwriters joint called "The Speakeasy" on MacDougal.......A big man, I recall......I was introduced to him by another Village songwriter/performer, since passed on, Tom Intondi, who, in turn was a friend of Rick Danko......I guess they all bein' in the Heavenly Greenwich Village now........

It's great seeing a scouser in 'ere, ain't it?.....just after our kid George passed on 'n' all....makes some sorta sense to me.....seein' that George loved The Band..........Alright there, Alan, la?


Posted on Wed Feb 13 19:11:48 CET 2002 from 56k-la-01-23.dial.qnet.com (209.221.212.86)

Dave the Phone Guy

From: Mono Lake

IIkka,,,,,,Out in the Nevada desert we'll be enjoying our afternoon,,,,,BEER!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 19:02:36 CET 2002 from plantlogic.com (209.195.208.11)

bassmanlee

From: Mid-Atlantic region, USA
Web page

English being the primary language nominally spoken (or mangled) in the USA, we enjoy the luxury of traveling great distances within our own country and still have little trouble being understood on the basic level. This does not mean that the occasional misunderstanding of accent, meaning, slang, or phrase does not occur.

For example, about 20 years ago I was involved in a project in Virginia in which the engineers were all from Pennsylvania, but the contractors were almost all from parts deeper in the South than Virginia – like Arkansas, Georgia, etc. One day we were standing around after lunch chatting with some of the construction foreman when one of the Yankees asked the electrical foreman how things were going in a certain area.

"Why, it's goin' right down the chute!" enthused the grinning foreman. Simultaneously all the Northern faces fell. "Excuse me? What did you say?" stammered the engineer. "I said, it's goin' right down the chute!" said the foreman, grinning wider now as he chews his toothpick and his lieutenant chuckles. Faces fell further. Sensing that, although the Southerners liked to poke fun at us Yankees, something was not quite right with this scene. I asked him "Does that mean really, really bad...or really, really good?"

"Whah, thaat's just greaaat!", he drawled. Smiles suddenly rebounded on all faces. n We then explained that "right down the chute" is very close to "going down the tubes" (which he claimed never to have heard), or "in the dumper", meaning things could not be worse! They then explained that to them it meant they were on course and (like shooting rapids) everything was staying right down the (center of) the chute! Whew!

JTull - no, VA next week. As the great wheel turns, back to the very site of the above incident. Anything happening in the Charlottesville/Staunton area I should know about?


Posted on Wed Feb 13 18:55:53 CET 2002 from du3-3.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.3.3)

To Nomi (Japan)

From: Ilkka

"Tsugi ni, nimani no mado o akeru to, soko wa natsu no keshiki desu. Ike o wataru soyokaze ni, hasu no hana ga, yurayura to yurete imasu. Aoao to shigetta kodachi kara, semi no koe ga kikoemasu." - On the behalf of the guestbook community: We appreciate a visit from Japan. Thank you very much.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 18:48:20 CET 2002 from du3-3.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.3.3)

Ilkka

From: Nordic Countries
Web page

A serious post (for the change).
I was surprised when I read NANCY's post about differences in the English language in the different parts of the world. For me who has learned(?) English as the language #4 it is all the same everywhere. I can say in the middle of Nevada desert: "Did you enjoy your afternoon tea, Sir?" and to Alan and Peter in the middle of Herefordshire I could say: "Howdy folks". - On the other hand, I can say to my companion without anyone reacting: "Toi ranskalainen passintarkastaja haisee ihan venäläiselle mahorkalle."

I was interwiewed by a Finnish journalist on the other day, in my own language. I was satisfied because I could say what I _really_ wanted to say. In opposite to that in the Internet we "etrangers" have to do our best to communicate in English.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 18:33:15 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Thick American

NANCY Well Nanc, as thick as you seem to think americans are we do know how to read, so your message to EDGE in regards to watching what he says to us yanks was recieved loud and clear and Nanc one thing that you didnt mention to the EDGE and you couldnt know this because of your down under orgin and that is we thick yanks have a sense of humor and Im laughing as I write this---ohhhhh I almost forgot, whenever I think of you folks down there I think of that Dundee chap whos made all those blockbuster movies--- well we all have are cross to bare now dont we, good day Nancy


Posted on Wed Feb 13 18:04:16 CET 2002 from occns003.zaq.ne.jp (211.120.191.102)

nomi

From: japan

I feel so good to see Robie Robertson in the Olympic opening celemoney!! I really hope to see the picture on this sight.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 17:52:20 CET 2002 from dhcp5858.sunyocc.edu (204.168.58.58)

FUNK,fred funk

From: northeast of borodino

MATT K. : Have two teenage daughters at home. One, ranked second in the state of New York last year in Slalom as Jr IV and was also ranked fourth in Giant Slalom. She practices three hours three nights weekly leaving time for homework and all days on Saturday.. The USSA/NYSSRA Races are on Sundays at different venues throughout the State. The dedication and hours put in to technically meet and beat the competiion is sometimes overwhelming. As a matter of fact Ive been skiing for going on 45 years (dating myself) and i still compete on the Masters Level.. I have snowboarded in the Bowls of Sun valley Id., Alta, and Snowbird Ut.. If there is plently of Deep Powder Snowboarding can be kinda fun; other wise its just plain boring.. Spending an entire day in a half pipe when you could be out exploring the Mountain and the aesthetic beauty surrounding you for me far surpasses sliding around on my ass listing to mostly disconcertable loud music is for me not the way to get the most out of the mountain experience.. I do realize though that this opinion is subjective and the world is changing.. NOT always for the better. I think the young American who placed second in the PIPE the other night put it best. " I was a skier first but couldnlt really get the hang of it.. I couldn't put my turns together; I tried snowboarding one day and by days end i was moving down the mountain like a star". Nough Said!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 17:05:27 CET 2002 from (66.200.102.18)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

BassManLee: My company is also in Automation & Controls. SCAAAARRRRY! Hope you don't have to go out to Chicago next month for National Mfg. Week. I got out of it by scheduling sales calls during that week.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 16:31:47 CET 2002 from syr-24-169-66-92.twcny.rr.com (24.169.66.92)

Bashful Bill

From: Minoa,N.Y.

Well, I finally broke down and saw Joan Baez, for the first time, last night. Mrs. Bashful Bill has seen her a few times, and I bought her 2 tix for an anniversery present. I actually enjoyed it much more than I expected to. She was in suprisingly good voice, I had heard of late that her vocal chops weren't what they used to be.It was the first show of her current tour,as well as a makeup, as she had cancelled a good portion of her last tour due to the illness and death of her sister Mimi Farina lastyear. A lot of covers-Dylan, of course(Baby Blue), Steve Earle, Dar Williams, and Greg Brown. She also sang some songs written by her stage partners, folkies Richard Shindell,Tracy Grammar, and David Carter. Three songs into the show she did an acapella version of Dixie, and very clearly said "blood". Guess she didn't read Peter's article.And, I overheard a woman sitting near us raving about Ryan Adams Gold. All in all, I had a suprisingly good time.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 16:12:00 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Rose (Mary Steenburgen): "You sure look good in uniform."

Leo (Levon Helm): "Chicago turned me into a clothes horse."

--one of my favorite onscreen scenes involving Levon (from the film "End of the Line")

It's also nice to hear that Levon's onscreen daughter, Cissy Spacek, is once again nominated for an Oscar.

Regarding the length of Ryan Adams' "Gold" album -- many of you, like me, have purchased the "limited edition" version that contains a second disc of out-takes. These songs were trimmed from the regular CD version of "Gold", which includes 16 songs, to keep it down to around 70 minutes. Mr. Adams is a prolific songwriter and he evidently wanted to get all these songs released. With the way things are going in the recording industry, he knows how it feels to be "between labels" and unable to get an album released. His former group Whiskeytown was dropped by Geffen in 1999, after just completing an album. It took two years before that CD, "Pneumonia", was polished up and finally released on another label.

Word is that Mr. Adams already has new album ready for release soon, as well as yet another album of new material near completion. It was recently announced that "Gold" has been nominated for 3 Grammys. The video for the song "New York, New York" was filmed on location in New York City last September 7th!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 15:58:30 CET 2002 from stx32.library.uiuc.edu (130.126.32.133)

Susan

From: central Illinois, where the East and the South meet

All Americans don't have trouble with English speakers from other shores. After a lifetime of reading, and watching The Professionals, I can work out most of Alan's posts. He mostly uses what I think of as older or classic slang. It's the new stuff that leaves me puzzled; Alan did use one word, beginning with n, but not naff, that I could not work out a meaning for. It's words like naff, and, most mysterious, big girls blouse, that have me pondering the ways of neology.

As for wanker, those in the know are always amazed to hear it used in imported tv shows on public television (public television, for those outside the US, is the more tony or cultured tv station in any particular area, often run by a university) because it probably would not pass the censors and standards if a US equivalent were used. As only a small portion of the audience knows the word it gets by. naff


Posted on Wed Feb 13 14:42:47 CET 2002 from plantlogic.com (209.195.208.11)

basmanlee

From: DE, USA

For the rest of you thick 'Mericans, a second-hand story from my engineering background to illuminate Nancy's polite references to the Brit-speak definition of "fanny".

An American was giving a technical talk to a non-technical and largely British audience about automation and controls (my field). He was trying to describe a retro-reflective photoeye, which has a pair of thick, bulging lenses like those magnifying specs worn by the severely sight-impaired. He described this pair of convex curves as looking, if turned face down, "like a fanny". At this several the women in the audience blushed and one got up and walked out.

After the talk, the embarrassed presenter asked his host what he had done wrong.

"Well," his host replied, "I think the term you were looking for was 'bum' (posterior). The 'fanny' is on the ladies' other side!"


Posted on Wed Feb 13 14:09:22 CET 2002 from pd9e67505.dip.t-dialin.net (217.230.117.5)

ulbiman

From: germany
Web page

Hi, Nancy, good that you love Ryan Adams down under. Go to your record shop and get "Heartbreaker" his first solo cd and get all the stuff of Whiskeytown his former band. I hope i´m not boring you all with this information. BTW, the cover of Ryan´s cd (american flag) was shot before 9/11 ! And here something for our olympic freaks. All you swedish , finish (is that riht ?), american and canadian icehockey fans, take a look for the german team. They won there group. Maybe they can bother the big teams a little bit. which is a great success!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 13:37:12 CET 2002 from (205.211.160.1)

Dr. J.

From: TO

So..... international intrigue in figure skaking....SKATEGATE... as it were. More interesting than the competition itself. Let's see how they deal with this one.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 13:21:01 CET 2002 from i249-009.nv.iinet.net.au (203.59.249.9)

Nancy

From: Australia

G'day to Alan!

Alan, you need to remember that colloquial expressions can lead to mucho confusion between people who live in different parts of the world. In fact some of YOUR words were lost on me even though there are firm ties between Australia and Britain (Britain being our Mother country sometime way back before the Republican movement was thought of).

I've been corresponding and communicating with several Americans and boy are they thick!!!!!!!!!! There are times when they hardly understand ANYTHING I say, and later they will blather on about things that have absolutely NO meaning here in Oz! I don't get it at all. I've even been forced to explain the meaning of such basic Aussie terms as "wanker" which as any one knows, is a form of endearment here (probably in the UK too). The word isn't even in the American Websters dictionary for crying out loud!

The other term that caused confusion is the word "fanny", which appears so many times in a well known song people mention here in the GB from time to time. It simply doesn't have the same meaning here in Australia as it does in the US, and this led to a fit of embarrassment in my young daughter when she gave up listening to the Hansons several years ago, and started to become aware of the the lyrics of my music instead.

So Alan, you must proceed with caution when dealing with people who communicate in mysterious tongues. A few careless words can change the meaning of your message completely. And lastly, what IS the meaning of that term you used a while back, "scouser" or "souser".......that went right over my head!!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 11:50:56 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Hey -EDGE- thanx for the definition of Jammy Bastard and lucky in the fact that I discovered the Band. Marriage is a wonderfull thing-- as long as Im not involved in it that is-- Im sick of the figure skating, bring on the puck.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 10:15:45 CET 2002 from (203.59.249.9)

Nancy

From: Australia

I support Brien Sz's comments about Ryan Adams' "Gold" being a mite too long. This doesn't mean that I've studied it minutely and can name those tracks I would have saved for another day. I'm just stating my opinion based on how I feel when I listen to it. And maybe that kind of dissection is already being done by the good folk on the Ryan Adams website.

I'm not putting any of his songs down in any way shape or form, in fact I love the album like so many others people here who have commented on it. I bought it in a closing down sale in a without having any idea of what he sounded like. The opening bars of the first song were surprisingly exciting and I knew I hadn't blown my hard earned sheckles..........

I listen quite often now, and that's saying something given the choice I have here. I was very impressed to find that he wrote all the songs himself. He has to be a very talented young singer/songwriter (with Band influences!!) and anyone who hasn't got "Gold" should beg, borrow or steal a copy and have a listen.

In addition to his obvious talent, he also appears to be a very proud American, given his bedroom decor, a pic of which appears on the back of the CD!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 07:45:29 CET 2002 from (194.100.60.131)

Kalervo

From: Finland

Hah...What a fine tuesday in Olympics. Our Janne Lahtela won a Gold medal (sorry..no America the soooo beautiful this time)and Estonia got two medals in Men' s 15 kilometres (if it is not Finland let it be Estonia!)...


Posted on Wed Feb 13 02:57:05 CET 2002 from ppp579.ac1.56k.execulink.com (209.239.15.9)

Paul Godfrey

From: C A N A D A
Web page

Rollie, loved your humour regarding our Canadian Fiqure Skating Champions. If only she was wearing Brass Knuckles even Don Cherry would be applauding.

Yes we ended up with Silver, but our skaters were Second to None!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 02:55:17 CET 2002 from hvc-24-164-174-169.hvc.rr.com (24.164.174.169)

Dennis

From: Chilly West Saugerties, NY
Web page

Good evening, and burrrrr, it's cold here in upstate New York!

For those of you with a good speed connetion, tomorrow evening, at www.wamc.org 9:00 EST, Professor Louie and the Crowmatics are performing live on the Dancin' on The Air radio show. Who knows what the lineup will be.

For you close to Albany, the show's a freebie, but don't know exactly how to get tix...

Im sure it'll be a goodie!


Posted on Wed Feb 13 02:12:48 CET 2002 from 2cust123.tnt24.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.194.251.123)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

It's all too obvious that the Canadian figure skaters lost because the judges wanted to stick it to hoser Robbie for ripping off the rest of The Band members!!

BTW I like that synchronized ice fishing idea and think they should also introduce snowball fights the next time 'round. Much more skilfull than a tug of war in my opinion. A snowshoe marathon race might be good too, maybe with motorized snowshoes to speed up the action.


Posted on Wed Feb 13 00:49:54 CET 2002 from dm125.davidson-marketing.com (209.224.210.254)

Tim Kocher

From: Chicago

I have a question for the bootleg-literate among you, if that's OK. I'm choosing from a very large Dylan bootlist for an upcomind trade, and I'm pondering "A Tree With Roots" - I already have a CDR of the 5CD Genuine Basement Tapes release, and am wondering if this really is a significant upgrade overall. If it is, I'll jump at it. Also, are there any tracks on the 5 disc that didn't make it to "A Tree With Roots"? Feel free to respond via my email address above if you wish to keep this off-list. Many thanks,

Tim


Posted on Wed Feb 13 00:20:17 CET 2002 from spider-to054.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.69)

Harry & Mim

From: Bucks County, Pa

Band Fans: FIGURE SKATING & Bryan Adams????

How far the folks in the GB have fallen...

Who's gonna be at the Conduit in beautiful downtown Trenton, NJ a week from Friday to see The BarnBurners (one of the best shows around - take it from one who has seen more than his share - guests at shows we've seen have included Little Sammy Davis, Garth Hudson, Bobby Keyes, and John Simon, to name all those I can remember). LH also played on one particularly "hot" show summer before last in NYC's Central Park with Hubert Sumlin, Jimmy Vivino & David Johanssen on all Chester Arthur Burnett (AKA Howlin' Wolf) material.

Let's meet some of you local folks in Trenton and see what kind of trouble we can get into.

Butch - that goes for you, too, you sly ladykiller.

Dr. John this Friday night, LH & the BB's the week after - life is good.

It does, however, take a lot of medicine to keep up this pace....

"How come my dog don't bark when you come around."


Posted on Tue Feb 12 23:29:22 CET 2002 from cache-hay-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.32.130)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Or should that be the LAST one!!


Posted on Tue Feb 12 23:23:43 CET 2002 from cache-hay-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.32.130)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Hi Chester - yer jammy bastard - ex-wife huh? - some guys have all the luck.

Oh hi Mag - er nothing love - er just commiserating with me ole Minnesota mate Chester here about his rotten luck with his former darling wife - yeah, see ya later honey

Sorry Chester mate - I'll have to watch with this transatlantic translation slant. Rest assured 'jammy bastard' in this Band like context is an endearing term. Strict translation is 'lucky so and so'.

I'm new here too so I'll leave it to the others to fill you in on the Robbie versus Levon thing. In essence though things are a bit frosty between them. So much so in fact that I've heard on the old grapevine that later tonight they're staging their own Winter Olympics. Basically, the first one to thaw out is the winner.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 23:20:27 CET 2002 from 66-106-4-126.customer.algx.net (66.106.4.126)

MattK

Here's hoping Freddy has a teenager at home who just read his post and is relishing the idea of watching dear old dad exhibit just how easy it is to execute a 45-degree turn without going "fakey" or face-planting after only a couple hours practice. But hey, most beginner toothpick riders are off the bunny slope and onto full-scale green runs after a morning of lessons. ; - )


Posted on Tue Feb 12 22:41:20 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Thanks for the recognition EDGE, Jammy bastard huh!! well I cant remember ever being called that before, although if you leave off Jammy you have my X wifes nickname for me though so yeh I guess it works. So being new in here let me ask this question, Ive looked into the archives in the guestbook and have looked at a number of notes and there seems to be a lot of Robertson bashing, from what Ive read in the short time that Ive been a Band fan i know that Levon has a grudge against Robertson apparently over Robbie apparently taking most of the credit for the Bands work, is it also a money thing as well, when I look at the songs done by these guys its apparent that Robbie did almost all the writting after Pink and some of the Bands best are Robbie tunes, it would seem to me that Robbie is not that far off base as far as the music direction of this group went in because of his song writting. I guess we will never know how much input the rest of the guys had but I have to believe if it was anything measurable Levon and the rest of the guys would have recieved notice at the time...... If anyone would enlighten the rookie it would be appreiated


Posted on Tue Feb 12 21:30:35 CET 2002 from du-tele3-142.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.142)

Peter Viney

There was a TV sketch (=skit) about ice dancing judges once. Was it "Not the Nine O'Clock News"? Very funny, I recall. It followed the same theme of biased judges. I remember the shock when Torvill & Dean lost to the Russians once.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 20:51:05 CET 2002 from dhcp5858.sunyocc.edu (204.168.58.58)

FUNK! fred funk

From: northeast of borodino

SNOWBORING!! I don't know about the rest of you but to watch the "KnuckleDraggers" compete night after night is turning me off to the Olympics. Any competition ( am not convinced its a sport) that relies so much on subjective judgement (even figure skating looks and is physically challenging and takes years of practice to beat the comp) can't be to terribly difficult. Heck, at our local ski area the most unathletic of individuals seem to pick up the basics only hours after being on a board. I actually could find no distinct difference in most of the routines i witnessed in the half pipe... A little speed, some twists, one or two inverted flips (done by Stein Erickson in the 60's); a tad more speed,, some excellent knuckle dragging and bingo your on the podium. DOWNHILL!!!! 80 mph, G forces like having Garths organ on your back, a 75 degree pitch and 3000 feet of vertical drop.. Thats the Olympics.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 20:29:23 CET 2002 from sungold1.ie.ibm.com (195.212.29.193)

Morpheus Ragekill

Here's to The Band: To whom musical direction was dictated down one road and they followed another.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 20:17:48 CET 2002 from on-tor-blr-ahp-12-109.look.ca (209.161.232.237)

Wittgenstein

From: A Period Of Transition

David Powell, you are the light of this guestbook. That was a beautiful tribute to Dave Van Ronk. I like to think that Dylan opened much of his last tour with "Duncan and Brady" as a tip of the hat to the man who befriended him and taught him a lot in his early days in New York. You can certainly learn a great deal about American music listening to Van Ronk. He played guitar like Reverend Gary Davis or Blind Blake, his voice sounded like a cross between Louis Armstrong and W.C. Fields when four sheets to the wind, or incredibly moving and delicate when taking on something like "Clouds (Both Sides Now)" by Joni. He was someone that you wanted to watch and learn from. Sadly, "That'll Never Happen No More, no that'll never happen no more."


Posted on Tue Feb 12 19:33:54 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

"Though I am old with wandering
Through hollow lands and hilly lands,
I will find out where she has gone,
And kiss her lips and take her hands;
And walk among the long dappled grass,
And pluck till time and times are done,
The silver apples of the moon,
The golden apples of the sun."
--W.B. Yeats (from The Song of Wandering Aengus)

Apart from their shared connection with Dylan, The Band and Dave Van Ronk, at least on the surface, may seem to have little in common. But dip below the ripples of the swiftly moving streams of music and you'll find they shared secrets beneath the currents.

Dave Van Ronk was a musical alchemist who blended the base essences of folk, blues and jazz into an boiling caldron. There was magic in the music he played. As he fingered the silvery strings on his guitar, there was deep intensity in his vocals that came from within. He discovered early on, the coal-like roughness in his voice could be converted into sharp, diamond facets of emotion.

As a young man I first discovered the beauty of what was called "folk music" in the '60s. One of my most amazing discoveries came when I bought an album on the Verve label entitled "No Dirty Names" by Dave Van Ronk. The music on that LP opened wide world of many musical avenues. From the Josh White song -- "you get's no bread with one meatball", to the "wake up momma" of Blind Willie McTell, to the "show me the way to the next whiskey bar" of Weill & Brecht, to the utter forlorn Dylan lament about an old homeless man dying alone on the street, and to the many other musical paths in between.

And then there was the W.B. Yeats poem, rich with images from Irish mythology, that Mr. Van Ronk set to music and sang with all the restrained intensity of a man consumed by the fire of age burning in his head.

And so now, sadly, Dave Van Ronk has passed beyond time, to a place where he can pluck "the silver apples of the moon" and "the golden apples of the sun". But on this shore he left behind many "silver trouts" of song he caught for us to feast upon.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 19:05:04 CET 2002 from du72-249.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.249.72)

Ilkka

From: The land of ice
Web page

Thread: FIGURE SKATING - On the rumoured Band album "Turkey Scratch" there is a song called "Unfaithful Figure Skater Going To Cripple Creek In A Rocking Chair Wearing The Long Black Veil". Figure skating is at the same time an innocent and sexy sport. In my mind, this makes the song even more complexe. Looking forward to read further analyzis in this gb.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 18:51:37 CET 2002 from ppp-1-51.5800-9.telinco.net (212.1.136.51)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Chester - really enjoyed your post mate. What a great way to discover these fellas. I envy you as you marinate in the luscious beauty of delights yet to unfold for you. You jammy bastard.

Re these Winter Olympics - when does the synchronised ice fishing commence? At 15 under zero? When the baby comes to breath?

I'll er get me coat :-)


Posted on Tue Feb 12 18:28:39 CET 2002 from 66-106-4-126.customer.algx.net (66.106.4.126)

MattK

Posers?

Feh, at least the Olympic Snow Boarding event emphasizes real board techniques and not that cute little powdered rooster tail that keeps Euro-Carvers off the a-syms real boarders use ; - )

BTW, say what you want about figure skating, but it sure is better than "rhythmic gymnastics" or "synchronized swimming." At least on ice, there's always the possibility of bloodshed when someone goes airborn for a triple jump wearing razor sharp knives on their feet. Besides, it CAN be contact sport, sometimes - just ask Tonya Harding.

While we're on the topic of boring Olympic sports, did you know that ballooning was once tested as a demonstration sport? Power Boating was actually an official medal sport(makes you wonder when NASCAR and Formula One will make an appearance). The Tug-of-War was part of the track-and-field events until 1920 - though it may not have been that boring, if they used a mud pit stocked with alligators...


Posted on Tue Feb 12 18:26:56 CET 2002 from (205.245.52.66)

carmen

From: pa

I read that the opening ceremony had the highest rating ever with a 25.5 point rating. Each point represents 1,055,000 homes. I think this is U.S. homes only. I hope this opens the BAND's as well as RR's music up to a new audience!

Regards!


Posted on Tue Feb 12 16:00:13 CET 2002 from bellmed02.med.utoronto.ca (128.100.152.12)

Dr. J.

From: TO

Jan: Correct again. I never thought I would ever write about figure skating to anyone..especially not to THE BAND site. However, again to have a competition that is 1) TOTALLY subjective with no objective measurement (time measurement, event (like a goal), etc) and 2) with political implications and 3) even with bias possibly is unfathomable to me. I have said this many times to anyone who would listen. I understand the skill and accuracy required to carry out such an arduous event as figure skating. What I don't understand is how an organization as erudite as the Olympic organization will tolerate what continues to happen in this subjective competition. If figure skating (and events like it) are going to continue to be in these competitions, the judges are going to have to be 'blinded' somehow; they will have to watch a video and not see the faces; the competitors will have to wear the same uniforms and skate to the same music; There has to be some standardization, or it will continue to be a farce not worthy of the time (and anger) that so many give it. It is worth looking at how to do this properly if it is going to be done. This certainly is NOT the way. It is negative in every aspect but the event itself. I have been disturbed for many years (even when it wasn't a Canadian who "won".)


Posted on Tue Feb 12 15:43:03 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp1534.dialsprint.net (63.187.14.10)

rollie

You Canucks are too much! I believe it is quite clear from a replay of the skating warmups, that that little nymph Jamie took quite the run at that poor Rooskie(that's boarding in the NHL!)and this is what cost them the gold.A close-up look at the footage also reveals a pair of brass knuckles, aimed squarely at the lads genitalia, only missing because of a slight twist at the last moment. How dare you suggest partisanship on behalf of the eastern-bloc countries!!!!


Posted on Tue Feb 12 15:34:04 CET 2002 from hoiberg.hiof.no (158.36.51.55)

jh

Figure skating...phht...what's next on the Olympic program? Dancing, perhaps?

Short track skating? Posers like the snowboarders.

Speed skating's the real thing, preferrably the 1000 and 1500 meters. IMVHO, of course.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 14:26:56 CET 2002 from (66.200.102.18)

JTULL Fan

From: Richmond

I don't know. I was watching the skating last night too and must say that 1) I am amazed that you could coordinate such grace, athleticism, and artistry on skates with 2 people, and 2)unless someone falls on their behind I am totally unqualified to judge the event. It did seem, however, that the Canadiens performed amazingly, as did the Russians (and the American team that did not get a medal). I think the Canadiens did outperform the Russians a bit but I don't know how much expectations and politics play into it. Too bad for the Russians their gold is 'tarnished', as it wasn't their fault, and too bad for the Canadiens who likely earned a gold. I kept thinking of the skit the great, late, Chris Farley used to do as the past-his-prime overweight figure skater who kept crashing into the wall...


Posted on Tue Feb 12 12:38:01 CET 2002 from (203.199.167.182)

birds/babukishan

From: mumbai/india
Web page

"soulmate" a unique world music/folk fusion(universal/musicindia)...bauls of bengal/babukishan


Posted on Tue Feb 12 09:51:02 CET 2002 from saintpaul.pioneerpress.com (208.149.52.102)

Chester

From: Minnesota

Im a new band fan, yes I will have to admit a little embarassment here after all Im 43 years old, more than old enough to have enjoyed these guys in there prime, where the heck was I in the 70"s your asking, well I guess your never to old to find new music even though its old music. As with most people who discover something so great after the fact it was by accident, I work with a Dylan fan who knows my admiration for Clapton, one night he brings in the Last Waltz vhs and tells me theres a great Clapton piece on this tape that I might enjoy and he adds by the way you might like the band also, well being stupid I ask well whats this bands name and he looks at me like Im a moron and asks your kidding youve never heard of the band, well sheepishly trying cover up my ignorance manage to guess that arnt they the guys who sing that Cripple creek song, managing to look like not a total idiot I saved a little face. as Im watching the tape that night Im not that impressed with the band as I fast forwarding to the Clapton R.R. part of the tape as I do this Im hearing more and more of the band and cant help being impressed I am by these guys watch this over the next few days finding myself caring less and less about Clapton and being so impressed with this wonderfully talented group of musicians, well to make a long story short I watched the tape five more times before I gave it back to my friend and went out to a music store and bought rock of ages which I love,now Im on Big Pink and no doubt will work my way through all the Bands work, what a treat these guys are, as Ive learned on this sight two are deceased and the remaining voice of the band Levon Helm cant sing anymore do to throat cancer and as Ive also learned of the bad feelings Levon has toward Robbie, so hearing these guys ever again will not happen except on my stereo. There are many great bands out there but Ive never heard a better one than the Band, even though its been 26 years since the original line up played Im happy I discovered them, admitingly late in life, but you know what they say better late than never. By the way what a great sight to learn a lot about the boys


Posted on Tue Feb 12 08:06:46 CET 2002 from pd95367e9.dip.t-dialin.net (217.83.103.233)

ulbiman

From: germany

Guten Tag !! If you like the Band you have to like Ryan Adams. This guy lives his life for music. He is NO hype. Listen to all his material!! OK, the much too slow songs are.......too slow!


Posted on Tue Feb 12 07:59:55 CET 2002 from 48.denver-01-02rs.co.dial-access.att.net (12.86.0.48)

Jim Strunk

From: Colorado

Just finished Levon's book, "This Wheel's On Fire" and flat out enjoyed every word. What a great story of some of the true legacies in the music world. I wished I would have found this years ago. When are you guys coming to Denver?


Posted on Tue Feb 12 07:42:25 CET 2002 from px1wh.vc.shawcable.net (24.69.255.202)

Cupid

Like John Donabie I'm sitting here trying to figure out what the hell the judges were looking at during Jamie and David's skate..obviously at the wad of dough they'd been handed. The simple solution to this is to remove European judges from the Olympic skating venue.They obviously have no intrest in the integrity of the sport they are supposedly judging. Either that or skating as a whole has to be removed from the games until it can get it's act together..the same punishment dealt to rogue nations. Something has to be done or Canada will have no alternative but to send the ultimate pairs skaters to the games..that's right Dave Semenko and Tiger Williams in a dress.. I can already picture Tiger going over the boards in his little off the shoulder number to get at the Judge from Belarus..Cupid

I would have loved to see David come over and jersey that Russian nancy boy for bumping into his girl. A triple Lutz and a right cross


Posted on Tue Feb 12 05:48:25 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John Donabie

From: C A N A D A

I meant to say that the judges DON'T seem to want to give it to anyone other than those in the Russian Federation.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 05:43:45 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John Donabie

From: C A N A D A

I would just like to thank the NBC commentators for feeling the same way "we" do tonight after the Olympic Skating Pairs. The Canadians were robbed. They had a flawless performance and as Scott Hamilton said.........again we have judges who have made a very controversial decision. This isn't whining over spilt milk.......this seems to be a problem with the European judges wanting to give it to anyone other than from a Russian Federation. They haven't lost since 1960; but tonight they made 4 errors to our 0 errors. I can't believe I'm so emotional over skating; but I believe we were robbed. It was just so great to hear the American commentators praise Jaime and David.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 01:30:59 CET 2002 from cc5414-a.hnglo1.ov.nl.home.com (212.120.101.7)

Norbert

From: an empty schengen barn, empty hands in empty pockets, looking up with sour knees.

Brown Eyed Girl, Ilkka, Amanda and Ragtime, thanx! (proost!)


Posted on Tue Feb 12 01:00:50 CET 2002 from akcf1.xtra.co.nz (203.96.111.202)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

I wish I'd seen Robbie at the opening ceremony. We only had a one hour highlights on free to air TV. I started to watch it but felt the probability of Robbie's performance being included was pretty low so I switched of just after Bush made an appearance.

On the subject of high profile performances , does any one know why The Band were at Roger Water's Wall concert? I never saw much of a connection between them and Pink Floyd.


Posted on Tue Feb 12 00:59:26 CET 2002 from m198214176125.austin.cc.tx.us (198.214.176.125)

Pehr

belated happy b day to Butch!

Miss you Dave Van Ronk. God Bless.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 23:40:36 CET 2002 from sungold2.ie.ibm.com (195.212.29.194)

Morpheus Ragekill

Brien Ss-A few comments on your post today regarding Ryan Adams. Comparisons to Don Mclean un-founded and il-advised.Don Maclean,creator of that endless monstrosity "American Pie",the bane of every week-end party all over and I've been to my fair share of parties so that's all of un-stomachable pie. Also-I agree that alot of CD's are too drawn out but the exception is Ryan Adam's "Gold".20 or 21 absolute little gem's where I feel in contrast to yourself that the slow songs are show-stoppers."Wild Flowers" and "Where the stars go blue" are standout's of beautiful poignance and elegance.Un-imaginable heights for most of today's Rock n' Roll troopers. Nice to see another fan


Posted on Mon Feb 11 23:32:01 CET 2002 from spider-wa051.proxy.aol.com (205.188.192.41)

Bayou Sam

From: New York - where the Twin Towers used to be

9-11-01

2-11-02

five months - can you believe it?

never forget.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 23:29:52 CET 2002 from spider-wa051.proxy.aol.com (205.188.192.41)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Klaus Voormann is a special guest at the Beatlefest in New Jersey next month. Many people have heard of him, but they've never actually seen him.

So, ya think Lennon, Harrison, Danko, and Manuel have a band going in the hereafter? I dunno. Lennon got there earlier (unfortunately for us) and he probably hooked up with Hendrix, Brian Jones, and Buddy Holly. I figure that when Rick arrived it was just the thing that Richard needed because he didn't feel inspired to touich a piano until then. George arrived and after visiting John and talking out the issue of John not being cited as one of George's influences in George's "I, Me, Mine" book, they hugged, and George got out his acoustic and went and jammed with Rick, and Richard. But once a week (if they have weeks there) John and George get together with Stu Sutcliffe and hang out, and talk about Paul behind his back (or above his head).

I'm just being silly - but hey, some of my favorite people are silly.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 21:37:01 CET 2002 from (212.153.193.19)

Ragtime

Nou, eh, Norbert... nog vele jaren...!


Posted on Mon Feb 11 21:26:38 CET 2002 from spider-te034.proxy.aol.com (152.163.195.189)

butch

From: new houseville

THANKS to ALL the kind folks who sent me Birthday Greetings,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

i was moving & have been off-line for a few days,, & now,, IM BAAAAACK,,,,

SO THANKS !!!!!

it is greatly appreciated,,,,,

G-man,, im gonna burn yo ass with dem candles,,,,

taks care & see ya at the BarnBurners shows,,,,,,,

butch


Posted on Mon Feb 11 20:07:53 CET 2002 from du6-249.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.249.6)

Ilkka

From KLAUS VOORMAN's web site:
"I met up with great musicians and very special people like The Band ...(etc.)"


Posted on Mon Feb 11 18:36:06 CET 2002 from (209.166.233.21)

Jon Lyness

From: New York City

I really enjoyed Robbie with the Native Americans on the Olympics Friday night. (Of course, being in the US I only saw the "edited" telecast--no Making a Noise--darnit!) I'm assuming that the orchestral music that introduced the Native Americans was the new RR composition, since the original press hype was that RR was "commissioned" by the Olympic committee to write new material, and Unity Dance and Making a Noise were taken from the Red Boy album--anyone? I thought the whole ceremony of the Native Americans was quite touching--and that there was something darkly ironic and bittersweet about the refrain "this is Indian country", given the context--can't help but wonder what was going through the minds of the five chiefs as they gave their blessing to this event. Robbie (in the two seconds he was shown) looked good! As Peter said, this was the highest-profile gig ever for a Band member and I thought it came off beautifully. In the US, the newscasters gave a sound-bite history of the Band (legendary group, backed Dylan then went on their own, hits like Up on Cripple Creek, The Last Waltz film) and I thought it was great that so many people were hearing it--hopefully the LW rerelease will continue this good press and exposure.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 18:00:43 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Happy Birthday Norbert!

If growing up means it would be

Beneath my dignity to climb a tree

I won't grow up, won't grow up, won't grow up

Not me.

~Rickie Lee Jones


Posted on Mon Feb 11 15:20:32 CET 2002 from ppp-2-21.5800-11.telinco.net (212.1.153.21)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Re Brien Sz's comments on Ryan Adams.

My daughter's been playing all his stuff to death. At various times I keep hearing snatches of Mr Dylan, Van, Brucie and of course the boys themselves. Have not really given them a good listen but that New York track and the one immediately after it are certainly catchy. Come to think of it, I think our Caz did say there was one that sounded like the Weight.

In the meantime, I've multi-recorded We Can Talk for the car since I've been on here. Twenty consecutive plays each time - and still thirsting for more. The gut-wrenched harmonies from Rick and Richard seem to pierce me even more now than 30 years ago. Is it the ultimate play again Band song? Or is it just moi? Anyone?

PS That Widnes question of mine certainly went down a storm huh?


Posted on Mon Feb 11 15:05:06 CET 2002 from ppp-2-21.5800-11.telinco.net (212.1.153.21)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Respect to Dave Van Ronk. Clearly an unsung hero. RIP


Posted on Mon Feb 11 14:53:58 CET 2002 from ppp-2-21.5800-11.telinco.net (212.1.153.21)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Couple of items you might like to know about:

The tribute concert for George Harrison at the Liverpool Empire - all monies to Cancer Research - was sold out immediately tickets went on sale. Will be an extremely emotional night.

I'm looking forward to it but with great trepidation as I just know I'll blub. We Scouse are an emotional breed as I'm sure you might have gathered - about as English as Levon. Dark shades called for methinks as the event nears its climax.

Band connection is, of course, that George was the Band's main champion in UK back in '68 and '69. He absolutely regaled them. I recall the blurb for the second album in the musical press releases in which George called them the best group in the world or certainly something akin to that. A man of rare integrity and a Beatle to boot.

Second point is the sad death of Bob Wooller who compered every one of The Beatles 2 hundred and odd appearances at The Cavern. No Band connection as far as I'm aware 'cept the poor fellow will now certainly have another supergroup to compere - George on lead, John on rhythm, Rick on bass and Richard on piano/drums - with harmonies really and truly made in heaven. A true band of angels.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 14:45:56 CET 2002 from spider-tn064.proxy.aol.com (152.163.207.74)

Brien Sz

From: Nj

Sorry and not sorry i missed RR's performance. I hate getting shortchanged on TV coverage.

I bought Ryan Adams "Gold" cd last week. I know he's been brought up in the past. For those who don't know, it has lots of elements of the Band, Don McClean, Roy Orbison, Wilco, The JayHawks, Counting Crows. It's right in the arena of the 'sound' I like to listen to. But why do artists insist on putting more songs on a cd than neeeded! This double cd has 20 or 21 songs on it (cd 2 is creatively called Side 4). It could easily have been edited to 10-12 songs, EASY! OF course my preference is to have more foot stompin', hand clappin music on it, than the slow songs or even worse at times, the slower than slow songs - you know the one, where he's in pain, his voice cracks a lot and there are no drums. This cd is the perfect example of what could have been, "less is more" Some great uptempo songs, a couple mid-tempo's, and his angst songs could have easily made a 12 song classic cd. IMO of course.

Also of note, The song Answering Bell (mid-tempo) is really just an excellant reworking of The Weight riff. WOW, my wife and i were stunned at how similar the song is and yet very unique on its own merit. This is one of those cd's that i'll burn down to how i think it should have been released.

Then the question came to mind - What was the last quality double cd put out in the era cd's? I couldn't think of any artists that have put out a real "WoW" double cd, that wasn't a Live or Greatest Hits disc.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 13:28:54 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

I would like to acknowledge the passing of journeyman folk-singer, Dave Van Ronk. He gave us the ultimate "Cocaine" on Prestige Records......and they say...... Dylan "borrowed" Van Ronk's version of House of The Rising Sun while staying with Dave and his wife in early Greenwich Village times. What I wouldn't have given to be living in Greenwich Village in the early 60's. As Ry Cooder would say, "if walls could talk."


Posted on Mon Feb 11 13:19:49 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

I couldn't aggree more with Jerry. On this tour I can only compare the performances to Tour 65-66 and Tour 74. This is the first Band since "The Band" that is on par for their time in history.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 12:40:22 CET 2002 from cpe0000e8c550f8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.157.156.144)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto

Don: You've captured the essence of Bob Dylan since the late 1990s. As a performing artist, he is vocalist for the BOB DYLAN BAND. In the past, before say 1995 or so, it was Bob Dylan with his band there to provided support. The players now are so strong and the music (especially from the new albums-last 2) depend so much on the players that the strength of the delivery by the players is vital. The only other time I ever saw this was in 1965 and in 1974 when Levon and the Hawks/Band played with him. These current shows are an absolute treat.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 12:30:19 CET 2002 from (63.236.79.235)

john

From: England
Web page

Reading about the Fender six string bass took me write back to my early teens. i remember seeing it very first with Jet Harris & Tony Mehen i think it spelt playing Diamonds on it, a massive uk hit. also seen it heard it in use with The Hollies I belive Eric Haydock used to play one I have pop anuals from the 60's with The hollies using it. Great sound


Posted on Mon Feb 11 11:58:12 CET 2002 from 200191070014-dial-user-uol.acessonet.com.br (200.191.70.14)

Nilson Marques Pompeu

From: Sao Paulo city, state of Sao Paulo, Brazil

I Just like to say Thank you very much for this great site ! THE BAND is absolutely wonderful ! Nilson


Posted on Mon Feb 11 11:02:32 CET 2002 from du178-1.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.1.178)

Ilkka

From: European Community
Web page

Today I'll stay inside Schengen:
DEUTSCHLAND - I saw yesterday a documentary of KLAUS VOORMAN, now living in Munich. This talented man has nothing to do here...???? Not so many search hits in gb archives.
ÖSTERREICH - MattK, it depends on how near Salzburg or Vienna you live. It is a matter of perspective. Seen from my horizon you live in Woodstock.
NEDERLANDS - Happy Birthday Norbert!

Footnote: "Schengen" is a pass free zone in Europe. To cross the border you _have_ to show your pass to give a proof of that you _don't have_ to show your pass.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 07:32:29 CET 2002 from pad-cache2-1.cache.telstra.net (165.228.129.12)

Bill

It's been out for a couple of years, but I just saw the pink 25th anniversary edition of Greil Marcus's "Mystery Train". I did what I always do when the book's reissued - head for the Hawks/Band discography at the back. I didn't spot any clangers as bad as the 2nd edition's misattribution of Ronnie Hawkins' "Goin' To The River" to our guys (which sent at least one of us regulars on a years-long wild goose chase), but Marcus does have King Curtis .burning through Hawkins' "Who Do You Love". Surely he doesn't hear a sax on that record, regardless what the liner notes on the Hawkins Sequel CD say. (I can say with some authority, having been peripherally involved, that the CD credits were not in all cases taken from studio logs. And in some cases the guesswork used to fill the gaps is plain nuts.)


Posted on Mon Feb 11 07:16:53 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp1615.dialsprint.net (63.187.14.91)

rollie

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Folk singer Dave Van Ronk, a respected figure on the early 1960s New York music scene and an early mentor of Bob Dylan, died Sunday after a battle with colon cancer, his record company said. He was 65. Nicknamed "the mayor of Greenwich Village" on account of his authoritative knowledge of jazz and blues, Van Ronk died at 9:30 a.m. at New York University Medical Center, said Mitchell Greenhill, president of Folklore Prods., who was at his bedside. Although Van Ronk never achieved commercial success, he remained an influential performer in the folk community. He toured and recorded -- and taught guitar -- until the end of last year when he underwent colon cancer surgery in November. His most recent album was the jazz-influenced "Sweet and Lowdown," which was released last year via Santa Monica-based Folklore. He received a traditional folk Grammy nomination in 1996 for "From ... Another Time & Place." Van Ronk's last concert, performed in Adelphi, Md. on Oct. 22 had been recorded and Van Ronk spent his last weeks going through the tapes to prepare a live album, Greenhill said. Van Ronk, a Brooklyn, N.Y. native befriended Dylan after the young Minnesotan arrived in New York, and frequently allowed him to stay in his Greenwich Village apartment. Even after Dylan became a star, they maintained a "sporadic but warm" relationship, Greenhill said. In 1974, Van Ronk appeared with Dylan and others at a benefit for Chilean political prisoners. Van Ronk recorded some 20 albums from the late 1950s, winning praise for his gritty interpretations of artists as diverse as Louis Armstrong, the Rev. Gary Davis, Leonard Cohen and Randy Newman. Greenhill said Van Ronk was also an excellent songwriter, and showcased his talents on the album "Going Back to Brooklyn." Perhaps most notably, Van Ronk expanded the melody of the old blues song "He Was A Friend Of Mine," which was later adapted by the Byrds as a tribute to John F. Kennedy. Van Ronk also added the chords to "Baby, Let Me Follow You Down," and co-owned the copyright, said Greenhill. Dylan recorded both those songs, along with other tunes covered by Van Ronk such as Bukka White's "Fixin' To Die," Blind Lemon Jefferson's "See That My Grave Is Kept Clean" and "Cocaine Blues." On the liner notes of his self-titled debut album, Dylan credited Van Ronk with turning him on to "House of the Rising Sun." According to music writer David Hajdu's recently published book "Positively 4th Street," Van Ronk was so respected by the city's folk musicians that New York Times reporter Robert Shelton -- who gave Dylan his first major press exposure in 1961 -- asked him to vet important pieces before he submitted them to his editors. Van Ronk is survived by his wife, Andrea Buocolo. A memorial service is pending, Greenhill said.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 06:45:04 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

Ed Blayzor

From: New York

RIP Dave Van Ronk "the mayor of Greenwich Village".


Posted on Mon Feb 11 06:15:37 CET 2002 from spider-tp021.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.181)

Ben Pike

Diamond Lil with a working knowledge of "The Long Goodbye". Perhaps there is hope for the world. And we can dream of Heaven: Richard Manuel singing "One For My Baby."


Posted on Mon Feb 11 05:45:36 CET 2002 from spider-wl021.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.26)

Calvin

Does anyone know where Id be able to get an actual released CD for Levon's first Solo effort from 1978, call me old-fashioned but I still prefer a store bought copy to a MP3 or burned one, None of my regular stores seem to be able to find a copy anywhere, hoping some of the more knowledgeable folks here might by able to point me in the right direction. Thanks in Advance.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 04:25:08 CET 2002 from dorms-034-232.bates.edu (134.181.34.232)

John

From: Maine

When was the price for The Last Waltz CD's announced? Has it gone on sale? $60 does sound steep for the concert, but I paid $30 for a burned copy and if the official release has better sound quality, the whole show, and decent packaging, it could be the best deal around. April 16 and May 7 couldnt come any sooner. It's so great to see revived public interest in The Band and the extremely positive attention they have been receiving as a result of the rereleases of TLW film and soundtrack.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 02:16:39 CET 2002 from dialup-335.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.79)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

Saw the Jim Weider instruction video tonight........pretty hot gi-tar pickin'!


Posted on Mon Feb 11 02:00:42 CET 2002 from cpe0080c6f0a856.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com (24.101.110.233)

John D

From: Toronto

HI

Bunky & Jake can be found at Amazon.com Uncle Henry's Basement is on of the CD's


Posted on Mon Feb 11 01:12:02 CET 2002 from 210-55-236-20.static-dialup.xtra.co.nz (210.55.236.20)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

$60 (US) seems a bit over the top for the re-released TLW CD - I hate to think what it will be in NZ dollars! I guess like the rest of you I'll just have to bite the bullet and buy yet another copy (thats 2 vinyls, 1 CD and 2 videos so far). Doesn't the law of diminishing returns state that each extra dollar spent gives less value for money than those before it? I guess if the track list includes Caldonia (on of my favourite songs) then all will be OK.


Posted on Mon Feb 11 00:56:04 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp72073.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.199.136)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

Nortorious for exhibiting humour in three languages
Obviously beats to his own drum
Ready to drive a Ducati 916, MV Augusta, and in honour of Robbie an Indian Chief 1948 motorcycle
Band, Sjako! and Van fan!
Expressive
Really loves France
Today is Norbert's BIRTHDAY on Monday Holland time!

Norbert: How many Aquarians does it take to change a light bulb?......Have you asked the bulb if it wants to be changed?


Posted on Mon Feb 11 00:02:21 CET 2002 from 24-196-225-108.charter-georgia.com (24.196.225.108)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga

One day after the Dylan conert, still cannot get all the songs out of my mind, even listened this morning to a blues show and then the North Mississippi All stars, but nothing helps. 150 minutes of shear pleasure, genius, masterful music, etc, etc, etc. What I found the most unique, this is not a Bob Dylan conert, this is a concert of The Bob Dylan Band, or Bob Dylan and his band, or The Bob Dylan Band, featuring Bob Dylan. Now that my not make sense, but to see Bob being energenized by, Tony, Charlie, Tony and Larry and the drummer, sorry, forgot his name, is just a shear work of art. If surrounding yourself with talent wears off, then wrap me up!!!!1


Posted on Sun Feb 10 22:13:24 CET 2002 from spider-wm082.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.187)

Charlie young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Rollie: thanks for your Jesse Winchester question. He does have a new live album that I was not aware of until you asked. I will be getting it soon. I saw him play a solo acoustic show here in Virginia two years ago and he was better than ever. I wish he would try a tour with Levon and his band...


Posted on Sun Feb 10 19:41:07 CET 2002 from dial2a-223.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.223)

Hi

From: out there

Does anyone out there have the Bunky and Jake record from '68 which had a cover of Open the Door Homer and a tune called Uncle Henry's Basement?...Jake a little later formed Jake and the Family Jewels...same guy...


Posted on Sun Feb 10 19:31:36 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-48.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.48)

MattK

Question. Is where one is "raised" pertinent only to the primary geographical location of one's house? Or is it possible to differentiate, in terms of creative influence, the location of your mother's house from other areas that define your artistic development over the course of your life? Isn't the distinction even harder to define when a person is multi-ethnic?

Mozart spent most of his youth (when he wasn't touring the capitals of Europe as a prodigy) in Salzburg. Yet he is very much considered a "Viennese Composer."


Posted on Sun Feb 10 19:21:08 CET 2002 from dial2a-207.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.207)

HI

From: Couldn't get high

oops I'm HI not Amanda.


Posted on Sun Feb 10 19:10:04 CET 2002 from dial2a-101.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.101)

Amanda

Amanda..Tony Brown is Peter Stone Brown's brother so I hope if he is tuning in he will answer your Montgomeries/Borderline questions..otherwise it should not be hard to get the Woodstock Mountain Revue stuff..I believe it was on Rounder...Tony was only on Mud Acres as I recall...


Posted on Sun Feb 10 18:49:40 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Luke W.: Borderline's "Sweet Dreams and Quiet Desires" would be a welcome addition to your collection. I am enjoying it so much. "Sweet Dreams" is my favorite song...so far. I am really partial to David Gershen's vocals.

I do have a few questions...someone PLEASE help me as I am on a roll with this. I know that Borderline evolved from The Montgomeries.Re: The Montgomeries...I read where Tony Brown, the bass player, appeared on "Blood On The Tracks". What other records has he played on and what is he doing now? What did Joe Ciera and Mike Estes do after The Montgomeries? Also...does anyone know where to get a copy of anything by The Woodstock Mountain Revue...recommended is "Mud Acres". HELP!! Thank you...


Posted on Sun Feb 10 17:08:46 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ta082.proxy.aol.com (64.12.105.57)

Jay Ryan

From: Troy

I just went to see or order the ReRelease of The Last Waltz DVD. Its promoted as Robbie Robertson, Muddy Waters & Martin Scorsese. No Mention of The Band or any of its members. Whats with that? Can someone in the know let me know if the other surviving members are getting any of the royalty? If not please let me know so I don't order it. Jay Ryan


Posted on Sun Feb 10 10:38:45 CET 2002 from spider-ti061.proxy.aol.com (152.163.194.201)

Rick S.

From: Suffern, NY

Happy Birthday Butch! G-Man should talk about candles- LOL. Thanks for being so fan-friendly.


Posted on Sun Feb 10 08:30:37 CET 2002 from pad-cache2-1.cache.telstra.net (165.228.129.12)

Bill

From: Toronto

Re hometowns, has Robbie Robertson actually claimed to have been raised in Brantford, or have unaware reporters just misread various news releases and bits of gossip to come to that conclusion? Frankly, neither would surprise me, as I've been told that that Robbie used to claim Cabbagetown as his neighbourhood without justification, seemingly because it sounded (and, honestly, was) hipper than Riverdale or Scarborough. (Here I'll admit to being an ex-Scarburger myself, and nobody has EVER accused me of being hip - not even once.)

To clarify something else that was mentioned here recently, I said - a couple of weeks ago - that I see Robertson and Eugene Smith as Toronto's greatest gifts to the pop / rock / R&B world. I wouldn't care to be forced to choose just one over the other.

I missed the ceremony that many of you have posted about - I think I was on back-to-back 10 hour flights - but I just have to say that I attended a big pow-pow at the Ex a few years ago. As we walked away toward in the darkness at the end of it all, my wife nudged me and gestured towards the guy we were walking beside - Ben Kingsley. Good enough for Gandhi, good enough for me.


Posted on Sun Feb 10 08:06:00 CET 2002 from spider-te074.proxy.aol.com (152.163.195.209)

Dave Z

From: Chaska, MN

I'm bummed I missed the opening ceremonies... Glad to hear all the excitement generated by it though... More power to you all... and I hope the possibility of a new RR CD is real... and not just a typo related to Rita being on Contact... $60 seems kinda steep seeing as I'm also gonna pick up the DVD too... but I guess I'll be a sucker... probably in good company too... lastly, God bless those who maybe aren't quite able to enjoy a RR moment... Take care...


Posted on Sun Feb 10 07:24:51 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp0534.dialsprint.net (63.187.10.26)

Jesse Winchester

I could have sworn I was listening to a new Sonny Landreth tune on the radio the other day, when the dj said it was a tune from Jesse Winchester. Does he have a new release?


Posted on Sun Feb 10 00:56:33 CET 2002 from (66.31.154.236)

Tio Esteban

From: Boston

The Band voted # 12 on NPR's Talk of the Nation listener poll of Top 25 bands of all time. At last, some respect. http://www.npr.org/programs/totn/features/2002/feb/020207.rockbands.html


Posted on Sun Feb 10 00:21:13 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tb023.proxy.aol.com (64.12.104.28)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

To our new friend from Poland, I would just like to say enjoy the Band and 'Sto Lat'! My mothers parents were Polish immigrants to America. I am sure you can obtain the Robbie items from Amazon.com or other.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 23:37:02 CET 2002 from dial2a-21.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.21)

HI

Alan's most recent post suggests in my mind the down side of too much obsessive behavior on my part with one particular musical group again and its effect on my own interpersonal relationships....a warning sign for me recently was my wife's reaction to me watching the recently purchased "Eat the Document" which I last saw 30 years ago at the Whitney in New York....her sighing "this is getting to be too much"....uh oh she just got home I got to Run....


Posted on Sat Feb 9 23:01:40 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

THE DARK SIDE OF THE CROON

By 1970, my wife had had more than enough of The Band.

It wasn't so much the relentless nightly bombardment I had inflicted upon her with my vinyl over-indulgences, though, I suspect they did have their part to play. Rather, it was the potentially debilitating effect she felt my bedtime Band lullabies were having on our eldest child, Chris.

I think what finally swung her into action was the pet raven Chris had requested for his 3rd birthday. I think it shook her a bit. Me, too, I have to say. In hindsight, I think if he'd have stuck with his original request for the complete works of Edgar Allen Poe, then she might well have turned a blind eye to his increasingly macabre bents. The raven, however, probably represented the final straw.

Almost instinctively - and let's not forget, here, you are talking of a doting mother, after all - she began to look for reasons why her son was turning into this sort of budding Doctor Phibes character.

Needless to say, from that moment on myself and the boys in The Band were on a loser. Bit by bit, the suspicion started to fall at my door. Or, more precisely, that of my bedtime repertoire.

Now, on considered reflection, I do have to admit that not all of my choices were what you might classify as authentic lullaby material. Certainly, by no stretch of the imagination would you term them happy-go-lucky little ditties. For instance, the choice of 'Tears of Rage' to open my set, whilst perfectly congruous with The Band's own chronology was perhaps a teeny weeny too soul-searching for even the most pensive of two year olds. Nor, I dare say, did the follow up of 'Lonesome Suzie' do an awful lot to lighten the atmosphere.

But hey, come on. There's more than one way to look at these sort of things. It's a tough old world out there and you can't stay wrapped in cotton wool forever. At some stage in your life you really do have to face up to life's harsher realities. After all, this is no pleasure cruise we're all on here; no free ride as Brucie might say. Anyroad - if you ask me - two is as good an age as any to grasp that nettle. Besides, nobody could ever say that my third offering ever failed to bring some lighter relief to the proceedings.

I don't suppose I'll ever get to know why he seemed to take such a shine to 'Long Black Veil'. It could well have been that lovely nursery rhyme feel it had to it. You know the bit I mean. All that stuff about 'moans' and 'bones' and all that. I think kids tend to fall for simple rhyming like that. Especially when it involves skeletons and stuff. There again, maybe it was simply the sort of haunting grim reaper ambience the song invokes which took his fancy.

Whatever, the song just seemed to hit the right spot with him. He would have me singing it over and over till often it would be me that nodded off. And even then the little blighter would dig me in the ribs to start the whole thing off again. Why, I've still got the bruises to this very day!

At times it would be like some war of attrition to see who would give in first. Now don't get me wrong here. Nobody but nobody loves singing these blessed songs more than me. Christ, I doubt if even the boys themselves could convincingly put forward that claim. There is a limit, though. I mean, at one stage I was even taking handfuls of amphetamines just to stay awake. Often the only way I'd gain the upper hand would be to break off with 'Veil' and sneakily veer into 'Whispering Pines' hoping he wouldn't notice. In fact, I'm pretty sure if it hadn't have been for 'Pines' and all those soothing lyrics managing to lure him into slumber I'd still be laying on that bed singing 'Long Black Veil' as you read this!

Anyroad, it's all in the past now, I suppose. The crooning. The groans. The moans. The wails. The bones. The bloody lot. By the time my wife finally called a halt to it all she reckoned our Chris had endured over 750 renditions of 'Tears', 'Suzie' and 'Pines' and over 5,000 of 'Long Black Veil'. She's adamant that if she hadn't stepped in when she did I might well have inflicted some lasting psychological damage on the poor lad. And do you know what? I think she's probably right. Certainly his pet raven believes that to be the case.

Mind you, all this was nothing compared to our Caz. By the time she came along, the boys had just released Stagefright and guess what? Yes folks, I'm now on rendition number 150,000 of 'All La Glory'. Now THAT IS what you call a lullaby!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 22:57:22 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

STEVE KNOWLTON

Nice try Steve lad. Sadly not the right answer.

Sporty Spice - brought up in Widnes [born in Whiston ozzy in der 'pool]

Elvis Costello - born in London and raised in der 'Pool and the one eyed town 'cross the Mersey [Birk'n'ead]

Further clue on Widnes's claim to rock'n'roll fame - it's something I feel every day when I work there [it stinks a bit cos of the chemical plants and horse mangling knackers yards] and I often sing to meself "I wish I....

get that and you've got yer answer.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 22:45:54 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan Edge

From: LIVERPOOL

SIR HANK WEDEL esq.,

Widnes???? - my fuckin arse pal

Bootle born and bred lad. And well fuckin proud.

Seen your website. TREEMENDOSE!! Can I buy yer two albumens please der la?

I'll phone yer if dat's OK!! BTW What's it like being named after a 'Shadow'? Why did yer get rid of the 'B' - LOL!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 22:39:45 CET 2002 from 24-196-236-100.charter-georgia.com (24.196.236.100)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga /Park City Utah

FYI, go to www.nbc.com, you can find a link to email, just finished getting my frustrations out.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 22:38:57 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan Edge

From: LIVERPOOL

POLISH EWA What a marvellous tale. Just think - apart from surviving native Americans and Robbie's friends and family nobody in this whole wide world will have gotten a bigger thrill from his performance than your little Polish self. Wonderful stuff. I'm sure someone like Peter Viney will provide you with what you need. I'm new here but I'd say you are amongst a decent bunch.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 22:26:29 CET 2002 from 24-196-236-100.charter-georgia.com (24.196.236.100)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga

Two Great Americans are sharing a Birthday weekend, one, is the master of ceremonies for the Barn Burners, Lets give it up for Master Butch. The other is my daughter, Sandi, who is celebrating her 18th birthday. Only one will be going to see Bob Dylan tonight, guess who?


Posted on Sat Feb 9 21:51:18 CET 2002 from (217.99.1.154)

Ewa Kwiatkowska

From: Poland

Hello, Few years ago I got an audio casette with beautifil songs where were singing Native Americans. That moment I didn`t know, that it was Robbie Robertson. Because I was very interested in history and mitology of native Americans, I really enjoyed this music. But someday sombady rerecorded my casette. Because I didn`t know who was the author of the music, I couldn`t find it in a music shop (especially in Poland). Until today, when I saw the Opening Ceremony, and I heard this wonderful Robbie`s voice. I knew it was he! So I find him in Internet and I`M here! I`m so happy because I miss this music very much. Now I know what I should looking for, but I`m afraid I will not able to buy this record in Poland, can you tell me is there any possibility to buy it by Internet? Thank You for this music, Robbie, Ewa Kwiatkowska ul. Linneusza 8 m 29 03-489 Warszawa Poland Ps. Of course I mean "Music for the Native Americans"


Posted on Sat Feb 9 20:26:36 CET 2002 from spider-ta034.proxy.aol.com (152.163.205.59)

ellen Z thaler

From: WPYX 106
Web page

I enjoyed your tribute and interview. We have had Garth and Levon on the 'Waking Up Wth The Wolf Show,' on PYX106 many times. I interviewed Rick many times at DST and miss him alot.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 19:30:08 CET 2002 from spider-tm022.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.52)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

New $60.00 Last Waltz CD rerelease: The article states that '2 jams' will be included. I assume these are the 2 extended jams from the Complete Last waltz. By definition a jam is authored by all those participating, so it will be interesting to see if all 5 Band members get songwriting credit (and thus some much deserved revenue for them and their families/estates) or will RR take credit for the entire jam?!?!? ala The Genetic Method from the remastered Rock of Ages. If Genetic Method is included on the TLW reissue, will it have the correct Garth Hudson sole credit (proving the Roberston/Hudson credit on the ROA remaster as an innocent mistake) or will it also bear the Robertson/Hudson credit, revealing a more cynical historical revision. Any speculation? It would also be nice (and seemes likely) that This Wheel's on Fire and All Our Past Times will also be included, adding some much-deserved revenue and credit to the Danko family. 8 some-odd pages of Robertson comments seems a bit much to handle, though. "Martin and me' this and 'Martin and me' that and 'this whole universal kharma invaded my soul that night' type of verse.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 19:09:05 CET 2002 from dial2a-101.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.101)

Hi

Peter I'm jealous of your BBC feed of RR last night. It was god awful here with bad sound and an inane announcer covering the tune like it was a skating event or something..but we got off a few good jokes like Levon shooting out the TV Elvis style.. You know in the Band days in general he was like Rita Coolidge was last night, a back up singer.One who could have sung lead but the other 3 did it better.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 18:59:28 CET 2002 from spider-ntc-tc013.proxy.aol.com (198.81.17.23)

Virgel Cain

From: Phoenix, Arizona

I always wanted to somehow let the composer of the song "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down" know that there really is a Virgel Cain out here. My Dad had the same name and I am a Junior. My Dad was a WW2 survivor and after the war he worked most of his life for the railroad. Many coincidences? I would love to know where J.R. Robertson (Robbie) came up with the name Virgel Caine (our last name was previously spelled with an "e" at the end)for his song? Regards, Virgel Cain


Posted on Sat Feb 9 18:53:25 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Brown Eyed Girl: You'll have to send me a copy of that tape you made last night. I hardly caught a glimpse of Robbie. I did enjoy the music and the fact that the Indians got so much exposure. The commentators and commercials were a real hassle. I am of Cherokee/Melungeon descent and last night, it was so thrilling to see the different tribes of Utah and their unique appearances, language and customs. Robbie has done an excellent job of illuminating the "forgotten people" of North America. And...I rather liked the Golden Eagles on ice...especially since the skaters were mostly locals and not professionals.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 18:33:02 CET 2002 from dialup-67.25.134.211.dial1.buffalo1.level3.net (67.25.134.211)

ROAD WARRIORS

Hey Butch,,Happy Birthday, Bro!! Double D's said they'd help with "ALL" the candles!! Then they said, may need all the Road Warriors!!!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 18:21:43 CET 2002 from e-airlock030.esatclear.ie (194.145.134.30)

martin

hello, i think they should have knocked it on the head in '76. i don't think they missed Robertsons stumbling guitar playing, definitely not his singing, but without his writing skills it didn't work for me.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 18:17:23 CET 2002 from spider-tm081.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.81)

Donna

From: PA

Happy Birthday Butch!!! And Many Many More!!! Hope to see you, Levon, and The BarnBurner's crew, at the Conduit in Trenton. Now who booked The Gurus for the same night at Pattenburg?

Wishing everyone a Great Weekend!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 17:59:49 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp69401.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.189.4)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

I thought ROBBIE played live because he changed the lyrics to MAKING A NOISE after the first verse.....All you had to do was watch Sadie sing with Robbie..........And did ya catch Robbie's little hand moves just when he sang...."WE HAVE COME, BANG (original....BEAT) THE DRUM"?..........And yesssss....the Canadian announcer here introduced Robbie as Canadian born and a former member of THE BAND and mentioned some of the Soundtracks he's worked on......No matter how you look at it......IT WAS A CELEBRATION OF HERITAGE AND LEGACY OF MUSIC.....AND A HINT OF POSSIBLY MORE TO COME!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 18:00:01 CET 2002 from dialup-67.25.134.211.dial1.buffalo1.level3.net (67.25.134.211)

G-MAN

Shoudda watched Canadian TV!!! RR set was very good!! Seemed like he let out a little jam but a commercial took away all but the end!! Seemed liked the packed stadium was rockin along!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 17:33:41 CET 2002 from du-tele3-121.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.121)

Peter Viney

“This is Indian country …” Well, what can I say? The BBC didn’t talk over Robbie (and introduced him without mentioning The Band in fact) and both songs were magnificent. He had his mic switched on last night alright, playing what must have been his biggest gig since Watkins Glen. No sign of stage fright there at all. Great guitar at the end in spite of the temperature. I hope it fires him up to tour again, and I hope that they release Stomp Dance / Making A Noise as a single and get the huge global hit it deserves. Colourful, spectacular and as Paul said – one up for Ira Hayes. This must be the highest profile a Band member’s had since … well, ever. It’s one to rejoice in. If the naysayers are reading, you now realize that if his mic wasn’t on at TLW (which I don’t believe by the way) then it should have been! I enjoyed hearing Robbie’s music from the orchestra as the native Americans first arrived too. Absolutely wonderful.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 16:45:40 CET 2002 from dial2a-247.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.247)

Hi

Hank makes a good point about the traffic here would be a lot less if there was no post TLW Band. But the ALLmans and Dead thing is a somewhat a similar bag for me, especially the Dead. The last time I saw them was when they headlined at Roosvelt Stadium and the opener,the original 5 lineup of the Band was great. Pigpen was gone and psychedelic whatever was replaced with uninspired Weather Report sounding jamming.But that's just me, their popularity just grew and grew....


Posted on Sat Feb 9 16:12:14 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tb042.proxy.aol.com (64.12.104.37)

JTULL FAN

From: Richmond (Midlothian)

Well, I am actually in Midlothian, not Richmond, if we are all going to get technical about it. Midlothian is a segment of western Chesterfield County, which is to Richmond what Westchester is to NYC. Just got back from Southern CA. so you haven't heard from me ( I flew out Super Bowl Sunday and returned opening night of the Olympics just to test fate)Yes, NBC's coverage of Robbie was bad, but so is there wretched coverage of the entire olympics every 2 years. Y'all just noticed more acutely! Saw some of your posts during the week and I especially liked Nick's (I hope I have the right name) from VA's earlier in the week, as well as Hank's most recent one about the 80's 90's Band. I so agree. I also read the USA article on teh Last Waltz at John Wayne Airport yesterday morning. $60.00 !!!! I'll stick with my Complete Last Waltz copy someone out here (you know who you are) generously sent to me. The DVD I'll get. Yes, it's a distorted and selective document, but probably so are most other documentaries and projects, we are just more aware of this one's history. And any chance to catch one more 'new' clip of Richard, Levon, Rick , and Garth is worht the price of admission...


Posted on Sat Feb 9 14:34:16 CET 2002 from dialup-083.cork.iol.ie (194.125.43.83)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

Welcome Alan Edge! Alright,La? Methinks yer a woolyback, la!....Is Widnes Liverpool proper'n'all, like?. I'll be asking me Scouser friends 'ere in Cork, la.....Speak your mind.....that's the beauty of this place!

I think Bayou Sam made the best observation about where RR grew up....on the road with The Hawk

CALVIN!!!...I dunno.....it's not necessarily those 3 CDs..... but it would seem to me that many of the folks I've met here are here because they saw The Band in the '80ies or '90ies, met Rick or Levon at a solo/duo gig and were genuinely knocked out by the fact that they witnessed these men and their magic........I have not visited The Byrds or CCR sites........

If The Band broke up in '70 or '76 and NEVER worked again.......what would we talk about? If The Band broke up in '70 or '76 and never visited Scandanavia, together or solo, would Jan be even bothered to set up and maintain a site?. Over to you, Jan.........

I mean, maybe there would be a site......but I reckon it would not be as active nor as engrossing as it is if it were limited to discuss the activitities of the original five '68-'76 or The Hawks......Check the GB archives on this site from when they were still a functioning unit prior to Ricks passing....it's full of show reviews, encounters and the like.......Pat Brennan, who is currently arguing for the superiority of the original five over later incarnations, flabbergasted me in one of his recent posts by listing the amount of Post TLW shows he has seen (the lucky fella!) and thus speaks with authority in arguing his case....MY point is that BECAUSE they carried on, MANY folks here have points of reference that would NOT be available nor realistic if they HAD quit for good in the '70ies.......

I THINK the above makes some sorta sense but I'm sure I'll be hearing from y'all about it..........

Actually.......Now that I think of it.......Take the three attractions of Watkins Glen '73.......

The Band, The Allmans and The Dead.........

Most folks did'nt mind that people left The Dead, died while still part of The Dead (Ahem!) and that The Dead kept recording and touring and even took a few years off and went back on the road again, dude. They probably would'nt mind too much if the surviving Dead (Sorry 'bout that!) got together and did a few shows without Jerry......

Most folks did'nt mind that people left The Allmans, died while still part of The Allmans and that The Allmans kept recording and touring and even took a few years off and went back on the road again, The Allmans STILL get together and do tours!!!!! They even fired Dickey Betts recently, for fucks sake, and had the audacity to carry on, call themselves The Allman Brothers and still play huge shows, make records and set up their own record company....fair dues to them.........

Why are there folks who think The Band should NOT have reformed if they wanted to, even tho' people left and people died? Why are there folks who think The Band should NOT have taken a few years off and got back together to perform...like they did in '85?

Were The Dead as good in the '90ies as they were the '70ies?...(ie. if you think The Dead were any good in the first place...which I do)

Were The Allmans as good in the '90ies as they were the '70ies?...

Put very simply....if it's OK for The Dead and The Allmans, why is it NOT OK for The Band?


Posted on Sat Feb 9 14:09:23 CET 2002 from 150.philadephia-13rh16rt-pa.dial-access.att.net (12.90.41.150)

CARMEN

From: pa

Seems like our friends in Canada had better coverage then the US. Still glad to see and here RR in such a prominent roll. Nice to see the BAND and TLW mentioned as well.

Can anyone out in GB land shed some more light on the new upcoming RR album mentioned by Rita Coolidge on the MSNBC website?


Posted on Sat Feb 9 08:06:14 CET 2002 from spider-tp031.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.186)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA

Happy Birthday Butch and one hundred more. Hope to see you and the crew in Trenton, NJ.



Posted on Sat Feb 9 07:23:23 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp1395.dialsprint.net (63.187.13.125)

Marley on PBS............

This coming tuesday on PBS--special on Bob Marley. Do they do PBS in Canada?


Posted on Sat Feb 9 07:07:40 CET 2002 from px1wh.vc.shawcable.net (24.69.255.202)

Cupid

...oh and belated happy birthday to Bob Marley..One Love!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 07:05:31 CET 2002 from px1wh.vc.shawcable.net (24.69.255.202)

Cupid

Well I dare say Robbie did a damn fine job tonight.I only wish they'd have let him sing live. The Canadian coverage was great although someone really needs to tell Brian Williams he's not funny. The fine American hosts gave our team the first big cheer of the night and Roots Canada designed not only the Canadian and US team outfits but several other teams as well. After the tremendous reception Canada's team hats recieved it Nagano I noticed this time around many teams had similar hats. OK ok enough tub thumping from north of the border. After these months of terrorists and tears it's nice to finally have something to get excited about....is Rita Coolidge a honey er what eh!...Beware Team Canada they brought a big can a whoopass with em...Peace Cupid..yer boy did good Angie


Posted on Sat Feb 9 06:41:38 CET 2002 from ppp190.ac1.56k.execulink.com (209.239.5.190)

Paul Godfrey

Behold, at long last the American Natives were given their proper due in the eyes of the whole world in a celebration in appreciation, reverence and respect for the First Nations of this North American land. On Canadian television we witnessed the whole celebration without commercials.

In some repects this was a real comming out for a young boy who really did not know who he was or where he belonged.

More than fifty years have come and gone since that boy found a way to enter another world by way of his music.

Behold, five Indian nations found a world stage after centuries of neglect. Yes the stage had celebrity in Rita and Robbie.

God Bless America for not only including but putting the Aboriginals at the top of the program. Honour, Reverence and Respect Reigned in America this Olympic Night. Retribution for Ira Hayes.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 06:33:26 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp1395.dialsprint.net (63.187.13.125)

rollie

Am I mistaken, or did I hear Robbie begin to segue into "Don't Do it" before being bum rushed by a commercial!?The Hawk probably would've killed for one of them bird costumes!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 06:20:50 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp69447.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.189.50)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

"Ladies and Gentlemen....ROBBIE ROBERTSON.....Robbie introduces the singers after STOMP DANCE (Unity).....Oh yes....."This is Indian country.....".......Olympics represent PEACE FRIENDSHIP AND UNITY as well....(just like MARLEY'S MUSIC!).....Sadie Buck.....pure show of STRENGTH and PRIDE during her singing....for Rollie.....close up of Rita Coolidge.....;-D......Robbie continues....Hello....Athletes of the World.....Mr. President....People of the World...right now we would like to pay RESPECT to the Five Nations of Utah....THANK YOU FOR YOUR BLESSINGS AND YOUR WARM WELCOME"....:-D

I am flying soooooo high here that I just replayed the two songs he performed twice already and each time I pumped up the volume and my body couldn't stop moving to his intoxicating rhythms........When his band performed STOMP DANCE (UNITY).....The foot work at the Pow Wow....was visually amazing and the colourful Native traditional clothing was something else!.....And then when they also did MAKING A NOISE....and Robbie surprised us.........yes!.......with some new GUITAR LICKS at the end of the song.......I could hear Daniel Lanois saying to himself......ROBBIE PLEASE PLAY MORE GUITAR!!........Well........it was long enough to remind everyone that ROBBIE IS BACK......IF HE WANTS TO BE!!!!!

Another treat for me tonight.....Someone who went to school with Robbie was the first person to email me after the performance....Of course it had to be YOU.....:-D...and Twilight......You are correct! I meant AMAZING GRACE.....I'm sure that you would agree that Beck is brilliant technically and his version of Mayfield's PEOPLE GET READY.....simply the best!.......but Robbie's version of AMAZING GRACE and his instrumental version of OUT OF THE BLUE......is simply......BEAU.......TI......FUL........ALL HEART.....Ok.....I'm going to rewind the video once again........and feel IRIE!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 06:11:13 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

Yeah..tuned into see Robbie....where was he? One person here was pleased at least... turned it off after his one song...did he do another one? He Looked good. He usually looks like he's held together with scotch tape and single pins ....maybe it was the coat and the cold weather that tightened him up. Would have been nice to see him singing in front of the mic.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 05:57:01 CET 2002 from spider-wl033.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.33)

Calvin

Did anyone else notice that the Band started out as Dylan's back-up band, at least do your homework Bob. I was also a bit chagrined in they half hearted coverage of the Native American segment of opening ceromonies-and even though I am a big RR guy, I found it somewhat suspect that the choosen "NAtive American" performers where the ones the could find with the most mainstream hits-NA music is a vital exciting field that has been growing over the last few years, which an employee of mine introduced me to en masse, and I do believe some of them would have been better choices for the supposed idea the show was trying to convey.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 05:55:32 CET 2002 from 64-80-53-82-access.surferz.net (64.80.53.82)

Lil Again

Butch: Only for you my friend, would I stay up till midnight to say this: Happy Birthday! :-)


Posted on Sat Feb 9 05:51:38 CET 2002 from 64-80-53-82-access.surferz.net (64.80.53.82)

Diamond Lil

_Johnny Mercer's_ theme song to "The Long Goodbye" was also the only song in the movie..except for Mercer's "Hooray for Hollywood". I think that's why there's never been a soundtrack :-)

And just to mention, Johnny Mercer wrote one of my all-time Sinatra favorites "One for my baby".. among more than 1000 or so other tunes. It's nice to see him mentioned here.

Have a good night everyone. Hug Jan.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 05:22:11 CET 2002 from pm457-04.dialip.mich.net (204.39.227.110)

twilight

From: ann arbor, mi

Since when do Rita Coolidge's covers of "Higher & Higher" and "the Way You Do The THings You Do" qualify as classics? What about the original versions by Jackie Wilson and Smokey Robinson? BEG - I was stunned when I read your post that Jeff Beck covered "Out of the Blue". Where you thinking of Amazing Grace? If so, I agree Robbie's was better. I was hoping Robbie would play "Showdown At Big Sky" tonight. Did anyone see the painful halftime show at the Super Bowl w/ Sir Paul? The guy is thrashing his own legacy. Singing "A Hard Day's Night" with Terry Bradshaw. Oh how I miss George and John.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 05:17:17 CET 2002 from 12-243-71-112.client.attbi.com (12.243.71.112)

Tracy

From: you know by now
Web page

Robbie? Where Robbie? :::::squinting to see the TV:::::: Oh, that was him? The one all bundled up in the dark coat with the guitar? Two decent shots of him, and that's it, the same for Walela? They showed those skaters in eagle outfits longer than the actual performers! Maybe Robbie and Co. should have skated while performing instead. What does it take to get some air-time? "Stomp Dance" and a partial version of "Making A Noise." Yes, Brown Eyed Girl, they did sing, "You can bet your life." Sweet ass wah-wah solo that Robbie was pulling and it got lost with Katie Couric and Bob Costas' voices. Shame! I love when he Costas asks Couric, "Are we talking over each other?" No, Bob, you're only talking over THE WHOLE DAMN PERFORMANCE!! Oh, but now we get treated to hear Sting sing "Fragile" and they keep the cameras on him most of the time.

Tracy


Posted on Sat Feb 9 05:06:44 CET 2002 from spider-wl033.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.33)

calvin

Ben, Im not sure if you meant it this way, but youre post struck me as a bit of a dismissal of the tremendous body of work Johnny Mercer left. There are easily a couple of dozen songs that most GB posters would recognize that the man wrote. Starting writing with Hoagy Carcmichael in the early 30s and ending working with Andre Previn in the mid 70s, I dont believe Mercer was ever part of the lightweight Jazz set, instead he was a favorite lyricist of the Garlands and Sinatras of the world-and frankly he wrote for me the greatest saloon song ever, One for My Baby, and One More for the Road.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 04:58:53 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tk042.proxy.aol.com (64.12.107.37)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

I love the music of The Band - Big Pink to Jubilation. I can listen to Jubilation without thinking, gee - if only Robbie and Richard were on this......I can also enjoy the music to the fullest without knowing the actual town where Robbie Robertson was born......I always figured that The Band grew up on the road with The Hawk.

Robbie looked good in Salt Lake. I only wish that the microphone that was picking up the sound for TV wasn't mounted out on the Bonneville Salt Flats.

Sorry - that smartass Bronx sarcasm is bubbling up. I'm very tired. I'm sooooooo tired, my mind is on the blink. Goodnight.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 04:44:10 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp69447.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.189.50)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

YEAH ROBBIE ROBERTSON!!!!!!!! WE LOOOOOOVE YOU from Toronto and all of Canada!!.....YOU STILL GOT IT GOIN' ON BABY! WOWWWWWWW! I was groovin' through both songs.....now....were you singing....."You can bet your LIFE....instead of ASS?......MAKING A NOISE IN THIS WORLD......MAKING A NOISE IN THIS WORLD......One of my fave Robbie tunes........too much!!!!!! Robbie you still rock my world and most Canadians! THANK YOU FOR SHARING YOUR GIFT OF MUSIC and finally showing the world that you are proud of who YOU are!


Posted on Sat Feb 9 04:43:00 CET 2002 from 24-196-236-100.charter-georgia.com (24.196.236.100)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga

Totally pissed off, Robbie, could not hear him, got the short end of the TV stick, and cut off by a commercial. NBC, you suck!!!!

Don

PS Who do we complain too


Posted on Sat Feb 9 03:39:34 CET 2002 from spider-tm032.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.57)

Ben Pike

From: Cleveland Tx

Ben Pike's triva for today:PV mention mega rich film composer John Williams. Some might be surprised that Williams came up through low budget films like many a big shot; putting the notes to drive-in rock and roll shlock like "Daddy-O."

But, this movie legend once teamed up for a film theme song with Johny Mercher. Mercher is not well know to rock fans; but Steve Allan type middlebrow jazz fans often claim Mercher as the greatest lyric scribe EVER.

Yet somehow this song has never appeared on any record...EVER. The song: the theme to Robert Altman's 1973 masterpeice "The Long Goodbye." LINK: cinamatography by Vilmos Zigmond, who helped with TLW.


Posted on Sat Feb 9 00:05:25 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

You don't believe what you read in the papers

You don't believe the stranger at your door

You don't believe what you hear from your neighbors

Your neighborhood ain't even there no more.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 23:57:08 CET 2002 from spider-wf043.proxy.aol.com (205.188.195.165)

franko

From: boston

O.K., O.K. I'm not really from Boston. But I am a lot closer to Boston than I am to Worcester. Or Providence. Or Hartford. Or....


Posted on Fri Feb 8 22:57:08 CET 2002 from du-tele3-010.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.10)

Peter Viney

Where we live: I happen to live in Poole, in Dorset, a town of about 150,000, next to the seaside resort of Bournemouth renowned for its retired people and prim atmosphere (though recent newspaper reports suggest it's become the rave/dance centre of the country- but I don't get around much anymore). A well-known author who lives just up the road from me always says on his bookjackets "XYZ lives in Dorset" which conjures up a rugged, rural charm noticeably missing from his actual early 20th century urban neighbourhood. "I live in a suburb of Bournemouth' doesn't have the same ring to it. I think it was ever thus. Any locality can have several "locaters" and whether RR wants to put Ontario, Toronto or Cabbagetown really doesn't bother me.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 22:31:40 CET 2002 from dialup-65.58.43.206.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.58.43.206)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

And people actually wonder why the feud doesn't die....


Posted on Fri Feb 8 22:28:25 CET 2002 from host-65-164-8-8.co.erie.ny.us (65.164.8.8)

G-MAN

John D.,,,I am surprised!! If anyone could grow up in several different places, all at the same time, it had to be Mr. Robertson!! I wonder if he was quoted re. Branford,,cause good friend grew up in Brantford and didn't recall Robbie! Way to go John D. BEG-Now U,of all people know Robbie grew up in Cabbage town! I remember him given U his address! Of course it was to a street that never existed!!! Ah,,heck what would ya expect from the great visionary one??? Crabbgrass-What's your take on all this multiple hometown stuff?????


Posted on Fri Feb 8 22:00:30 CET 2002 from du-tele3-029.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.29)

Peter Viney

Well I'm sorting out a nice S-VHS hi-fi tape to re-use (Sorry, Saturday Night Fever has to go) so that I can timer-record the Winter Olympics opening ceremony at 2 am British time. I can sit through a bit of John Williams (it's fun seeing how much you can lift from The Planets and Korngold without getting into copyright hassle after all). But Robbie will be there and I'm looking forward to watching it over breakfast. So, set the controls for the heart of Salt Lake City - Unity Dance here we come!


Posted on Fri Feb 8 21:56:10 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

Carmen quotes MSNBC as stating:

"She appears on an upcoming album by Robbie Robertson"

!!!!!!!!!


Posted on Fri Feb 8 21:44:08 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp70035.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.191.130)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

AMANDA: You are like a Soul Sister.....:-D

Jerry: Thank you for stating what many of us were feeling and thinking....Also, I did actually grow up in a small town practically next door to Brantford, Ontario by the Grand River....I would sit by the bridge in town and like Dylan sings...."If I had wings and I could fly, I know where I would go. But right now I'll just sit here so contentedly and watch the river flow".....

At that time in my life.....I vaguely even knew that The Six Nations Native Reserve where Robbie visited as a child even existed there....All I was aware of was that Brantford was the home of Wayne Gretzkey....(but the Kings of hockey for me were always Bobby Orr and Mario Lemieux....:-D)...BTW...I did send Jan the article featuring Robbie in Aboriginal Voices to post one day....

.....Although Eric Clapton plays faster with his hands.....what has always blown me away with Robbie's playing is that....It is here....where his emotions surface freely for he is in his element....That's why Daniel Lanois always refers to him as an emotional player.....When you listen to the instrumental version of OUT OF THE BLUE....for me even Jeff Beck's version lacks what Robbie is in touch with....Just like Bill Munson posted....Robbie is Toronto's greatest export to the world....and speaking of Bill....he'll prove to you that the address mentioned in Levon's book is actually in Riverdale...Now the photo from Moondog Matinee is definitely in Cabbagetown.....I just took a photo the other day...:-D


Posted on Fri Feb 8 21:44:25 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

It's interesting that one Buffy St. Marie who discovered her Indian heritage far before the 90's was not invited to the Olympics. Hey.....she's the real thing!


Posted on Fri Feb 8 21:18:24 CET 2002 from (205.245.52.66)

carmen

From: pa

From the MSNBC Olympics Web Site mentioned in Rick Smith last post:

Rita Coolidge and Walela Rita Coolidge is perhaps known for her string of hits as well as her two Grammy Awards. Rita has released more than a dozen albums including 1978’s multi-platinum “Anytime…Anywhere.” Several of her singles became classics including “Higher And Higher,” and “The Way You Do The Things You Do.” In the 90s, Coolidge began increasing involvement in projects that would benefit or call attention to Native American music, culture and issues. She appears on an upcoming album by Robbie Robertson, who she cites as being sensitive to the musical voice that exists for Native Americans. Walela brings to life the energy and spirit of the American Indian heritage by combining pop, gospel and Native America musical influences.

Robbie Robertson Robbie Robertson’s professional career began when he joined Ronnie Hawkins’ backing group “The Hawks,” in 1960. Through the years with the group, now dubbed “The Band,” Robertson earned the reputation as electric guru. In 1995, he collaborated with film director Martin Scorsese on the soundtrack for Casino. Robertson is a Native American and is passionate about the Red Road Ensemble, a Native American group. He recorded music for “The Native Americans,” along with The Red Road Ensemble, which featured songs from the Robertson-scored soundtrack to the landmark TBS television documentary that chronicles the history of the Native Americans.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 18:20:21 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

It would be cool if we could arrange for various groups of GB-ers to meet and attend various screenings en-masse. Outside of the Road Warriors and the lucky bunch that live within shouting distance of Woodstock, most of us never get a chance to meet, much less at a Band-related event.

I'm definitely going to travel down I-95 and make a showing down in Boston when it hits beantown. Any other New Englanders interested in doing the same, give me a shout.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 17:33:23 CET 2002 from host-65.subnet-76.med.umich.edu (141.214.76.65)

Steve Knowlton

From: Ypsilanti

Alan Edge: Since no one else picked you up on the trivia question, here goes:

Widnes is the hometown of not only Elvis Costello (who mentions it in the lyrics of "New Lace Sleeves", I believe), but also that supreme purveyor of musical ambrosia... Sporty Spice!


Posted on Fri Feb 8 16:34:02 CET 2002 from (209.166.233.21)

Jon Lyness

From: New York City

Wow, a lot of good news to digest! That's amazing about the Last Waltz rerelease being shown on the big screen in those "selected" cities. I can't wait to experience it in New York's own Ziegfeld Theater (gorgeous old art deco theater from the 20s), but more than anything I'm excited about the exposure for our guys with this high-profile rerelease. Looking forward to seeing Robbie's show on the Olympics tonight (but don't worry G-Man, I'm saving up my $$ for when the Gurus swing through NYC!)

As for the 70s vs 90s Band comparison...well, I have to agree with Alan, there really can't be any comparison with the original 5. But so what? I just consider the later Band my "second favorite group" compared with the original 5...I still love the 90s releases, and to me just about anything these guys played was special in some way. I will say, though, that being a younger fan, I envy those of you who saw the original Band in their heyday...for one thing, I'll probably always wish I'd gotten to hear Richard live.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 16:23:10 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

This just in from Salt Lake City -- A reliable source reports hearing the following sung by an unidentified performer at rehearsals for the opening ceremonies:

"I'd rather be burned in Canada
than to freeze here in Utah..."


Posted on Fri Feb 8 16:05:39 CET 2002 from pc95190.scs.unt.edu (129.120.129.214)

Rick Smith

From: Denton, TX

Found at the winter olympics opening ceremonies website, the bio on Rita Coolidge indicates that she'll be featured on an "upcoming album" by Robbie Robertson. Here's the link: http://www.saltlake2002.com/x/f/frame.htm?u=/news/slocmain_front.asp


Posted on Fri Feb 8 15:32:31 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.84)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

Since I only really became aware of the Band when my high school boyfriend dragged me to the see Last Waltz movie in 78, I never got a chance to see the originals live. I am kicking myself for being obsessed with Cat Stevens when I could have maybe seen the Band at some point in junior high. I was probably into Peter Frampton (whom I saw 3 times for some reason) at the time of the Last Waltz concert, though maybe I was not even old enough to get in? (14) (Peter Frampton now lives in Cincinnati if you can believe it--only a couple of miles from here. Too bad I am no longer scheming on him.) It was the Rick and Levon show I saw in 83 that reignited my interest, and I saw the 80s line up twice. I enjoyed it very much, but I'm sure to have seen the originals in their prime on a night when no one was noticeably wasted would have been something else altogether.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 15:12:38 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

Web page

Here is the link to the Band article today in USA Today


Posted on Fri Feb 8 15:01:45 CET 2002 from dv238s69.lawrence.ks.us (24.124.69.238)

Dexy

Crabby -- Actually, The Schmenge's special was called: "A Tribute to John Villiams." Highlight, of course, being "Jaws." BAND link: Eugene Levy's interview with Levon Helm around the same time.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 15:00:03 CET 2002 from spider-wb074.proxy.aol.com (205.188.192.184)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA

The restored and remastered Last Waltz on the BIG screen ! The line forms to the rear.

Thanks Carmen.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 14:51:47 CET 2002 from (62.30.0.2)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

WE CERTAINLY CAN TALK ABOUT IT NOW - NOT SURE ABOUT ROBBIE AND LEVON THOUGH

Wow! Again!

That big long piece I did. The one about the unique art form that The - 'original'? - Band created with those first two albums back in the late sixties and the impossible task facing the remaining members following the Last Waltz - well, it really does seem to have acted as some sort of unwitting catalyst to you lads and lasses.

Have to take my hats off to you all. [ I have three by the way - one for each head ] It's certainly been SOME debate you folks have put together. Some tremendously impassioned posting. I don't know - I don't get to talk about the fellas in thirty odd years and then I come on here and find the entire world and his wife can't stop talking about them!

Personally, from what I've read I think it does credit to all concerned.

There is a problem, though. Isn't there always? The thing is it's given me a bloody headache trying to come to terms with all the conflicting perspectives.

Really!

Whilst I certainly didn't intend the post to invoke such an outpouring of emotion - I mean as far as I was concerned I was attempting to celebrate our heroes magnificence not press the button for the start of world war three - I also have to be honest here and admit that the display of respective loyalties to one faction or another has somewhat startled me. More pertinently, it has been a real education. Most significantly of all, as far as my own loyalties are concerned, it's one which I'm not altogether sure I'm sufficiently well adjusted to take on board just at the moment. I think that much can be deduced simply from reading back over some of what I wrote in the original - jeez, that werd again.

When I commented that watching the 1980's version of our heroes performing didn't feel like the 'real thing', I had taken it as read - as a sort of pre-ordained tenet if you like - that such a view would be one held universally; that the same perception of the "relative incompleteness" of the subsequent line-ups would be inevitably ingrained within every fan of The Band.

Whilst I certainly meant no disrespect to Rick, Levon, Garth and Richard or any of those marvellous players that became part of those subsequent line-ups, I think I can now see why my observations could, indeed, have been construed as - shall we say - a mite insensitive to those players and to those fans who have invested so much of their lives and energies into those versions of The Band. That said, I never dreamt for one minute that anybody who followed the group would not see it the same way as me, let alone that there would be those who actually preferred the later configurations.

Not surprisingly these are proving to be extremely challenging notions for me even to begin to get my head around. Accordingly, I must ask you all to please excuse me while I go and lie down for another thirty odd years in this quaint old Liverpool ale house I know to get over the shock. [Thankfully it has a jukey so who knows what little gem of a band I might yet again chance upon?]

Seriously, folks, whoever it was that said there is nothing new under the sun had clearly reckoned without the ingenuity of The Band and its disciples. Consequently, in due deference to all and sundry, I shall duly reflect on all the pearls that have been posted and hope to come back suitably chastened and enlightened.

Right! I've reflected long enough.

What the hell are we on about here, folks?

Comparisons can be invidious things at the best of times. Sure they're what human nature virtually dictates we do. Quite apart from being good fun, the polemic is great exercise for any remaining brain cells we might still happen to possess. Why rock music itself was even invented - by George Washington himself no less - purely for Wyatt Earp and his mates to stand around Wild West saloon bars spouting their insight into the idiom. Who was the best? Clapton or Hendrix? The Beatles or The Stones? Springsteen or Dylan? Frank Zappa or Tiny Tim? Okay, so I know the last one's dead easy - Tiny Tim by virtue of his two lips [gerrit?] You know what I'm driving at though.

Pray what, however, are we actually trying to say in this instance with our own matchless heroes? That Garth is better than Garth? That Rick couldn't hold a candle to Rick? I mean, come on. I know in your Civil War you lot actually had brother fighting brother but surely even you fellas wouldn't want to see Levon throttling himself in an attempt to prove he was better than… himself!!!

"You piece of southern jumped up hairy faced swamp-ridden muskrat - I'm better than you!!!"

"No you're not, you're nothing but a smooth-chinned old arse skin-basher!!!"

I've learned a vital lesson this past day or so. Don't throw raw meat to Americans!! Joke. Honest. Seriously - again - it's that you can never afford to take anything for granted. Not even something you regard as a cast iron certainty. The fact is it can come back and bite your…fanny? Hmm, Miss Fanny? I wonder. Enough!!!

Mind you, after all has been said and done, I have got to say that if The Band aren't the greatest group the world has ever seen then I'll eat my fuckin hats!!! Now you have to admit. That's 'original'!


Posted on Fri Feb 8 14:45:15 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tb023.proxy.aol.com (64.12.104.28)

Calvin

Hank Do you honestly believe that we wouldnt be here if they hadnt released those 3 Cds in the 90s? Honestly? While I think we all welcomed them, I dont think it would have made one iota of difference in the existance of the GB, it cant be proven-but considering other "fan clubs" that exist and thrive for groups such as the Byrds, CCR and others than broke up before the Pre-TLW Band I cant see how you would feel that way.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 14:44:27 CET 2002 from (205.211.160.1)

Dr. J.

From: Toronto

Thanks John. Of course, accuracy is important. It is not trite. As we learned from the demons in the world, if you repeat the wrong thing enough times, it can become the 'truth'in the eyes of the reader. Your comments remind me of something that happens to me all the time. I was born in a European country after the war, and spent a total of 3 months maximum there. By the time I was 4 months old, I was in Toronto and have been a Canadian citizen ever since. But, people want to give me an ethnic background. I have about as much to do with that European country as I do with all the other countries I have visited in my time on this planet. I even visited Branford on a couple of occasions.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 14:13:29 CET 2002 from (205.245.52.66)

carmen

From: pa

The following was in todays USA Today

The Band goes waltzing again By Edna Gunderson, USA TODAY The Anniversary Waltz asks, "Could we but relive that sweet moment sublime?" The Last Waltz answers affirmatively, "I shall be re-released." A three-pronged 25th-anniversary celebration of The Band's send-off will kick off with the re-release of Martin Scorsese's landmark documentary of the all-star concert with Bob Dylan, Joni Mitchell, Neil Young and others. A limited theatrical run starts April 12 in San Francisco, New York and Los Angeles and widens a week later in Seattle, San Diego, Chicago, Boston, Philadelphia, Toronto and Washington. The restored and remastered print will be unveiled at a premiere in New York's Ziegfeld theater, where The Last Waltz bowed 24 years ago. (This year's "25th anniversary" campaign splits the difference between the 1976 concert and 1978 film.) A $60 four-CD box set arrives on Rhino Records April 16 with remixed tracks and unreleased material, including two jams and performances by Emmylou Harris, Van Morrison and Muddy Waters. The Last Waltz special-edition DVD ($25), due May 7 on MGM Entertainment, delivers storyboards, artwork, the movie trailer, TV ads, new interviews with Scorsese and Robbie Robertson, and never-before-seen footage of The Band with Ringo Starr, Eric Clapton and others. Key players weigh in during two full-length audio commentaries


Posted on Fri Feb 8 14:05:54 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

RIGHT ON! Dr. J


Posted on Fri Feb 8 14:04:32 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

I'm not saying this to be unkind; but I was reading the press release on Robbie for the opening games tonight. The line, "he was raised in Branford." As times goes by it's fascinating to watch history re-written. Raised in Branford will come as quite a surprise to the folks in Scarborough and Cabbagetown. "Visits to Branford" would have been more correct. I mean I was "raised in Oshawa Ontario" but I did spend my Christmas times and summer holidays at my grandparents 100 miles north of here. I would never presume to say that I was "raised" there. Not a big deal and some people may think I'm trite; but I just believe in being factual and "romanticizing something" is fine for a piece of fiction


Posted on Fri Feb 8 14:01:42 CET 2002 from (205.211.160.1)

Jerry Tenenbaum

From: Toronto

I continue to read with interest the 'feud' issue entries from various constituencies. It's tiresome and vacuous. Robbie Robertson is extremely talented and has and continues to shine. Levon Helm is a wonderful musician and is extremely talented. The Band was great and the more recent incarnation is still extremely talented. What does how the Robbie and Levon feel about each other have to do with me. Nothing. How do I even really know what is in their hearts. What was written in the past may have nothing to do with how people feel now. How does another person not involved have the insight or knowledge to know what is in people's hearts unless they are one of those interacting people...and even then, it's hard to know. So, these pages may be less full, though I doubt it, if we leave 'the feud' and 'the comparison between ensembles' behind. I suggest we leave this 'feud business' behind and move on to the wonderful discussions that go on here about the music...remember the music? To carry on to me is tasteless. MHO.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 13:16:18 CET 2002 from dialup-377.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.121)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

I repeat:

What would we have to talk about if The Band quit in The 70ies?

Not too much.........

Look to the left of your screen.........in that space I've seen Post TLW albums and solo work........ .......with or without RR these gentlemen played it like no-one else....seriously......no one else understood and played Rock'n'Roll like The Band....whatever the incarnation......They were Masters of the art......and no matter how shambolic or brilliant they were, if you were/are a lover and student of great music, there was/is much to learn from The Band. They were your direct LIVE connection to The Midnight Night Ramble, The Delta, Sonny Boy.... to that music which fulfilled the promise that The South would Rise Again......and rise it did and conquered the world.....without guns or violence but with song and dance........Where else could you get it? God Bless these people for trying to carry on. What a sight and sound to behold.....


Posted on Fri Feb 8 07:45:01 CET 2002 from (194.100.60.131)

Kalervo

From: Finland

Amanda: Thank you for reacting...I really like your posts, too... Rick, Richard, Levon and Garth are/were wonderful musicians whom should be honoured (good English?) individually, but the Band would never get this far without Robbie' s songs..To me songwriting, composing is the first step. It sets the table...


Posted on Fri Feb 8 05:44:41 CET 2002 from spider-wq013.proxy.aol.com (205.188.200.138)

Jake

From: Turkey Scratch, Arkansas

Richard Manuel was the most talented member of The Band, hands down.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 05:30:15 CET 2002 from 2cust111.tnt38.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.194.247.111)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

Wow, what a bill!! Robbie, The Mormon Tabernacle Choir, and hack movie soundtrack composer extraordinaire John Williams! (Anyone recall the Schmenge Brothers' "Salute to John Williams" on SCTV?)

As Gunther Toody used to say, "Ooh, Ooh, I can't wait!" I'm just hoping they'll have the good sense to add Mitch Miller and his singers to the lineup. Needless to say, I'll be grabbing up some extra boxes of Kleenex on my next trip to the supermarket.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 04:43:38 CET 2002 from spider-tm073.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.78)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Yippee! A new feud. Pre-Waltz vs Post Waltz Band. That old Levon/Robbie feud was gettin' dull.

I was thinking today about Dylan's famous "you're a liar", and "I don't believe you" lines. I was thinking about how he was performing under a phoney name at the time. How cool would it be if he released his next work as "Robert Zimmerman?"


Posted on Fri Feb 8 04:38:55 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Brown Eyed Girl: A few wise words from Bob Dylan ;o)

Well, you're on your own, you always were,

In a land of wolves and thieves.

Don't put your hope in ungodly man

Or be a slave to what somebody else believes.

Trust yourself

And you won't be disappointed when vain people let you down.

Trust yourself

And look not for answers where no answers can be found.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 03:00:43 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-001ilurbap147.dialsprint.net (158.252.113.83)

Susan

Web page

For those looking for a radio station I have one to recommend that's about as old-time as they come. It's WWHP in Farmer City, Illinois, and it's about as funky in every sense as radio stations get . It's not got much broadcast power; I live about 25 miles from the transmitter and can't always get the station in without an antenna and some fiddling. The playlist includes blues, alt country, bluegrass, some rock,gospel... and there is the Allman Brothers Hour every Tuesday at 7pm.

I don't know how they stay in business; I suspect the link buy albums from their site may be a significant source of income. There's a link to the web site above. Be careful about entering the url; one slip and you are on a porn site. The station calls itself The Whip, and there's a whip-crack before announcements.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 02:57:52 CET 2002 from 64-80-55-61-access.surferz.net (64.80.55.61)

Diamond Lil

Pat: You pose a very good question several posts back. What songs would one rather have heard at a Band concert? I'm not sure there's anyone here who wouldn't pick classic Band material over other stuff..hands down. But.. in seeing the 'other' Band waaay more times than the original ( I only had the pleasure of seeing the original 5 once).. _those_ are the moments of enjoyment that stick out foremost in my mind. I loved everything I had the pleasure of hearing..and at the time.. never gave any thought to what I could have been hearing instead.
I think, that the whole idea of music..is the enjoyment. Noone should have to defend it or justify it. If it makes you feel good at the time..that's all you need.

Have a good night everyone.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 02:23:50 CET 2002 from akcf1.xtra.co.nz (203.96.111.202)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

My theory (which could be way of track) was that Richard and Robbie were the two main "creative" forces in the group (I'm not talking about song writing here). As Richard's health deterioated over the years the music lost a dimension or warmth that was present on the first two albums (with perhaps the exception of Moondog Matinee).My point is best illustrated by listening to their post TLW albums which tend to highlight their strengths and weaknesses. Unfortunately we don't know what a Richard solo effort would have sounded like but I imagine there would have been a "soul" in there that is missing from the other's efforts.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 02:12:13 CET 2002 from proxy.lfpress.com (204.101.153.10)

Mike Nomad

The following moved friday night on Canadian Press's sports and entertainment wires, and is reproduced here for you enlightenment and pleasure:

Robbie Robertson behind First Nations content in opening ceremonies

By Neil Stevens

Canadian Press

SALT LAKE CITY — Robbie Robertson knew at an early age growing up in southern Ontario that he’d never be good enough to make it to the Olympics as a hockey player, but he’s proud to be playing a key role in the opening ceremonies Friday night of the Winter Games as a musician.

“I played a bit of hockey but I was never big on freezing outdoors,” he said in an interview on the eve of the big show.

Robertson, a native North American who grew up in the Brantford region, is well known for his role as a guitarist and singer in The Band and for solo recordings since that group’s mid-1970s breakup. He’s the creative force behind a moving 15-minute segment early in the opening ceremonies (9 p.m. EST, CBC).

Sadie Buck, a singer from the Six Nations community where Robertson’s mother was born and raised, also is taking part. She’ll perform The Unity Stomp with Robertson, as she did three years ago on his CD, Contact From The Underworld of Red Boy.

Ironically, the weather forecast calls for temperatures of from —3 to 0 C with a wind creating a biting chill factor, so Robertson is liable to feel as if he’s back on those outdoor rinks on which he played hockey as a boy back home. He shivered through a rehearsal Wednesday.

“I’ve never played music in this kind of cold,” he said. “I was saying last night, my God it’s cold. It’s 25 and we’re out here playing music.

“I’ll be falling back on my Canadian roots to get through it (Friday night).”

The segment will take place immediately before the parade of athletes, which will take place earlier than in most previous opening Winter Games ceremonies.

“We thought it appropriate that the first peoples of this continent welcome the athletes,” said pageant organizer Don Mischer.

Five Utah tribes, led by their elders, enter the stadium separately and eventually bond to become one. “This is holding out peoples’ arms to the world,” Robertson said in recalling the rehearsal. “I was absolutely moved by it.

“It’s so beautiful it will bring tears to your eyes.”

He’s never experienced anything like it.

“I’ve played at big festivals but this is a different thing entirely,” he said. “This is good medicine, this is a good thing. “I’m honoured to be part of it. I’ll be wearing hand warmers until we go out there and do it.”

The show will begin with the Mormon Tabernacle Choir signing the U.S. anthem. John Williams, on his 70th birthday, will conduct the Utah Symphony Orchestra.



Posted on Fri Feb 8 00:38:06 CET 2002 from dialup-63.208.65.159.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (63.208.65.159)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

And Luke, most view that second Roosevelt Stadium show as a major league rally after the first.


Posted on Fri Feb 8 00:34:05 CET 2002 from dialup-63.208.65.159.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (63.208.65.159)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Hank, I can't even count how many times I saw the post-LW Band, not counting the various Levon-Rick, Richard-Rick, Paul Butterfield-Rick, Byrds w. Rick & Richard incarnations. And I wasn't going because I like to torture myself. I love those people. But just like almost everyone who was there and saw the Original 5, I never saw the post-LW configs approach the pre-LW group musically, and as I've posted before, I actually liked the Rick-Richard duo the best because they did Band songs.

As far as steam rising? Hardly. Let's just say advising the little group on this site dedicated to The Band to not talk about buying the DVD of The Last Waltz (which was The original Band's last show) might make me a bit more forceful in my declarations. My previous question, however, is still open...


Posted on Thu Feb 7 23:29:45 CET 2002 from du-tele3-062.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.62)

Peter Viney

Busy, busy, busy when the topic is there. I'd like to reiterate that in my mind Jim, Randy and Richard Bell carried the torch with grace, and rank as full members of the Band, and I follow their solo excursions with full interest.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 23:03:34 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

Luke - "blech" is a non-word that approximates the sound of someone spitting something gross out of their mouths, like "yuck."

Hank, when I came to this site, I only had TLW, Big Pink, The Brown Album, all of which I bought AFTER buying Robbie's first three solo records (which I purchased at the time they were released). The first time I came here, I didn't even KNOW they'd gotten back together, or that there was any acrimony.

Granted, I'm probably in the minority.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 22:40:57 CET 2002 from stargate-40-16.salzburg-online.at (213.153.40.16)

Luke W.

As I'm from Austria I don't know what "blech" means. It seems to be a word that is not to be found in a dictionary. What does it mean? If it means something like "bad", am I the only one who thinks the second Roosevelt Show is great? However I have not heard the first one.

I also prefer the original line-up. To me the 90's Band wasn't able to let the music sound so "timeless" on stage.

Luke


Posted on Thu Feb 7 22:37:27 CET 2002 from dialup-283.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.27)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

Careful there, Pat B....when I scrolled past your post there was steam rising off it!!!.....I have no doubt that The Band in the 1970ies were the best rock'n'roll group there was to see.......unimpeachable and wondrous I'm sure.........

However, 70ies, 80ies, 90ies, solo....whatever line-up...The Band brought a funky, spectral feeling to your town no matter WHAT incarnation was available or out on the road, straight, stoned or sober...largely because they had been THERE.....what ever way you look at it, they had been seen, heard and played thru SO much that a certain magic followed them around....sometimes that magic was a burden....a bit too heavy and they often strained under it.....no matter.....even as they were falling apart and dying there was not a musical outfit to touch 'em......and there's no way you could describe them as a nostalgia act....It was the realest rock'n'roll around........so WHAT if they played Handjive or whatever? Who would you rather see playing Rock'n'Roll or blues covers? I mean, when I saw them in Dublin in 1996, people were CRYING at the way they were the first disasterous show.......red in the face, shouting, demanding explanations, trying to get backstage to to confront them.....the next night Rick came out on stage draped in an Irish flag and they rocked!!! Where would you get that voodoo?....only one place.....The Band.

Here's something for y'all to ponder.......would any of us be here if

A) The Band broke up after The Brown album?

B) The Band broke up after TLW?

I dunno.....I reckon alot of people are here at Jans site BECAUSE The Band continued to function after RR's departure and Richards passing. I mean, if it were JUST Big Pink and The Brown album, there would not be too much to talk about, would there?


Posted on Thu Feb 7 21:54:32 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

I freely admit my knowledge of live shows is limited exclusively to boots, ROA, and TLW (we won't mention Watkins Glen). Additionally, my boot collection is probably the opposite of comprehensive (and I'm greatful to those here who've been so kind as to give me what I have). Indeed, my Original Five boots are restricted to the Roosevelt Stadium shows (blech), CTLW (uneven, but incredible when good, despite horrible sound quality), and a handful of Dylan shows from the '74 tour (all of them quite good).

Surprisingly, where I have maybe six pre-TLW shows, I have about 10 shows from the 90s (plus a nice compilation by the good graces of a GB friend - you know who you are). I guess I should have been more overt in my phraseology. I really don't have any critical basis for evaluating 90s vs. 70s lineups - especially since I have nothing from the first few tours, and nothing from the '75 tour (most importantly the Carter Baron/King Biscuit show, which seems to get raves).

I defer to those with first-hand experience of 70s/80s/90s shows, and will now remove the hat from the front of my rictus. ; - )


Posted on Thu Feb 7 20:51:55 CET 2002 from garco.cpe.newsouth.net (64.90.4.86)

Mike Carrico

From: Georgia

Like all of us I can only speak from my own experience, but having seen the original 5 live half a dozen times, I can say that they were uniformly excellent save once. And on that occasion they were merely very good. The last 2 times I saw them Richard was not at his best, but the others were on their game every time.

As for the 80's/90's version of The Band, I saw them live twice (besides several shows with individual members duo or solo) and neither time were they nearly as good as any time I saw the original line-up. Once (1987) they were at best mediocre, due primarily to Rick being under the weather, and the other show (1996) was quite good but somehow missing something. This "something" is for me the crux.

The original 5 had refined their sound to the point that they seemed to have erased the lines between their individual selves to become one seamless musical entity. By the time of Big Pink they could not only play better than anyone else in rocknroll, but they could interact musically better than anyone else as well. Addition/expansion was not necessary, but subtraction was another matter. I doubt there was ever a band whose members were as irreplaceable as The Band; they had "something"...I'm not sure what it was, but I heard it onstage between 1969 and 1976. I haven't heard it since, from The Band or anyone else.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 20:20:27 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

I must admit...I am one of those that love the original Band. Nothing can replace those songs for me. "The RCO All-Stars" is that one exception because that record really means the world to me. I'll take anything Levon wants to give me. If he wants to re-live The Band, that is grand, if he wants to send me to the Blues Moon, I'll get there...I admire him that much.

Kalervo: I am someone who seeks out and tries not to be fearful of the truth at all costs. I really like your posts and the way you tend to shake things up, but I totally disagree with a previous statement of yours..."Robbie' s creativeness made the Band exceptional instead of good." I honestly don't know how you got there. I have always thought of Levon, Garth, Rick, Richard and Robbie as five extremely talented equals...five pieces to a exotically creative puzzle. I believe that all five men were brought together at a particular time and place by some musical force of nature. We can never get that back and it can never be re-created. That doesn't mean that I or anyone else can't enjoy every single piece of work they did individually afterwards. I have no need to compare them or their musicianship. I just want to marvel at all the different directions they have taken me.

G-Man: Don't worry...I'm not going to let TLW DVD keep me from my road trip to Arkansas in the Spring;o)


Posted on Thu Feb 7 20:20:54 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

Regarding this last thread re: Original 5 vs the 90's. Sorry; but I feel it's apples and oranges. You can't compare the two. In the first scenario there never was and never will be the magic of the Original 5 members of The Band. It just won't happen again. I dare say that if they were all alive and friendly and they did a reunion show, it could never capture that "special original feeling" we all had

In the 2nd scenario. Jim Wieder is a great guitarist. He is not Robbie. Robbie is not Eric and Eric is not Les Paul. Jim Wieder came in and technically and with soul filled in very very well. I would say the same for the keyboards of Richard Bell. Since the days of Crowbar and Janis Joplin's Full Tilt Boogie Band, Richard has always impressed me. Here in Toronto we are very blessed with great organ players. Dr. Music's Doug Riley for one and the others being Mike Fonfara formally of Rhinoceros and Dennis Keldie. Master B3 People. Comparisons are fun and perhaps an interesting game to play; but you cannot compare the Original 5 to the latter Band. No more than when George was still alive could you compare the remaining Beatles being joined by Julian Lennon or someone else. Just an opinion. Thanks for listening as always.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 19:02:13 CET 2002 from dialup-65.56.129.122.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.56.129.122)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

The Original Five was easily the best rock act I ever saw, and luckily I saw them enough times to know. Precision, sound, songs, vocals, rhythm, just nothing like them. Again, check the 1971 songlist against a 90's songlist. You'd rather hear Hand Jive over We Can Talk, Crazy Mama over Unfaithful Servant, Java Blues over I Shall Be Released, anything over Dixie? Please.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 18:58:35 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

I'll admit that I never got to see The Band live in any way, shape or form but to say that Robbie Robertson wasn't a "voice"! You don't have to be singing into a microphone to be a voice ! The Band were much more than their harmonies. Garth never sang..would someone say that "they don't remember being consciously aware that he wasn't there" ? I think Not !


Posted on Thu Feb 7 18:23:57 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

I first got to see The Band perform live in Atlanta in 1970. Several years prior to that I saw them as the former Hawks performing with Dylan. During those years I went to see, literally, almost every group or artist that passed through Atlanta. The Band in 1970 was the tightest and most polished group at the time, and I dare say, even to this day, that I've ever had the pleasure to see.

I recall that about the only criticism voiced by rock pundits at that time was that the group was almost too perfect in reproducing the sound of their recordings in a live situation. You have to remember that this was the era of excessive, and often sloppy, improvisation by many artists in rock music. The Band was such as startling contrast to concert goers at the time because of their concise precision.

On December 10th, 1970, when The Band performed here in Atlanta, everything about their performance exhibited this precision. Unlike many acts, then and now, they didn't hit the stage hours late, and there was no opening act. Every aspect of the concert, from the balance of intruments & vocals through the sound system to the set-list & performance itself, reflected an extreme level of professionalism and talent from each & everyone in the group & the support crew.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 18:16:49 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-003paphilp252.dialsprint.net (158.252.1.142)

Peter Stone Brown

From: Philly
Web page

I have to totally disagree with Matt. The 2nd incarnation (actually incarnations) of The Band never came close to the original in live performance. And, more important, their live performances were rarely uneven until the last year when they were diminished and hampered because Richard Manuel had become the weak link and the others were forced to cover for him.

Sure with the original incarnation there were some shows that weren't as good as other shows. The Roosevelt Stadium show was sloppy in comparison to what I'd seen before and their layoff from performing was obvious.

The post Last Waltz Band was definitely friendlier on stage, but they were never as tight and didn't take you to the stratosphere. The fire was missing, and the lack of rehearsal sadly obvious.

The original Band had a tightness, precision and intensity on stage matched by few and not by any rock band -- only by Booker T. & the MGs and James Brown's bands. The only time I saw come anywhere near the intensity of the original group was shortly after Richard died. It was a four-piece group with Weider and lots of solos from Garth. I ended up wishing they'd stayed with that stripped down line up.



Posted on Thu Feb 7 18:09:52 CET 2002 from 1cust208.tnt2.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (67.227.173.208)

rollie

HAVE I TOLD ANYONE HERE THAT I WAS AT THE LAST WALTZ? SO THE HECK WITH ALL YOUR DVDS AND WHAT NOTS!:)


Posted on Thu Feb 7 17:52:17 CET 2002 from host-65-164-8-8.co.erie.ny.us (65.164.8.8)

G-MAN

I never saw the pre-TLW Band live,,so all I can say is they were great and entertaining on video! Even if not always on the mark!!! Seeing them live in the 90's was the BAND to me and SUPER!!! Richard,,Rando,,and Jim Weider really added to the group;;expanded it from the original!! I remember the first show,,outdoors,,in the pit,,and Weegie doin a solo,,,,,no words could describe that!!! My view,, 90's Band head and shoulders above the original!!!!!


Posted on Thu Feb 7 17:47:50 CET 2002 from 24-196-236-100.charter-georgia.com (24.196.236.100)

Don Pugatch

From: Roswell, Ga

Every morning, after my work email's , I open the GB here and get my info for the coming day. Thnks for all on WRNR tip, just finished downloading the player and works great, and the best start was Hiatt doing "Everyone went Low", great. Now that I can stream, RNR and FUV, and hear the Blues show on WRFG from 8-10 AM, no need to ever, listen to commercial crap here in Atlanta. Talk about the vast waste land of music, with a population of almost 5 Million, you would have thought that someone could developed a format that included anyone over 12 years old, or a Head banger with a Confederate Flag plastered on their ass or truck, Guess not, but still keeping the faith when I hear other stations from across the country.

3 Days and counting till I am Dylanized.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 17:03:38 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

Peter and Bill make a good point (though I don't think Bill necessarily meant it this way). When one compares live performances of pre-TLW and post-TLW incarnations of The Band, one embarks on an entirely different level of comparison. In my posts, I'm starting from the premise that Big Pink and Brown Album define The Band in their most important historical context.

However, given their years as the Hawks, and given TLW was only supposed to mark the end of TOURING, The Band's identity as performing entity envokes an important part of their legacy. If one compares the original group to the reconstituted group in terms of live performance, I'm perfectly willing to give the nod to the later incarnation.

While the original lineup had some brilliant moments on stage, on balance, they were very uneven from show-to-show. If you discard The Hawks' years, the original group really didn't perform very by comparison, to the later group, which toured more and was much more consistent in their execution.

There are any number of factors for this, but there are three that stick out the most:

1) The 90s lineup toured much more and performed much more than the 70s group. As a result, they were inevitably tighter.

2) The 90s lineup was less f***ed up, to put it bluntly (and yes, Robbie played while wrecked too).

3) Randy, Jim and Richard. No way you can overstate the importance of those three guys to the consistent execution the 90s group. No matter what happened, you KNEW those guys would be on their mark to pick up the slack. A luxury the 70s shows lacked.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 16:40:30 CET 2002 from ares.tdsb.on.ca (207.35.188.13)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

Blue Eyed Girl/Luke: It is amazing how my post honouring a man and his group who espoused PEACE LOVE UNITY AND JUSTICE .........BOB MARLEY.....can cause such hostility.....Anyway, here is a definition of Acrostic Poetry which I tried to use to honour him....Thanks very much David Powell for apologizing about the insensitivity of others......I really appreciated your kind words.....and Norbert.........well.......You have always been my Guestbook hero.....even more than Robbie...;-D

Acrostic Poem....Acrostic poems look something like a simple crossword puzzle, and use a person or place name as a topic. For every letter in the word, you can think of a word or group of words that tell the topic.....


Posted on Thu Feb 7 16:20:08 CET 2002 from du-tele3-086.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.86)

Peter Viney

If 70s were 90s.

When the Band did Rock of Ages, they gave their repetoire a complete make-over by adding the horns. Again, in 76 the horns were there leading up to The Last Waltz. OK, now think who the most heavily bootlegged artists are. They’re the ones who do stuff radically differently as the years pass- Bob Dylan, Van Morrison, Neil Young. A different version really is different. Thinking of live shows and DVDs, the great pleasure comes in those radical moves – Don Henley doing Hotel California with a trombone band at the end of Live Inside Job, Paul Simon blending Diamonds on the Soles of her Shoes into You Can Call Me Al via a drum solo, Van Morrison doing Star of the County Down as a horn-led number, John Wetton taking Heat of the Moment right out of its familiar ‘1982 Radio Gold’ context and totally reworking it as a piece for two acoustic guitars, Bob Dylan … well hundreds of examples there. In all cases composers are radically reinterpreting their works.

Now much as I loved their shows, the 90s Band never did that. They stayed faithful to fixed arrangments of the old songs. They had no lack of ability. Jim Weider can play anything. Technically as several people have pointed out, Richard Bell was a better pianist than Richard Manuel. Randy’s drumming often seemed the cement – when Randy moved to bass the drums sounded weaker. When Levon moved to bass or mandolin they didn’t. I think that was a matter of strength in the foot (Levon injured his kick drum foot way back). They could also cover more than the obvious two thirds of the old songs because Rick could make Richard’s songs like ‘The Shape I’m In’ his own. There was nothing they couldn’t do perfectly and It Makes No Difference by the 90s Band was better than the 70s version. Where Robbie was missed – and I think he was missed – was in that radical reworking, that turning songs on their head, that I think would have happened if he’d been playing in the 90s Band. There would have been a reworking as strong as the Rock of Ages reworking. Only the composer, it seems, can really do that. OK, sometimes they fail – Van’s late 90s retread of Cleaning Windows spoils the song for me – but sometimes they do it brilliantly. Robbie’s innovation was something Garth would have worked with for a start – I’d see it as a seven piece by the way. Two guitarists would have been a bonus as well as two drummers, I’d bet Robbie would have had a couple of female backing singers live as he did at Agrigento (thus filling Richard’s high parts). All is speculation, but they’d also have had new material of matching quality, like Somewhere Down the Crazy River, Soap Box Preacher etc.

And on The Last Waltz thing a lot have you have been in bands. Was work ever equal? Were there guys who’d help the road crew carry the Hammond up a steep flight of steps and others who wouldn’t? Read Levon’s book. He admits that the work load wasn’t equal. Some didn’t like to rehearse. Garth spent months getting TLW perfect (as did Robbie). As Robbie said, the snapping point for him was arriving at the studio to work and finding himself alone. In the new version of TLW, who’s put in the hours and hours at the desk, do you think? OK, the workaholics take it upon themselves. Then the others feel they’re not getting a share of input. Then they realize they’re not getting a share of money either. It happens in every joint enterprise in my experience. Resentment grows on both sides. And you’ve all heard the old joke about the new supergroup formed from The Beach Boys, Simon and Garfunkel, The Rolling Stones and The Beatles. The tour was a sell-out, but it was a group consisting of Mike Love, Art Garfunkel, Bill Wyman, and Ringo Starr.

DVDs and problems with lip synch. ‘Enemy at the Gates’ is another one that drifts off synch. The basic problem is that because there are multiple soundtracks (usually more on European Region 2 discs) the sound isn’t irrevocably locked to the picture. As you go through a DVD with poor synch, the microseconds add up until about 30 minutes in there’s a discernible difference between sounds and lips (note that in Hollywood nowadays the soundtrack probably isn’t “live” in the first place- but post-dubbed). If you note the chapter number you’re on, then press STOP, then reselect the chapter again you should put it back in synch.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 15:42:15 CET 2002 from syr-24-169-66-92.twcny.rr.com (24.169.66.92)

Bashful Bill

From: Minoa,N.Y.

I saw the reformed Band many times, starting with the original reunion with the Cate Bros up until what I refer to as the last gasp. That was on a Mother's Day night in Utica when Rick was in Japan and most of the Crowmatix were on board.Good show, I recall Jim and Randy really playing their ases off that night. But it was my last Band show, after a long, long run and I've always been disappointed that Rick wasn't there. The vast majority of the 30 or so times I saw them were fine shows, though there were a few "off" days. Imissed Rick's bass playing in the Cate Bros period, and I often wished they had delved into some stuff from the various solo albums more than they did. The one timeI saw them on that tour with Billy Preston was a kind of lackluster show, my wife and I both felt they were kind of going through the motions. One of the best shows was when Blondie was touring with them, I think in 85. I have a recollection similair to Lil-I saw them play an outdoor show on Memorial Day just 2 short months after Richard died. Just the foursome of Rick, Levon, Garth, and Jim. Man, did I miss that piano! Jim doing the intro to Stage Fright on guitar was downright eerie. They really had it together during the Jericho tour in 94, but I saw them a couple times on the HOTH tour and Rick didn't look too good. It wasn't as bad as that show that Peter described in one of his articles, but on those two shows he was definitely holding the rest of the guys back on those nights(he sure made up for it the couple times I saw him play with the professor after he got back from Japan). But no matter what lineup they were in, they were always The Band as far as I was concerned. The core lineup with Jim, Randy, and Richard Bell was consistent for a real long time, and nobody will ever convince me that they weren't The Band.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 15:29:56 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

Oops:

"It's as simple as the group is 'not as good without Robbie (or Richard).'"

should read:

"It's NOT as simple as the group is 'not as good without Robbie (or Richard).'"


Posted on Thu Feb 7 15:23:39 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

Nick, you're completely missing what I said.

It's as simple as the group is "not as good without Robbie (or Richard)." Honestly, I think even if all five had reunited, that would not have been "the real thing," either. Time and place matter. Context matters. I completely agree that everyone in the post-TLW Band could play. However, there's more to the brilliance of the original group than musical ability.

Those five men, together at that moment in history, at that moment in their lives, were able to create something incredibly stunning in those first two albums. Something those same men couldn't quite recapture even a year later on Stagefright, and never really would again. Take any ONE of them out of the equation, and it wouldn't have worked.

It's not that Stagefright or NLCS, or even Cahoots or Islands don't have transcendant moments where songs, or portions of songs recapture that unbelievable POWER, but not for entire albums. But those first two albums... my God, that's why we're all here, isn't it?

No matter what, it's those first two albums that brings us together. They represent a high point in an era, musically and culturally that we all recognize, no matter our age, or where we live across an entire planet. EVERYTHING these guys did pales in comparison to Big Pink and the Brown Album. But that says more about how great those albums are than it diminishes anything else.

If you could recapture the magic simply by throwing together a bunch of guys who could "jam their asses off" people would be pumping out "Music from Big Pink" all the time. That doesn't mean the later stuff isn't great. But stick the label "The Band" on anything, and it invites comparison - and in that context everything comes up short, whether it's "NLCS vs. Big Pink" or "Jubilation vs. Brown Album."

There's no shame in this. I wish I could say I created something brilliant that I could never again attain. Then again, that sounds like the beginning of a Greek tragedy - as does the story of The Band.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 14:32:37 CET 2002 from host-65-164-8-8.co.erie.ny.us (65.164.8.8)

G-MAN

Sure finding some interesting posts(long posts)re. TLW on DVD!!! I figure, if you want to buy or rent it, and watch and listen,,why post about it?? Just get it?? IMO I'd rather use the cash for a road trip to see the Gurus or Levon! Just my view! I am sure the DVD will be enjoyable!


Posted on Thu Feb 7 14:17:43 CET 2002 from spider-loh-te084.proxy.aol.com (195.93.49.189)

luke

Blue Eyed Girl: I don't know about you but I have heard of acrostic poetry - unfortunately I haven't seen any examples here. I have however seen the simple minded ramblings of an unsound mind parading as acrostic poetry amongst other things. I take the view that we should let the children play...


Posted on Thu Feb 7 14:07:41 CET 2002 from ppp-1-179.5800-14.telinco.net (212.1.148.179)

Alan Edge

From: Widnes [near der 'Pool la]

I'm stealing a mo in work to post this.

BTW - Anybody on here know the monumental significance of Widnes in rocks history apart from it being a few miles from der 'Pool?

Humble thanks for the kind werds [once again] about my stuff. You really are a warm spirited bunch but then what else could I have expected on a site so committed to the lads. Besides I can assure you that the pleasure is all mine.

I realise I've inadvertently trodden on a few corns with some of what I said in my recent dirge. It was written from the heart as I'm sure by now you all are aware with my stuff. Re-reading what I wrote, I suppose it does look a little bit unkind on the lads post Winterland. As many of you said - with the three voices still present and correct and the musicianship effectively only marginally diminished there was no way the overall sound could ever be less than astonishing, especially for anybody witnessing the boys for the first time.

I chatted all this through with my daughter who loves the Band tho not as much as her dad being far more eclectic in her taste [Francois Hardy anyone?]. I told her what the response had been to what I'd written and she stared at me as if I'd just landed from the planet Zeus.[Little did she know - heh, heh - gleetings earthlings]

"Of course, some people aren't going to like it dad. Just as you wouldn't like it if somebody suddenly confronted you with the unpalatable." [she didn't actually use that werd as unlike her dad she's never had a dictionary shoved up her arse and besides apart from Man United beating Liverpool - and there's NO chance of that - what could I possibly find that was unpalatable?]

Anyrod, she went on to tell me what I had really meant to say [smart arse or what eh?!].

"Basically, dad, I think what you were trying to say in that 'bull-in-a-china-shop' way of yours is that in say 250 years time when the experts are dishing out the plaudits on what is the best music of all time The Band's first two albums will be up there alongside Mozart and Beethoven with very little else from the rock era."

And she says I'm the bull in a friggin china shop!!!!

Mind you I don't think she's that far away from the reality of what I really did mean. What do you lot think? Does anything else come close? Am I talking through my 'dictionary' again? Are we having chilli con carne for tea. Again!?


Posted on Thu Feb 7 13:58:51 CET 2002 from wc12.ym.rnc.net.cable.rogers.com (66.185.85.79)

John D

From: Toronto

Peter Viney's quick comment about DVD's not being perfect. I was really upset the other day when I bought a copy of the DVD, "The Rock" with Sean Connery. For almost 30 minutes the film suddenly goes out of sync. Like watching an overdubbed foreign film. Suddenly there is this jarring terrible edit and everything is fine again. I was going to take it back and then realized they are all probably like that. Very poor post work from the studio.

Also in regards to music films. The best music DVD for sound and fun has to be Bruce Springsteen live in New York. 6 channels of unbelievable sound. My next purchase was Randy Newman live at the Odeon in 5.1. HORRIBLE sound with 6 channels of rushing air behind him. It was shot in the 80's; but so was Steve Gadd's incredible DVD shot in Japan during the same period with amazing sound. I guess we have to find out on our own. I'm going to guess that TLW will sound pretty good. Hope so anyway.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 13:47:27 CET 2002 from dial2a-214.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.214)

Hi

From: You don't miss your water 'till your well runs dry

All whatever aside I have to agree with Pat on this one. As a comlete nut fan of the Band from Big Pink on for me the Last Waltz was the last waltz...and some may have forgotten that they seemed to be treading water for several years before that as far as recording at least...Cahoots to a live album to an album of oldies..finally a new album of new material after a few years and then retiring it the following year...for me RR was great and his replacements were pale in comparison.... but I do think they could have picked a better replacement and then with someone picking some better material it could have been a lot better IMHO....you know there's a lot of great guitar players out there...I'm not a big fan of any of the solo stuff either..when I go to the desert island I just need the first 2 without the bonus tracks....the rest is apocraphal(sic?)....but like his Bobness' stuff I'm glad it's all available.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 12:12:49 CET 2002 from (64.80.240.43)

Diamond Lil

Alan Edge: Your last post (as always) was wonderful..but I think I disagree with your comment about 'something missing' in some of the later Band configurations. As long as the voices were those of Rick, Richard, and Levon..and Garth was there.. it was The Band (at least to me). The first time I ever got the feeling that something was missing, was after Richard died. I had seen them in April of 1986 on a revolving stage (Westbury Music Fair, Long Island)..and I remember Richard's empty piano going round and round... That was a big time reality check.

I'm not sure why, with the absence of RR at first, that I didn't feel something missing. It's perhaps because he wasn't a "voice". He was amazing when he was with The Band, but I honestly don't remember ever being consciously aware of the fact that he wasn't there later on.

Have a good day everyone.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 10:40:11 CET 2002 from dialup-334.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.78)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

OK...I'll take up Pat Brennans challenge of which show I would rather to have seen........'71 or '90ies

In 1971 I was 8 years old ....I did'nt know much about 'em except that me Dad had "Big Pink" and I woulda been in bed at the time they were playing gigs.

In The 1990ies, I saw The Band quite a few times...I knew most of their stuff and I didn't have to go to bed.....They were rockin'!!!!!.....and scary!!!!

Although, these days I do sometimes wish I could go to bed at 9PM and have someone tuck me in and read me a story......


Posted on Thu Feb 7 10:05:02 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-001ilurbap260.dialsprint.net (158.252.112.150)

Susan

Well, I've ordered the DVD and will be buying a DVD player to go with it. I don't think that taking a position against the DVD will make any ripples in the larger world, and would deprive me of a pleasure. And it's the movie that brings many people to the Band. How many of us, especially the younger ones, first discovered the group from seeing the movie on tv? While the recordings are their best legacy to us it's the movie that brings these records to attention in these days. Say what you will about Hollywood Robbie, this movie was a masterstroke at giving the group a shot at a lasting cultural presence.

I like the notion of a 'band of brothers' and think that it probably did exist for a while. Shared purpose, and shared adversity do help small groups form tight bonds, but these things can't hold forever. Certainly this myth,if you will, is part of my appreciation of the Band, as arethe little bits of interpersonal relationships among these disparate personalities that appear in the various stories and interviews. I would love to have more detail. I would love to have been a fly on the wall in various rehearsal rooms, cars, planes, and the kitchen of Big Pink, although given Robbie's demonstrated quickness of hand I probably should select a different disguise.

I also like the music.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 08:12:16 CET 2002 from cranberry.cache.fi.jippii.net (195.197.160.12)

Kalervo

From: Suomi/Finland

Oh yes Mattk...You said so much what I want to say. And it is not the first time...

Yes, this stupid Robbie bashing is not so much against him, but defending Levon and company.Those people are afraid of the truth: Robbie' s creativeness made the Band exceptional instead of good...without underestimating the wonderful musicianship of others...As I said before I really wish that some of you stop bashing Robbie, because I may start to think that there is really something wrong with Levon and others!! I love them all, if Levon and Robbie can' t get along with each other, it is entirely their OWN problem. I don' t want to think Levon as Mike Love of the Band.

I just bought two differently excellent abums: Brian Wilson' s Live At The Roxy Theatre and Natalie Merchant' s Motherland...Both are really the emotional journeys for me....


Posted on Thu Feb 7 07:04:52 CET 2002 from spider-wq083.proxy.aol.com (205.188.200.201)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

j~t = thanks - I knew I'd get something right if I kept on trying. BTW, what's that whirly thing coming through your initials?

Bob Wigo = thanks for the Hal Blaine link - very nice.

Hey - any Beatle fans going to the beatlefest next month in Joisey? Let me know. I'm going Sunday.

Anyone catch that new show on Bravo called "Musicians". The first show was on Monday and it featured B.E.G.'s beloved Loooooooou Reed.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 06:56:17 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tb034.proxy.aol.com (64.12.104.34)

Calvin

It's funny, but till someone mentioned it I never really thought to compare RR's solo work or the Reunited Band, frankly their musical approach seems quite different, not even the same genre. I also find myself on RR's "side" on occassion when I never really mean to be. He has surely made some mistakes, but I guess I just dont go along with the complete demonizing of him. The comment that perked my interest in reading tonight, someone mentioned RR is taking all the bows, interviews and credit. Frankly this board is the only place Ive heard mention one of the releases is here-and Ive never heard RR say anything but the Band was an equal partnership. I guess it just boils to whatever the problem between Levon and Robbie is none of my damn business. Other than the general lament that 2 men that obviously cared about each other (the shared smoke in TLW clearly shows they did) arent speaking now. But Id feel bad if they were my neighbors, no what I mean. BTW, I saw Kasim Sulton play tonight, 25 people showed up and 25 people got a great show. How is it guys like him and Levon dont get any record labels supporting them-does musicianship mean nothing.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 06:13:35 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

None of Robbie's solo work "paled in comparison" to the re-united Band work ! Not for anyone who had the depth of soul to get it.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 05:04:02 CET 2002 from 12-243-71-112.client.attbi.com (12.243.71.112)

Tracy

From: drummingville

I don't quite get one of the recent posts. The drummers that were voted and that made it into Modern Drummer's Hall Of Fame have headbanging pyrotechnics and are flamboyant? Hotdogs? You mean to tell me greats like Buddy Rich, Louis Belleson, and Gene Krupa fit in this category? Ringo, flamboyant? Steve Gadd, flamboyant? Bonham had a huge influence on many of today's drummers, so I don't see any problem with him. When it comes to pyro and flamboyance, I don't see Peter Criss or Tommy Lee in this HOF. So, it's safe to say that people know good drummers when they hear them and their contribution to drummers of today. Less is more. Style is best said with sticks.

As for the DVD version of The Last Waltz. Come Helm or high water, I'll be purchasing it. No big deal to me. I've got a laser disc player that hasn't seen the light of day for several years. Another piece of technological brilliance won't hurt the closet space. Why should people feel sorry about getting the re-release? It's part of The Band's legacy. If one band member doesn't like it then that's their problem. They of all people shouldn't make fans of theirs feel awkward in buying a piece of history.

Tracy


Posted on Thu Feb 7 04:51:34 CET 2002 from dialup-65.58.44.33.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.58.44.33)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

A couple of things...

Why would either Scorsese or Robertson contact Levon Helm for his take on the Last Waltz unless they were simply perverse? Levon has made no bones about his distaste for the event and the movie, and to be honest I'd rather see him in All La Glory than watch him disparage something I find incredibly moving. Shit man, I f*cking cried like a f*cking baby when Levon and the boys did Dixie in that movie. And now I'm supposed to digest that they played like crap and all the other stuff that we've all heard? Sorry. For all the overdubs and Neil's coke and everything else, I can see the truth, when Levon and Robbie share a smoke. It was the end, and it was beautiful, and then it was over.

I of course am repeating myself here, but I would encourage all of you to compare the songlist from RAH in 1971 against any 90's show. Tell me, which one would you rather see?

All opinions, of course.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 04:33:50 CET 2002 from spider-wp031.proxy.aol.com (205.188.201.186)

Brien Sz

From: Nj

Well said Nick. I saw the Band many times in the eighties and nineties. All but one show were great performances. Would I have loved to have seen RR - you betcha but since their music was based on a group effort and RR had put leads to the back burner, Jim Wieder filled in wonderfully recreating the Band sound with his own twist. I don't think I missed RR's guitar as much as I missed the mystique of RR. Since he didn't sing (or very little) it wasn't like i had to replace the voice singing the songs with a new one. When Richard passed it was different but the spirit, I felt, was always the same.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 03:33:24 CET 2002 from spider-tr043.proxy.aol.com (152.163.201.193)

Nick

From: Virginia

Interesting opinion Mattk. But honestly, for me, what you wrote couldn't be farther from the truth. I saw The Band in the 90's many, many times. They were great. That's the bottom line. Not once did I think, "damn, I wish RR were with them". Levon and Rick are two of the very best singers and players ever. Garth is bar none the greatest keyboard player ever. How can they not be the real thing? They're awesome. They were the best shows I ever saw and I've seen tons of concerts. Let me add that Jim Weider is one of the best guitar players in the country today. Literally. If you saw him one time you would be forced to agree. I don't want to discount Richard Bell and Randy either. They can jam their asses off and it was their unselfishness that allowed the others to shine. That said the reason I don't like Robbie has nothing to do with feeling like he abandoned The Band. I enjoy Jericho and Jubilation more than any Band record except for the first three. Which are for me untouchable. Now that I think about it that was before RR started writing all the songs. Acadian Driftwood of NLSC is my favorite Band song. I know they missed RR's songwriting but sometimes it's not the written song but what you do with it after it's written. Which is why for me, RR's solo efforts pale in comparison to the reunited Band records as well as Rick's and Levons solo work. You can't write soul. I bash Robbie because except for this great page, every time I read about The Band today it's RR this and RR that and he perpetuates it. Well bullshit and I want to stand up for the others. Robbie was producing soundtracks and techno-Native American stuff while The Band was putting out soulful albums. Just because he didn't want to go out with them doesn't mean they shouldn't tour and make records. They'd been playing together for years. It was the Band not the Robbie Robertson Band. More power to them, it was their right and they were great on top of it. The Last Waltz DVD, (for me once again)is a different story. And look who's doing all the interviews and taking all the credit again for the Last Waltz? It's an insult to Garth and Levon. Without their participation it's not the "real thing". I'll be so bold as to speak for them. It just rings hollow for me. Look what John Donabie said about Garth painstakingly re-doing all his parts. And he doesn't see a penny. I don't care if he sold his share or not,he didn't know about the CD boom or DVD's when he did it. There should be no re-release without Garth. I think the fact that neither he or Levon is involved speaks volumes. I guess the spotlight is all on RR again. No, I don't resent RR for leaving The Band. Levon, Rick and Garth were just fine for me. Straight up. But I must admit it bugs the shit out of me to see those guys losing their homes while the great RR takes all the bows again. It's bullshit and I'm pretty sure they'll agree with me. Long post, I know. Don't take anything personal it's just my opinion and I had to express it.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 03:28:44 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-141.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.232.141)

Amanda

Just in from Jacksonville, Florida...land of the lame audience. Bob Dylan and His Band rocked the house. His voice sounded great...every word crystal clear. He danced and smiled and laughed...INCREDIBLE!! He made me feel alive...every song that I have heard a million times before...he brought life to them again and spirit and new meaning. When he did "I Shall Be Released"...it touched my heart because...you know...that's Richard's song...Richard's honor that Bob Dylan is sharing with the world. How all those people just sat in their seats and stared at him...I cannot fathom. I dolled myself up, stood at the side of the stage and shook my butt, clapped, gave him everything I had...that is what HE was giving me. Southern Folks and British Cats...go see Bob...you HAVE to experience this revitalizing energy he is exuding all over the place! My heart hasn't beaten that fast since I saw The Barnburners in 2000. Re: TLW DVD...I adore Levon...he has the soul and rhythm of the Mighty Mississippi...I am so into his music. I hope he will understand that I simply must possess The Last Waltz on DVD...if only just to hear his beautiful voice and to watch him bang those drums and gaze at his gorgeous face...to see and hear Muddy Waters sing "All you little girls,sittin'out at that line,I can make love to you woman,in five minutes time...Ain't that a man." Or...to watch the camera pan down from the top of Bob Dylan's hat as he begins "Forever Young"...or hearing The Band talk about their music...seeing Garth bring it all together...preserving Richard's and Rick's memory. All the special moments that mean so much to me, that have nothing to do with Robbie's commentary or the cover art or deteriorating relationships. Levon is more than just a member of The Band...he has proven that through his solo work and with The Barnburners...he keeps giving us more and more excellence in musicianship. I want my copy of The Last Waltz DVD because The Band simply rocks my world and they shine on stage and I want that magic available to me at ALL times.

Alan: You are a cool drink of water...I am looking forward to what you have to share.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 02:23:18 CET 2002 from ppp336.ac1.56k.execulink.com (209.239.6.20)

Paul Godfrey

Alan, your comments are very near and dear to my mind and heart.

In fact they bring to mind a photo in the Picture section...under Levon Helm and scroll down to Levon and his dad, Grossman, Hawkins and Robbie Robertson in a jeep at the RCO party. That photo asks more questions than it will ever give answers. \Shine On, everybody!


Posted on Thu Feb 7 01:38:20 CET 2002 from lib-ws-055.lib.asu.edu (129.219.247.55)

Ray Pence

From: Casper, Wyoming

Alan Edge, fantastic posts.

I just voted for Levon in the drummer poll. Having said that, I also want to say that I'm up for new versions of The Last Waltz, to hell with feuds.

It doesn't surprise me that Keltner, Watts, and Helm aren't on the Hall of Fame. I looked at some of the other names and it's obvious that the hot dogs get the preference over workmanlike dependables who know what to leave out and don't try for headbanging pyrotechnics. I doubt if Robbie, Garth, Rick, or Richard ever make it into similar halls of (flamboyant) fame.


Posted on Thu Feb 7 01:37:43 CET 2002 from cc5414-a.hnglo1.ov.nl.home.com (212.120.101.7)

Blue's caring mother

From: shouting at the back door

Just when I thought he was safe....my little blue has been let out of the home again. Now is that an act for a 62 years old?


Posted on Wed Feb 6 23:35:41 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

One final, interesting, thing on the radio discussion. Today, California Congressman Howard Berman requested that Attorney General John Ashcroft and FCC Chairman Michael Powell initiate an anti-trust investigation of Clear Channel Communications. For the unitiated, Clear Channel Communications is the number one radio broadcaster in the US, owning 1,200 radio stations nationwide. Additionally, Clear Channel also owns SFX Entertainment, which it purchased in two years ago for $4 billion (US). SFX is the nation's number one concert promoter, producing 26,000 events annually.

Allegations stem from complaints by artists that Clear Channel theatened to limit airplay of their CDs unless they gave SFX exclusive rights to promote their concerts. Amazingly, one of the complaints came from Britney Spears' management. Given her dominance of the US airwaves the past few years, it's frightening to consider that the Clear Channel may have been SUPRESSING her airplay.

I also see that the investigation is partly spurred by a lawsuit filed against Clear Channel by Denver promoter Doug Kaufman's "Nobody In Particular Presents." Apparently Clear Channel has been putting the same squeeze on the regional and smaller national acts that small-player NIPP brings to Denver. Effectively ripping a page from Microsoft's playbook to restrict competition even before an act "hits it big."

Anyway, this is the second such request to Ashcroft and Powell to investigate Clear Channel. In July, Congressman Robert Andrews made a similair request, which Ashcroft apparently ignored (presumably he's too busy busting Cancer patients trying to buy pot out in California).


Posted on Wed Feb 6 23:02:24 CET 2002 from 64-80-55-133-access.surferz.net (64.80.55.133)

Lil Again

Am I seeing things or what? Does anyone out there have the People magazine 2001 yearbook issue? There is a section dedicated to those who passed away.. and by Chet Atkins' name, there's a photo of a man playing a mandolin and wearing a tan shirt. Um.. Isn't that _Levon_?? And if so.. that is one huuuuuuge mistake. Am I seeing things? Anyone?


Posted on Wed Feb 6 22:48:07 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

At the risk of over-simplifying his eloquence, Alan's point is well taken. Like him, when I first stumbled into the GB three years ago, I was somewhat pollyanna-ish about the depth of acrimony in The Band's fanbase regarding Robbie's relationship with his former mates (particularly Levon).

I've been very vocal about my frustration in this matter because I feel all the allegations and finger-pointing somehow sullies something I find exquisite, musically. I freely admit that this frustration is rooted in my willingness, perhaps NEED, to (like most of us) buy into the "band of brothers" mystique, which is largely more myth than truth to begin with.

Perhaps this is true for most of us. While I never saw the reconstituted group (much less the original group), my feeling from listening to the albums is that while they each have their merits (and drawbacks) they accent the feeling I have (as Alan put it) "that this wasn’t the real thing."

I think more of us share that sentiment than would admit it. The demonization of Robbie Robertson's character makes no sense unless you feel he somehow cost you something personal when he "left" The Band in 1976 (the fact that he didn't "leave" or singlehandedly "breakup" the group is another topic altogether). While such accute disappointment is understandable, I do feel that viewing such a dynamic and diverse entity as The Band through a "good vs. evil" prism robs it (and its members) of its humanity, which is indemic to the very artistry we all revel in, which brings us joy and never ceases in its power to heal us regardless of age or geography (as Garth might put it).

I find it curious that, unlike the post-TLW group albums, none of the solo records leave me with the feeling this isn't the "real thing." True, Robbie's solo records are what drew me to The Band to begin with, which I celebrate and take great joy in. However, for me, all of Robbie's, Rick's, Levon's and Garth's solo records succeed or fail on their own merits, and I suspect all four men would not want it any other way.

While I'm aware many here feel I take "Robbie's side," in things, the truth is I don't feel a need to defend Robbie Robertson as much as I feel a need to defend "The Band." The irony is, I'm pretty sure others feel that they aren't attacking Robbie so much as they too are "defending The Band." From this perspective, you'd think we'd find more to celebrate when a long-awaited DVD or remastered CD is released, and yet somehow each of these occassions is marked by yet another eruption of bad feeling. Amazing.

Fundamentally, all of us here share an abiding love for the original group. The varying appreciation we have for music they produced singularly or collectively after 1976 SHOULD be a testament to the same artistic integrity and creative diversity that makes our love of the original group possible.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 21:59:34 CET 2002 from 64-80-55-133-access.surferz.net (64.80.55.133)

Diamond Lil

Dave the drummer: Thanks. I was going to post that, but you beat me to it. And btw.. Richard not only left behind a daughter, but a son as well.

Have a good night everyone.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 21:58:29 CET 2002 from dial2a-63.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.63)

Hi

From: Back To Mono

My 2 cents about DVD is if you rent a lot of movies and/or need a new cd player it might be worth getting one as they're pretty inexpensive. But of course you can't tape like a VCR although DVD recorders are already available they're overpriced and I don't think the format is set yet for a uniform type.... much like BETA vs VHS 20 years ago. My kid got a Playstation 2 and they play DVDs so I guess I'm set.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 21:51:19 CET 2002 from du-tele3-135.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.135)

Peter Viney

Andy – Nostell Priory was where Van appeared with The Band. Wish I’d been there. Your earlier remark on Van’s sartorial problems at TLW lend further interest to the DVD. Bill Graham’s Autobiography is great on Van prowling the balcony before deciding to go and change into a jump suit.

DVD isn’t perfect (watch the ever failing lip-synch on some early DVDs) but it’s worth the jump from video if you invest in a proper AV system too. Don’t make the mistake I made and utilise the hi-fi as front speakers – totally splitting the systems is the eventual answer. Anyway, video will be dead in a couple of years. TLW should make it worth changing (Shrek, executive producer RR, is another). The DVD will have been a lot of work. I recall RR saying he never made anything from TLW, because production costs ate the lot. Let’s hope he does this time round.

Some here might be interested in “Glory Bound” the 2000 release by Chris Farlowe. If you’re into 90s Band it should appeal. Farlowe’s vocals are mannered, so an acquired taste, but it’s good straight ahead soulful R & B.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 21:21:21 CET 2002 from spider-wk032.proxy.aol.com (205.188.198.162)

Calvin

Very good post Alan-A lot of sense in what you say. My view is RR is a control freak who tends to be a bit of a stuck-up loner and LH is directing a lor of misplaced anger over some things on RR, and has exaggerated some things. This to me means they are human being with normal frailties, much like you and I-and it doesnt matter a wit to the music. Was it you that said there really isnt any truth, just different viewpoints-well said. I for one will get the 4CD set and the DVD the first day Im able. I do think people are overestimating the amount or money that will be made from these, I cant imagine either being a big seller.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 20:59:24 CET 2002 from ppp-2-169.5800-14.telinco.net (212.1.149.169)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT NOW, CAN’T WE?

I have to say digesting the acrimony still surrounding the Robbie and Levon business has brought me down to earth with a bit of a bump from my exhilaration at finding this little piece of heaven barely a few days ago. Not surprisingly, I’ve been giving the matter some serious thought in work today and my overwhelming emotion is one of deep regret and sadness that inevitable base human frailties could have wrenched apart what must have been at one point a wondrously balanced chemistry of talent.

When a few years back I first read ‘Across the Great Divide’ and ‘Wheels on Fire’ – particularly the latter – I must say I tended to skip over any of the more acrimonious bits. Of course, they were nigh impossible to avoid completely in some of what Levon said or – perhaps even more revealingly – omitted to say about his former mucker. Fact was, however, I simply didn’t want to know about such things. I wanted to read only the good bits. The bits that celebrated the group’s magnificence. I wanted to remember The Band at their zenith.

Ironically, this was in much the same way as I never wanted to hear from some remote and detached music critics all those years ago that ‘Stagefright’ wasn’t as good as ‘Big Pink’ or the ‘The Band’ or that ‘Cahoots’ wasn’t a patch on even ‘Stagefright’. So what? I would assuage myself. These guys have made the two greatest albums popular music will likely encounter. You’re entitled to drop a gear or so. In fact, it’s an inevitability. It’s art. It’s artists. It’s life itself for Christ’s sake. What the fuck are you fellas on about?!

This dispute and its fallout occupies similar territory as far as I’m concerned. One of the few certainties in life that I have found – and it’s one of those that you do only fully realize with time – is that nothing ever stays the same. Nothing. Sometimes it’s hard to accept but accept it you must and then move on. Simply cherish the memory and then get on with it. So it is with The Band.

I would hazard a guess that The Band have given all of their really committed disciples more heightened pleasure down the years than arguably any other entity outside personal kith and kin existence. Who knows? Perhaps with some it goes even further than that. The fact that they are without peer is scarcely contested by anybody who has truly been smitten. Indeed, my own belief is that the passage of time will reinforce our instincts on this. Anything SO good must eventually register its true level universally. One only has to witness the content of this website to be assured that ultimately quality will out.

Now I’m not for one minute here trying to say that everything else was or is so much Mickey Mouse by comparison. That would be ludicrous as you all know. All of us have our favourites from Dylan to Debussy. We Band freaks, ourselves, have others we adore. Levon can still apparently knock an audience for six. Garth and Robbie are still mesmirising their devotees. I myself have seen Springsteen over twenty times now. I love the guy. His openness, his humour and showmanship and above all, of course, the incredible talent and music of both him and his majestic band. There are so so many others, too, as we are all only too aware.

Fact is, however, this beloved bunch of four Canadians and one Arkansian will always remain apart from all the rest. Hindsight culled over these past thirty years or so confirms what we, their disciples, felt instinctively when we were first exposed to their art; that they transcended what all those other artists achieved. Somehow they aspired and managed to fuse themselves into a virtual single entity; the nearest to a perfect musical oneness that twentieth century popular music has witnessed. So tight yet so fluid, so intricate and exquisite, so seamless and yet so complementary, so introverted and attached yet so accessible to anybody who cared to partake of their genius, so in touch with their roots and their heritage and yet so integral to the perpetuation of that heritage. In a word, vital.

The unpalatable bit, of course, is that – by definition – the entity ceased to exist after that farewell concert in Winterland. Once their ranks had been irreparably damaged by Robbie’s departure it really was the end. Regrettably, when an entity is so perfect, so symmetrical as The Band manifestly were, it takes far less than the exodus of one fifth of that entity to render it – in brutal comparison to what it was – effectively defunct. That goes for whichever part of the entity was the one departing. When that departee also happens to constitute your most prominent tunesmith then you really do have a problem.

And that is what the remaining four fifths of The Band were confronted by.

Seeing them – with the Cate Brothers installed in place of Robbie – at Nostell Priory some years ago was an immense personal thrill. Illness and their criminally limited sojourns to the UK had denied my seeing them before and so I was determined to give them my all on this occasion. And that I most certainly did. I cheered and I hollered for all I was worth. I wept with joy at standing no more than twenty feet from men I worshipped. For Rick’s aching ‘It Makes No Difference’ – and much to my wife’s embarrassment – I even whipped off my shirt and held it aloft between two raised arms swaying rhythmically like any proud Liverpool Kopite would do in the presence of his heroes. It was MY communion with MY idols.

And yet, somewhere deep down something was telling me that this wasn’t the real thing. Oh sure I kidded myself that it was and sure the lads were marvellous. Sure they rocked and they rolled and – how do you fellas put it in your neck of the woods – they kicked ass. Fact was, however, whilst four out of five may not be bad for the likes of Meatloaf, when it comes to The Band it is nowhere near enough. Frankly, it wasn’t The Band. I had witnessed something else entirely. Another entity. As great and as matchlessly accomplished as all of them were, I was not in the presence of the Real McCoy. In this instance the sum of the parts did not exceed the whole.

It is distinctly possible, of course, that the remaining members of The Band were blind to this. After all, they were on the inside looking out. They weren’t seeing what we saw. Fact was, though, for those like myself who years earlier had fallen headlong for the sublimity of their unique fusion and their creation of that magical Brigadoon, we were left to reflect quietly on the expiration of something more precious than mere words alone can describe.

You know one of the many things I really loved The Band for?

I’ll tell you.

The Band gave the likes of myself – a scruffy young nomark from the backstreets of Liverpool – the opportunity to sample something I might otherwise have been denied. It was the chance to sample – in my case at the relatively sprightly age of seventeen – art of the very highest quality. I never knew it at the time, of course. I was simply enraptured by what I heard coming out of a pub’s juke box. Fact was, however, with those first nine tracks on Big Pink and the whole of the second album, The Band had managed to grab hold of some stardust and bottle it. More than a decade spent honing their considerable gifts, whittling their craft and perfecting their unique musical union enabled them to lay down those two priceless vehicles of sheer beauty and splendour. The fact the idiom in which they perfected their art allowed ordinary Joes like me to share in became our rare fortune

That surely is a legacy only the selected few have ever bequeathed.

Perhaps one day when the dust has finally settled on this regrettable affair – and pray before any further tragedy is unleashed on our heroes – Levon and Robbie may wish to reflect together on what it is that history will inevitably determine they were really about.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 20:59:22 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia
Web page

On a more serious note, Al Kooper, on his website mentioned that his old friend & bandmate, Andy Kulberg, passed away on January 28th. Mr. Kulberg played bass & flute with Mr. Kooper in The Blues Project and was later a member of Sea Train.

Mr. Kooper, himself, is recovering from surgery for removal of a benign brain tumor. For further details, to send condolences regarding his friend and to relay messages, click on the webpage link above.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 20:56:30 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp70948.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.195.27)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

I guess YOU have never heard about Acrostic Poetry....It's never too late to go back to school.....:-D....Just when I wore out listening to "Whipping Post" now I will have to listen to Van's "Professional Jealousy".........Anyway, it's obvious that you speak with FORKED TONGUE.......Please keep your NEGATIVE VIBRATIONS to yourself......'cause there are more than enough klootzaks in this world....


Posted on Wed Feb 6 20:22:48 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

David raises a good point about voting in Florida. A more general caution would be that we need to be careful to ensure that Levon comes in second if we want him to win.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 20:21:15 CET 2002 from (205.245.52.66)

carmen

From: PA

Thanks Dave the Drummer-that is exactly what I was getting at.

Anyone in the Philly area remember when WMMR used "The Shape I'm In" to introduce Pat Croce (former 76'ers owner) for his daily fitness tip? WMMR at one time had a substantial BAND playlist. They would play Arcadian Driftwood from time to time.

Not BAND related, however, did anyone catch Pink Floyd Behind the Music last month? I found their feud to be as interesting as the one mentioned in this GB from time to time.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 19:52:56 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-226.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.226)

MattK

Web page

Spending the first 27 years of my life in the Denver/Boulder area provided an interesting microcosim of the decline of "free form" radio. In the late 70s/early 80s, most of Denver radio was imploding into alternately "hard rock," "country," "adult," formats.

Originally, KBCO in Boulder was very open formatted. In the age of waning disco and burgeoning Air Supply/REO schlock, it was the best thing going. KBCO was where you could hear John Hiatt, Elvis Costello, with occassional CSNY or Dead tunes. Sadly, the station began to rely almost exclusively on a short list of songs that appealed to baby boomers, who were just then entering middle age. The cooler stuff dropped off in favor of more and Jackson Browne or Fleetwood Mac - stuff you could hear on regular top 40 formats at the time. Those of us who were in our late teens and 20s during the 80s were SOL.

Up in Fort Collins, KTCL picked up the slack, and originally had the feel of a student-run station (most of the DJs were CSU students), but unlike KBCO, KTCL played newer music. In the middle of the night, you were just as likely to hear all of "Dark Side of the Moon" as "London Calling" or "Stealing Fire." While everyone else was playing Thriller or Rick Astley, KTCL served up XTC, the Cure, The Smiths.

KTCL as also the only radio station that did anything for local bands and would play self-produced CDs. It was KTCL that pushed the Subdudes even before they placed second in Musician Magazine's Best Unsigned Band contest and got their first contract. It was KTCL that first boosted Big Head Todd and the Monsters when they were still a bunch of kids from Lakewood (and Lakewood's favorite son was STILL Kip Winger).

Sadly, just as KBCO fell victim to its own success, becoming just another "The River" format station, KTCL was destroyed by commodification of the very "alternative music" label it helped create. By the early 90s, KTCL was becoming a rubber stamp station pumping non-stop Dave Matthews, Blues Traveler, Dada, Collective Soul singles, never playing album cuts, always sticking to the list, and abandoning local music. I'm told it's indistinguishable from the thousands of 18 - 25 demographic stations out there, which is sad. Radio can change your life.

I STILL get mad remembering the night, as a fifteen year old, I turned on my favorite station KADX, one of the last commercial jazz stations in the US (not lite jazz, either) abruptly announced they had just been bought, the DJs had been fired, and as of midnight were shifting to "contemporary country" format.

From the age of 12, I refused to listen to anything but Jazz, (except for Steely Dan's AJA and Paul Simon records, every LP I bought until I was 17 was a jazz record), and religiously listening to and collecting jazz records. KADX was my early guide to everyone from Chu Berry to Anthony Braxton. I remember sitting on my bed and crying as the DJ said goodnight.

Even at 15, I knew that an era was ending, and it was two years before jazz returned in any form to Denver radio, but it was never the same, and these days, you can't find jazz radio outside of New Orleans or NYC that isn't Public Radio. Given the number of CDs I've purchased in my life, I can't help but wonder if the Music Industry will every "get" the corrolation between serving crap to kids and diminishing profits in the 18 and over demographics.

Anyway, I second WRNR as the eastern seaboard's finest open format station. I'm surprised Charlie Young can pick it up in VA. I could only get it in MD from Prince Georges County and points west. They have a terrific Web Radio station too. Fans of the old SonicRadio should check it out as it allows you to set frequency limits by artist. Use the web link above.

Up here in Maine, Citadel converted one of its stations over to "Adult Alternative," which isn't too bad. Not really free form, but the range of music is broad enough that it takes a couple days to get old (as opposed to a couple hours on most stations).


Posted on Wed Feb 6 19:38:10 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

I urge everyone to vote for Levon in the Modern Drummer Hall of Fame poll. (Residents of Florida -- please take extra care when casting your vote) [:-)

As I mentioned here in the guestbook not long ago -- it's hard to think of another musician who combined both the skills of drumming and singing to the advanced degree that Levon mastered. Combine that with his talents on mandolin, guitar, bass & harmonica, and you've got the Real Deal my friends. I've seen the Barnburners play several times and was amazed at the refinement & enthusiasm that Levon continues to display. When many of his contemporaries seem content to rest upon their laurels, Levon is still eager to go out on the road, despite any obstacle, and night after night put on a clinic in the art of drumming.

Just to add to Tim Kocher DVD endorsement, don't forget that a DVD player's audio section will also play standard CDs, so you get two machines in one.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 19:13:08 CET 2002 from spider-we043.proxy.aol.com (205.188.195.38)

Dave ~ (the drummer)

From: Pittsburgh, Pa.
Web page

Earlier today Ben Pike wrote : "I'm afraid royalties haven't done Richard Manuel, god bless him, much good in a long time."

HEY BEN-- Apparently you have no regard for THE SURVIVORS of Richard Manuel. When he died in 1986, he left behind a wife & a daughter. Don't they deserve to prosper from Richard's legacy??? I bet you'd want your family to reap the fruits of your life's labor. 'Nuff said.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 19:07:02 CET 2002 from du104-4.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.4.104)

Ilkka

From: Nordic Countries
Web page

The Nature is analog - not digital. That's why.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 18:13:37 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa

From: NY, NY

If you are interested in good 'ole radio, check out WFUV, Fordam University. It's called Cityfolk. It reaches the entire metro area including parts of Connecticut and most of Jersey. They are also on the web at www.wfuv.org. You can always catch a band tune and some other phenominal folk and rock like Steve Earl and Kelly Joe Phelps. It is the highlight of my commute. In Peace, Theresa


Posted on Wed Feb 6 18:11:18 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-004paphilp079.dialsprint.net (158.252.2.167)

Peter Stone Brown

From: Philly
Web page

Sorry Charlie, but WXPN is neither free form nor progressive. They just pretend to be with constant reminders of how wonderful they are.

They are a playlist station to the max and what little music of the Band they play is usually quite typical, "It Makes No Difference" or "The Shape I'm In."

Once a college station and still owned by the University of Pennsylvania, it's been about 16 years since they let a student to a show. Their disc jockeys/announcers are paid professionals who once upon a time were on commercial FM rock stations.

WXPN depends on marketing surveys and what their program director and music director think is trendy, then maybe they slip in some good music.

Once upon a time it was different of course. If you want to hear a station that is really close to what free form radio once was, check out WNCW in North Carolina. WXPN is really a commercial station (complete with commercials masquerading as corporate sponsorship) pretending that it isn't.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 17:37:30 CET 2002 from 0-1pool73-121.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.73.121)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Speaking of good radio, I'm reading a fine new book by Richard Neer called "FM: The Rise and Fall of Rock Radio" that traces the history of so-called PROGRESSIVE (or free-form)radio. There are still some stations that follow this tradition--WRNR in Maryland and WXPN in Pennsylvania for example--but they are few and far between.Those are the only two stations between New Jersey and Virginia Beach where I still hear songs by The Band. Broadcast radio is on the way out as soon as the new technology is in place, so maybe there is hope.

"Kill ugly radio"-Frank Zappa [Corporate music is just as ugly as corporate government--I said that]


Posted on Wed Feb 6 17:27:21 CET 2002 from dm125.davidson-marketing.com (209.224.210.254)

Tim Kocher

From: Chicky-G

Hi all,

Thanks for the responses to my earlier post. Pat, I didn't mean to suggest that the feud was a fan costruct - far from it, but I was questioning whether we as fans have the right to judge the issues of it with any kind of certainty, or whether it is even worth doing so. Anyway, that kind of point is old hat here, I guess! back to discussing happier things. (cheers also to our Liverpudlian friend, I enjoyed your last post)

About DVD players, I was skeptical myself - finally my friend got fed up and bought me a $140 code-free APEX player and told me to pay him back later. I have never looked back. Even my technophobic fiancee loves it. The gap between DVD and VHS is maybe similar to the gap between CD or excellent vinyl and a cheap low-bias audio cassette. Just no comparison. Now that services like Netflix make renting a wide range of esoteric titles easy, I would never go back. Just my perspective. If you love your music and movies, then just do it, if only to hear with pristine clarity the separated vocal tracks on the Rhino Brown album DVD!!

Tim


Posted on Wed Feb 6 16:55:36 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.89)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

Pat Brennan: I am jealous you get to listen to WXRT (though maybe there is a way I can nowadays on the net?) If it is like it used to be in the early eighties, it plays an amazing mix of music--a mix I have never found anywhere else. One minute they used to play some old obscure thing, then a brilliant classic, then the latest hot, good thing. You could keep up with the present but still remember and learn about the past. You have to switch around to about 5 different stations here in Cincy to get the same effect. Is it still the same? Do they still have the artist of the day?


Posted on Wed Feb 6 16:49:11 CET 2002 from spider-wc062.proxy.aol.com (205.188.193.47)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA
Web page

Bayou Sam, I second that Happy Birthday wish to Mr. Hal Blaine who can comfortably claim legend status in the music business. His versatility and creativity are simply amazing. I linked his site and suggest a browse around. His list of credits will raise smiles and eyebrows.

Thanks for the reminder and thanks to all who have taken the time to vote for Levon Helm in the Modern Drummer Hall of Fame balloting. The link is on the "What's New" page thanks to Jan.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 16:10:17 CET 2002 from (209.89.149.111)

Blue Eyed Girl

Just when I thought it was safe to return....Brown-Eyed Girl has been let out of the home again. What are you 12 years old?


Posted on Wed Feb 6 15:25:18 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

From: Toronto

Jenny T: Thanks for the note. It seems to me that Tony Kosinec must've covered John Stewart's song, as the lyrics you provided sound right. I no longer have Kosinec's 45, so can't check, but his listing on the valuable BMI online repertoire (www.bmi.com) doesn't have the Little Road title listed under his name. For the record, Tony's first LP, with Harvey Brooks and others, went nowhere. His second, with Zal Yanofsky et al, also went nowhere. His third, contained a big Canadian hit, "All Things Come From God", but there was no successful follow-up. He then turned to jingles, hitting paydirt with "OK Blue Jays" (... let's play ball ...)


Posted on Wed Feb 6 14:45:29 CET 2002 from dialin-676-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.3.168)

Bill S

From: Cold Spring, N.Y.

Bodles Opera House Chester, N.Y. (845) 469-4595


Posted on Wed Feb 6 14:20:07 CET 2002 from spider-tn052.proxy.aol.com (152.163.207.67)

Brien Sz

From: Nj

GO Levon GO! It would be wonderful to see him recognized come July. Abd I can't wait until I get a chance to see the BB's jam again!

I'm in a bind about the DVD. Not because of RR or anything - more power to him actually, we're in a capitalist society aren't we? It's because I don't own a DVD player. I don't think the expense is worth it, mainly because I rarely watch movies on my VCR and tape even less. Is the New Last Watlz going to be released on video or is it time to retire the dinosaur and get in with the new age.

As a side note: the last thing i taped was Bush's address to the nation after 9/11. I thought it would be an important piece of history. Also, Ben, you need to relax a little. I imagine you want an equal witch hunt with Bush and Enron. Unfortunatley, Enron was in so many pockets, liberal and conservative that I think this will not become Bush's Whitewater, Lewinsky, Foster, Pardon scandal. A thorn in the side, no doubt. But corporations giving money to politicians for favors - like that's new.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 08:19:38 CET 2002 from sqd104.nirai.ne.jp (218.40.162.4)

Fred

From: An island with NO railway

I've done my musical civic duty...I voted. Today the drummer's Hall of Fame (well actually JULY) tomorrow ...the White House!! Levon for President and Garth for PM of Canada!!! Gotta go and prepare for a weekend trip to Kyoto. Long flight to Osaka, then on by train to Kyoto. This will be my first time riding the rails in the Land of The Rising Sun (last year we took the bus from Osaka to Kyoto) MYSTERY TRAIN indeed! I've been psyching myself up by listening to songs about trains (Bring It On Home, various versions of Mystery Train, etc) I just love travelling by train. Plus some of the best songs are about trains! Can't say the same about airplanes!!


Posted on Wed Feb 6 08:15:15 CET 2002 from pd95363aa.dip.t-dialin.net (217.83.99.170)

ulbiman

From: germany

Hi there! I just wanna tell you that the first thing in the morning is to read all the fantastic stuff in the GB. I love the way you all think and live for the Band. Please entermain me more and more bout TLW. I´m so hot for any new stuff !! I´ll buy the cd´s and the dvd as soon they are available in germany. I´m proud to be a member of the Band people. Kepp the spirit HIIIIGH ! ulbiman


Posted on Wed Feb 6 07:57:36 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

Bayou finally right about something. Buy the sombitch...it ain't gonna cost much more than a pizza !


Posted on Wed Feb 6 07:28:37 CET 2002 from 1cust109.tnt1.idaho-falls.id.da.uu.net (63.28.242.109)

Bush and His attack on our nation

Great piece by David Vest, one of the Northwests great blues players........http://www.counterpunch.org/


Posted on Wed Feb 6 07:28:09 CET 2002 from spider-wl024.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.29)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

For cryin'out loud - just go buy/rent TLW DVD because you're a fan and it will be "COOL" to look at. The hell with all this political, who gets how much, who screwed who, bullshit!........sorry.....no I'm not.

Happy Birthday to a GREAT drummer that isn't a household name, but you've ALL heard his drumming - Hal Blaine.

I've already voted for Levon - if you haven't yet - get on with it.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 07:21:02 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-te021.proxy.aol.com (64.12.103.156)

Z

From: California

Greetings. I'm wondering if anyone has advice to offer regarding the 5-disc "Genuine Basement Tapes" that are floating around. Are there any "Katie's Been Gone" or "Acapulco" gems on there that should warrant me to part with $65 for the set? Thanks in advance.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 07:16:42 CET 2002 from netcache-1112.public.svc.webtv.net (209.240.222.32)

j ~t

There is no reason to buy this new DVD deal if all someone is interested in is the feud aspect. We can get it all right here in the old GB..torn apart and put back together a thousand times !


Posted on Wed Feb 6 06:41:56 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-181.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.181)

MattK

There's a reason civil trials in America do not rely on unanimous juries to render a decision. Complete culpability in a dispute between two or more parties is hard to prove without extraordinary evidence - even "evidence" can lead intelligent people to opposite conclusions.

If everyone saw "the truth" clearly when dealing with anger and bitterness towards family or loved ones, there would be no need for divorce courts and everything would be settled in mediation. Actually, if this were true, I suspect the divorce rate itself would be substantially lower, and psychotherapists everywhere would lose their jobs.

"The truth" doesn't exist in this matter. It's a myth, no matter what's said, or who's mouth it comes out of. We're not going to wake up one day and discover EVERYBODY in the GB hates Robbie. Nor will we logon to this site and discover EVERYONE is suddenly saying "boy, Levon sure had us all fooled."

Who we believe, or what we see as fact vs. fiction on this topic is largely based on loyalties. For some, those loyalties are rooted who our friends are. For the overwhelming majority, however, those loyalties are based on nothing more than emotional affinity, or perhaps emotional baggage.

Either way, I don't think the decision to buy/not, rent/not, a DVD (or VHS for that matter) should be seen as a political statement. If you buy it, you're buying it because you love the music, you love the film, and you want to see/know more, it's that simple. Personally, I'm not buying or renting it simply because I don't have a DVD player.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 06:20:53 CET 2002 from spider-te082.proxy.aol.com (152.163.195.212)

Ben Pike

From: Cleveland TX

Two wonderfuly absurd statements as I scroll down. First, that the feckless corporate criminal who calls himself our President(in the election his brother and the corrupt SC stole for him) is "GREAT." As Sen Hollings said the other day: "I did not have politics with that man" (Lay). What a boldfaced fibber, except this is about his buddies ripping off the country and trashing the economy, not his sex life. And Carman, I'm afraid royalties haven't done Richard Manuel, god bless him, much good in a long time.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 06:15:28 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp68556.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.185.175)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

Brave, Boundless Energy

Observant, Occupied With Social Justice

Birthday of King Of Reggae February 6, 1945, Born To Communicate LOVE PEACE AND JUSTICE

Mystical, Many People Are Inspired By Bob

Avid Soccer (Football) Player

Rasta Mon!, Played Roots Music

Lively Up Yourself....Bob's Fave Song, LOVED By People All Over The World

EMANCIPATE YOURSELF FROM MENTAL SLAVERY....One Of His Messages

Yielded To No One...."All I have is my life".....

I am sooooo grateful that Marley left a POSITIVE VIBRATION in relation to his legacy....The media tried to stir up dissention between Peter Tosh and Bob when they parted but Peter has publicly stated...."When I left the Wailers it was not directly any conflict between me and Bob. Bob was manifesting what was in him. I was at that time decorating what was inside of Bob to make it beautiful and the time had come for me to decorate what was inside of me, so I did.".....As far as writing credits go....Bob always said that he never wrote any song himself.....All his songs came from Jah! Thank you for that Bob.....No toxic waste with your music and legacy at all......:-D


Posted on Wed Feb 6 04:40:02 CET 2002 from spider-wd031.proxy.aol.com (205.188.193.161)

Martin

From: New Jersey

Sorry to barge in, I was wondering if anyone is interested in an original "COMPLETE LAST WALTZ" that needs a new home? It's hard to find us "BAND" people, so I thought this may be the right avenue. Bobby Jones, Are you out there?


Posted on Wed Feb 6 03:35:09 CET 2002 from dialup-293.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.37)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

I voted for Levon, Bob!!!........but I was surprised to see Charlie Watts and Jim Keltner omitted from that list, too.......


Posted on Wed Feb 6 03:21:02 CET 2002 from spider-wi083.proxy.aol.com (205.188.197.58)

Kevin Brown

From: mars(according to my wife)

For those who are interested there is an article on Levon in the Feb. 2002 Country Music magazine.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 02:48:45 CET 2002 from 12-249-69-3.client.attbi.com (12.249.69.3)

Chris

From: Chicago

Butch, thanks for the email.

To everyone out there that I have met through this guestbook I just want to say that I have really enjoyed the time here.

I find it to be slightly comical though that while my schedule has changed, and I don't get to visit as often as I want, I can always pick up the conversation just where I left it with a minimum of backward scrolling.

How about some bootleg sharing to make my New Year. I am looking for the Soldier Field The Band show from 1995, opening for the Dead. Both nights. I was there and was tickled pink. Please help me get them on either video or audio.

Peace


Posted on Wed Feb 6 02:39:25 CET 2002 from dialup-166.90.84.216.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (166.90.84.216)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Tim, no disrespect taken, but the "feud" is not a fan construct.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 02:13:49 CET 2002 from (62.31.64.2)

Alan edge

From: Liverpool

Erudite sentiments Tim, perhaps paralleling the spirit if not the frivolity of my own earlier effort. I sense we are both somewhat akin to distant cousins attending a family function where a ruckus breaks out and there really isn't a chance of us deciphering all the nuances that led up to it.

Like you my instinct is simply to relish more footage of these great artists. Indeed, it could be held that being an innocent abroad is no bad thing in this context having regard to the depth of ill feeling that seems to exist between Levon and Robbie.

That said, it could also be construed as burying your head in the sand. I mean, if it were to be true what we hear of Robbie's hiving off of the lion's share of any royalties since 1976 by some skilful legal manipulation of artist's rights legislation then it has to be said it does rather taint what I think we all came to regard as the definitive rock 'n' roll musical statement of share and share alike?

I do seem to recall in an old NME interview Robbie once despairing because he hadn't heard the truth in a long long time. At the time they seemed like the words of an old sage. On reflection, it could be that it was simply the same sort of meaningless posturing with which we are bombarded day in day out in the media. Who really knows. I'm bloody certain Robbie doesn't.

What does seem to be the case is that devotees of The Band may have to wait an awful lot longer before they get to hear that all so elusive truth.

In the final analysis you may well be right Tim. Perhaps the only answer is to sit back and relish all these peoples complete artistic legacy. If that involves lining the wrong peoples' pockets by shelling out for this DVD then so be it. One way or another is that not the same as it ever was? You pays yer money and greedy bastards take it off yer.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 01:17:12 CET 2002 from (151.200.135.241)

Lauren

Just an FYI---regarding feuds and such---it is all about the music. And often the behind the scenes tells the real tale. In MY case and as the story is about to break open really soon now I have been told, I hope writers out there express what they feel about restorative justice..... there is now hype that there is a feud. Man oh man, improper and totally inaccurate---this is and was a damn bloddy war for civil rights. There is a horrible person named claire bronnitt (claire stevens of kool 96.7 CT) whom is a dangerous fraud whom has manipulated and coerced innocent vulnerable folk to do her bidding by horrific lies and deceptions that would boggle the mind. No bloddy feud of kiss and make up. This is about Human Rights. In my case. Not meglomania egomaniacs --just about plain horrifying truth about what the worst of this earth did to innocent people. I post this here because Robbie Robertson is a wonderful man. His friend Eric Clapton well- whom is to say until the REAL truth comes out. When somsone steals something that is not a feud. That is a hate crime when a life is completely altered and CANNOT PLAY, WRITE AND SING THEIR MUSIC without being forced to be a robot that spews hatefulness, bias and NOT LOVE... ANd then becomes endangered. It is time that the people out there understnad they have been used, duped and abused. Once again, Robbir Robertson and all at Dreamworks are wonderful people and I stand by them. Let the music play--roll out.. As the GREAT President states: "let's roll"... And as Nassau County Executive Tom Suozzi also a wonderful man stated in his historic inaugeration: either you are with us or get out of our way...."Keepin' it real" staves off this horrific terrorism that we cannot escape from if we do not BAND together and do something about. Lauren


Posted on Wed Feb 6 01:13:02 CET 2002 from dial2a-202.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.202)

Hi

As far as the Last Waltz DVD of course it will be available for rental at ye olde video store....I'll rent it.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 01:00:03 CET 2002 from dm125.davidson-marketing.com (209.224.210.254)

Tim Kocher

From: Chicago

Hi, just coming out of lurk mode for my two cents. I've trawled through a lot of the recent comments on the TLW DVD, and am amazed by the amount of personal baggage people have with the Band's music. I haven't read the behind-the-scenes books and what-not, and am really not much interested - what matters to me is the music, and the chance to see one of my very favorite bands on a historic night, directed by the best American director of the last thirty years. Robbie's side or Levon's side, we weren't there, and if we were it doesn't matter - what happened was between them. I just don't see the appeal of obsessing over the rights and wrongs of the behavior of people I don't personally know. Maybe some of the members of this guestbook were involved in the events then, I don't know, but if so they're entitled to speak their peace, I guess. This 'feud' thing, it happened between other people. I have my own problems, I don't need to live someone else's. When I think of the Band, I think of the pure joy and inspiration I feel when I hear the warmest, most human sound ever put on a disc. The rest seems surplus to requirements, if you ask me.

Just my two cents, and not meaning to disrespect anyone here. I just think that the music's what's important - I guess I'm not as into this as some of you, but I thought it needed saying.

Tim


Posted on Wed Feb 6 00:52:52 CET 2002 from dialup-65.57.8.214.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.57.8.214)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

BTW, I forgot to add that I hope everyone visits the Modern Drummer poll page and votes for Levon. He certainly deserves our support and efforts, if only to wise up other drummers.

Theresa, why don't you buy the DVD and ignore any RR commentary?


Posted on Wed Feb 6 00:45:58 CET 2002 from dialup-65.57.8.214.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.57.8.214)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Actually, there were a number of Band performances that made it into the listening community that were pretty poor. Levon himself has castigated his own performance on the famous Rubber Dubber Hollywood Bowl boot--he explains it as an unfortunate dosing before the show--and most collectors point to the first Roosevelt Stadium as less than stellar. Watkins Glen is also in there somewhere. The Palladium, SNL, Winterland, Pittsburg (71) and Royal Albert Rags all contain incredible performances, just in case I sound like a grouch. TLW has some good Band performances and some bad Band performances, and the guest shots are equally up and down.

The whole "shares" business is something that has never been detailed in print; it is very much a Band urban legend, very much an oral tradition. Unless one of the principals decides to document at least his side of the story, it can only remain as such (odd, RR's "In The Blood" just came on WXRT here in Chicago). BTW, any detailing would hardly serve as an ultimate answer; rather it would open up a can of worms of epic proportion.

I've yet to see a list of add-ons to the LW movie DVD release, but Peter is correct in the cornucopia that's coming with the CD/DVD release. Let's hope the movie DVD is equally majesterial.


Posted on Wed Feb 6 00:18:42 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa

From: NY, NY

Hello all. Peter, I think you are correct in saying that people should own the DVD. However, I am reluctant to hear RR's side of the story, because I think I can safely assume what it will be. Given his track record, his words are always washed up...a mask of the truth. Anything to make him look like a hero. And while he is an extraordinary musician, of the calibur most have never seen, his interpersonal skills could use some finetuning. I would much rather the DVD include pieces from all aspects of the puzzle. Don't you think??


Posted on Tue Feb 5 23:49:59 CET 2002 from du-tele3-012.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.12)

Peter Viney

You need TLW on DVD, because at least three mail order houses are using the title "The Complete Last Waltz" (just like the bootleg) and it's 3CDs not 2CDs, or 5LPs not 3 LPs, which means there's up to 50% more material. Drag through the back discussions. Joni's other two numbers were awful. But you'll presumably get more Rick, more Richard, more Muddy, more Neil (Young I hasten to add), more Eric. You'll probably get Bobby Charles at last. You'll get Robbie's view as commentary - we all seem to subscribe to Levon's view without hearing the other side.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 23:30:20 CET 2002 from (62.30.0.2)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Not for one minute wishing to trivialise this whole Last Waltz dvd debate which I sense is causing an ever so feint polarisation on this most wonderful Band community I am endeavouring to become a part of; nor harbouring even the remotest desire to swell any further the wondrous Robbie's ever burgeoning coffers. However, I do have to inform you dear folks that I have just heard it on good authority that this dvd is indeed the very one where we finally get to see Van the Man splitting his kecks right down the crotch as he hits that G-spot on 'Caravan'!!

Now not wishing to engender any unrest on here but it might well be worth a few dollars more of anyones money, you know, just to see that hideous bloody suit finally getting its comeuppance. Literally!!!

Of course the really big question is how did that rascal Martin Scorsese edit it out of the original without even old Ivan himself noticing. Spooky, yeah?

Anyroad, I'm off to Virgin megastore as we speak to check it out...la la la la la la la la...wellie..ooh er missus :-)


Posted on Tue Feb 5 22:58:09 CET 2002 from spider-tl084.proxy.aol.com (152.163.207.214)

Calvin

Im not sure about this Nick, and I cant remember for the life of me where I read this-but I have a dim memory that RR bought Garth and Ricks 1/5 of the Band rights some time in the 80s. By which I mean he came to them, offered them a certain amount of money for their rights, and they accepted it. If that is true, and if someone can back me up or disprove me please speak up, then I'm guessing Robbie, Levon and Richard's family are getting money and the other's wouldnt-kind of a shame but then nobody told them they had to sell either. But then also, considering the amount of people involved with TLW, and the relative popularity of the Band (being much less than it should be) I dont really see it producing big royalty checks. Nor can I believe the remastered albums did either, they werent exactly big sellers-the American Public needed the NSync and Korn fixes I guess.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 22:57:35 CET 2002 from web-cache.bergen.org (168.229.4.3)

Sim

From: N

Hey, this is my first time signing the Guest Book. I'm just curious if anyone knows how I contact Levon Helm and/or Garth Hudson. thanks.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 22:47:29 CET 2002 from dial2a-53.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.53)

Hi

Peter's comments are largely true about TLW. But I saw it in the theater and I have the VHS tape so what do I need the DVD for?....


Posted on Tue Feb 5 22:26:51 CET 2002 from (62.30.0.2)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Humble thanks to all for your warm welcome and most kind words. Awe Shucks, Lil yer a diamond gerl.

This best drummer thing. Criminal methinks.

Surely there can only ever be one man at the helm. Levon forgive them for they know not what they do.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 21:57:15 CET 2002 from du-tele3-048.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.48)

Peter Viney

Was The Last Waltz the best the Band played? Probably not. The Paladium NYC on 18 September (as Pat B. has often said) is better on tape. Was it the best they were recorded AND filmed by one of the leading 20th century directors? Without question. They may well have performed better other nights without cameras, but way back then you couldn't film every gig. It stands up superbly … and … sorry … Levon looks as if he was enjoying himself thoroughly on the night. Listening to CLW, Richard was sadly out of it on the big one. But if you don't buy the DVD, you'll really be missing out (and not just on the best rock guitarist and composer, but on all of them).


Posted on Tue Feb 5 21:23:26 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

If nothing else, The Last Waltz serves to help preserve and to perpetuate the memories of four extremely talented individuals, Richard Manuel, Rick Danko, Muddy Waters and Paul Butterfield.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 21:20:51 CET 2002 from dial2a-153.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.153)

Hi

I meant the DVD Last Waltz as a rip off to all the Band members not being compensated for it ..and ps: I really don't care about any so called feud.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 20:59:02 CET 2002 from (205.245.52.66)

carmen

From: pa

The way I see it, if TLW gets into the hands of new viewers, they might see the part where Rick Danko presents Sip The Wine and say I need to get more of this guy and then go out and purchase some of Rick's solo work.

Also if the new release has some of the song written or co written by Richard, then he should benefit from new royalties.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 20:47:56 CET 2002 from wcs2-pent-2.nipr.mil (206.38.114.100)

Nick

From: Virginia

If Garth, Levon, Rick's family and Richard's family (and even John Simon)don't see any royalties from the DVD release, then it probably feels like a rip-off to them. I don't know this to be the case but I have a feeling it probably is. Does anyone know for sure? If they do profit along with RR then it would sure go a long way in making me rethink my opinion of RR. If they don't than it only confirms my present opinion of him which is not, shall I say, positive.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 20:41:03 CET 2002 from (12.33.126.141)

John W.

From: NYC

Mike - It has to do with Levon and his resentments toward Robbie, I guess. I remember once I was talking to Levon, before I ever knew about any "feud", and as a long time fan, telling him how much I loved his records, live shows, etc., he was very happy to hear this. Then I mentioned how much I liked the Last Waltz, his smile turned into a frown. He told me it was the Band's worst performance, that I should not even play it, and I should play their records or other live performances because TLW sucked. I could not fathom this because I always loved that movie and record! It was only later, I realized he was angry at Robbie for so many things we have heard over the years -- he had not thought the Band should stop touring, he thought Robbie was too tight with the "Hollywood" film makers and business types, Robbie took all the writing credits, Robbie was mean to Muddy Waters and brought in Neil Diamond, etc. etc. etc... So if you ever meet Levon, probably better not to mention that movie!


Posted on Tue Feb 5 20:38:53 CET 2002 from spider-te024.proxy.aol.com (152.163.195.184)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA

I've sent many of you an email with the link to Modern Drummer's Hall of Fame ballot. My apologies to anyone I missed or to those of you who may have received multiple emails.

Jan has also provided the link in the "What's New" section here on the site. Please vote and please pass the link on to friends via email.

If there is a Drummer's Hall of Fame then Levon Helm clearly should be there.

We don't get many opportunities to see Band members honored for the musicianship we admire. Let's make this happen for Levon and everyone who loves The Band and the Barn Burners.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 19:18:50 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Rick Danko covered Buddy Holly's "Raining In My Heart" on tour with Ringo Starr and that version can be heard on the "Ringo Starr & His All-Starr Band" album.

The latter day Band also covered Mr. Holly's "Not Fade Away" with Levon on lead vocals and Rick doing harmony. That version, which also features the surviving Crickets, bassist Joe Mauldin and drummer Jerry Allison, was included on the various artists Holly tribute album "Not Fade Away".

For those interest in hearing some of Stan Szelest's and Tim Drummond's work with Lonnie Mack, I heartily recommend the 1985 Alligator release, "Strike Like Lightning". This album also features Stevie Ray Vaughan!


Posted on Tue Feb 5 19:13:52 CET 2002 from dialin-1739-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.7.215)

Gene

Never mind, Pat B. (I managed to spell cardiffrose wrong).


Posted on Tue Feb 5 18:23:20 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.109)

JennyT

From: Ohio

Bayou Sam: I have wondered the same about Buddy Holly. I read in the liner notes to the remastered Moondog Matinee that the Band considered doing a Holly song, and I can't help but wish they had tackled Rave On. It is nothing lyrics-wise, but I used to know a band called the Afflicted that kicked it up a few hundred notches and it sounded GOOD.

And speaking of "record store guys," I will never forget buying the Basement Tapes in '83 because the kid (and he really was a kid) who worked the register handed it to me saying "greatest band ever, I know, I know" in the most blase, matter of fact way that I laughed.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 18:07:37 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.109)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

Bill: Well my ignorance is probably going to show here, because I have never heard of Tony Kosinec. I often feel like everyone on the GB is like the record store guys in High Fidelity and I am the untutored girlfriend. The song I mentioned was on The Lonesome Picker Rides Again which was an early 70s album by John Stewart, a former member of the Kingston Trio. I am pretty sure he wrote all his own material. It was a slow song about how "everybody needs a fire inside, everybody needs a dream to ride, everybody something something something, everybody needs a stone to roll. Of course it's easy to get too many stones to roll! Does that sound like the song you know?


Posted on Tue Feb 5 18:03:02 CET 2002 from du186-1.ppp.algonet.se (195.100.1.186)

Ilkka

From: Nordic Countries
Web page

I have enjoyed ALAN EDGE's reminiscences. On the behalf of the male menopause community and the old-timers I'd like to wish you welcome to Mr. Høiberg's guestbook - the best in the Internet. Please sit down by this virtuel campfire and feel yourself comfortable!

To DIAMOND LIL about The Last Waltz DVD:
"Let's stick together, c'mon c'mon babe let's stick together :-)"


Posted on Tue Feb 5 17:18:04 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Mingus mentioned Tracy Nelson & Mother Earth's fine version of "I Want To Lay Down Beside You". This version, credited to Tim Drummond, was released several years before Rick Danko previewed "Sip The Wine" from his then upcoming solo album in The Last Waltz.

As I mentioned here previously, Joe Simon recorded a version of "To Lay Down Beside You" a year or two before Ms. Nelson's 1972 version. It was included on Mr. Simon's album "The Sounds of Simon" and also attributed the song to Tim Drummond. Joe Simon, like Ray Charles, is a soulful singer who added a portion of country grits to his red-eyed gravy mix of R&B. "The Sounds of Simon" was recorded in Nashville and his version of "To Lay Down Beside You" is highlighted by a lush arrangement of strings & flute.

As a sideman, bassist Tim Drummond's credits incorporate a lengthy who's who list of artists far too numerous to mention here. It is interesting to note, however, that he's worked with James Brown, Bob Dylan, Ronnie Hawkins, J.J. Cale and Neil Young. As noted before, he actually played on Rick Danko's first solo album, and he's also worked with Tracy Nelson. For many years, during the '80s, he was a member of Lonnie Mack's back-up group along with the late great Stan Szelest.

Even though Joe Simon and Tracy Nelson performed great versions of the song, I personally think Rick Danko made "Sip The Wine" his signature with his own amazingly distinctive performance. I've even made a CD-R with all three versions back-to-back, and Rick's is the one that still blows me away. I don't care who wrote it, when I hear that song, I can't help but think of Rick.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 17:02:19 CET 2002 from spider-tf031.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.186)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA

Thank you Jan for linking the Modern Drummer Hall of Fame balloting in the "What's New" section.

I encourage ALL GBers to cast their vote for Levon Helm as he is surely deserving of this honor.

Please click on "What's New" and then "web poll" in the first paragraph. Let's make this happen.

P.S. It appears that the poll will only accept one vote per IP address so it might be a good idea to email this link to some friends!! Thanks everyone.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 16:58:28 CET 2002 from sid16.revealed.net (208.23.178.159)

Mike

From: Strawberry Flats

How is The Last Waltz on DVD a ripoff? Maybe if it had no bonus featues and the sound and picture quality were poor. I hope it'll be worth getting the DVD. I'm curious as to why HI and Lil think it's a ripoff. Just curious, that's all.

Mike


Posted on Tue Feb 5 16:37:43 CET 2002 from dialin-1745-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.7.221)

Gene

I'm still trying to figure out what 'too nesh', in the context of 'ice fishin', could possibly mean??? (any help would be greatly appreciated! I find Alan's posts a breath of fresh air, as well (don't understand half of it, but it sounds great) KEEP 'EM COMING!

Can't find that website that had 'Old Brown Boots', anymore. Does anybody have the link? Pat B.?


Posted on Tue Feb 5 14:49:24 CET 2002 from host-65-164-8-8.co.erie.ny.us (65.164.8.8)

G-MAN

Wow,,great to see the posts re. people gettin to see Levon and the Barnburners! Wish I could have made it, but the weather doesn't always co-operate!!!! Hey,,,don't forget the GURUS are doing a bunch of shows!! Hope to see some of you there!!!


Posted on Tue Feb 5 12:08:56 CET 2002 from dial2a-186.i2eyenet.com (64.80.2.186)

Hi

Can we surmise from Lil's post that Levon's calling The Last Waltz, the last rip off still holds true for the DVD? I guess it was obvious....I'll pass too..


Posted on Tue Feb 5 11:56:47 CET 2002 from (64.80.240.3)

Diamond Lil

Alan Edge: I _love_ the way you write! Your posts have been refreshing and very pleasant to read the past few days. Welcome!

Did anyone from here make it to the Towne Crier on Sunday for the Dave Van Ronk benefit? I had to work.. but would like to see a post of how it went if anyone was there.

I'm pretty disguted about the release of TLW on dvd and am planning to stick with my old, dependable video. Have no interest in helping the rich get richer...

Have a good day everyone. Hug Jan.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 06:04:26 CET 2002 from 12-249-69-3.client.attbi.com (12.249.69.3)

Chris

From: Chicago

Hey Folks:

Just thought I'd say hello. Would love to see The Barnburners come through Chicago. Of course with special guest Garth Hudson.

Hey Butch,

Hope things are good with you.

Maybe the folks that were at the Barnburners' show at Buddy Guy's Legends will lobby with me to have the band play there one more time before Buddy closes it. Better yet how about a three night stand!

Any news on where I can get a snazzy Barnburners t-shirt?


Posted on Tue Feb 5 02:27:01 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa

From: NY, NY

Hey Bill, do you have the info. for the BB's on the 23. There is no contact or website info. If you have directions, that would be all the better. Cheers.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 02:23:16 CET 2002 from cache-bas-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.224.1)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

THE BAND AND SPLENDID ISOLATION

All this reflection on what we all know was simply the ultimate of all groups is wheedling out little snatches from the memory banks of just how totally insular was my devotion to them yet just how hard I really did try to spread the word.

Incidentally, it might help with these reminiscences if our more - shall we say - 'fortunate' American friends could appreciate the background to any singular Band devotion within the UK back in the sixties. Just how desolate it really was in those early days. I mean us Brits could not simply hop in Bruce Springsteen's Cadillac and whizz up to the Catskills at the drop of a hat to watch Garth preening his mighty organ, you know. No sirree!

THE WATERLOO CONNECTION

Basically as far as I'm aware only one national British dj - Waterloo's own Kenny Everett [yes that spooky old Waterloo coincidence again] ever featured the Band.

Other than that - Zilch.

"Rockin Chair" and "When you Awake" were the two songs played on Kenny's show one momentous Saturday morning as I lay soaking in the bath.

'Christ, The Band on the radio!!!!'

I was overcome with the sheer exhilaration of the occasion. I splashed about like some demented frog. I went bonkers and completely lost it. Certainly the last I remember of that rubber duck was it flying south searching out calmer waters.

Old Virginny perhaps?

SEVENTEEN AND IN LOVE?

I recall my first really serious relationship. The sheer physical and emotional intensity. All that fevered moaning and groaning. No not what you're thinking. Merely her reaction as I'd take Big Pink out of its sleeve and stick it on the dansette for the umpteenth time that particular night. She was into Tom Jones at the time and could never really handle my unbridled enthusiasm for what she termed hillbillies.

Seem to remember we were once kissing and petting so passionately as the strains of Richard crooning - "...life seems so little to give" - wafted across from the dansette. Needless to say I broke off to ponder what Richard meant. She went home. Maybe, on reflection that's what Richard did mean.

THE VICTORIA HOTEL, WATERLOO

In the ale house 1969. 'The Vic' where I'd heard the boys for the very first time. Jukey bust. Groans from the patrons. Bright idea. Dash home and get me trusty dansette replete with both albums. All of a quivvvver as the anticipation of capturing an entire pubful of potential Band converts zings thro my system. Yiss!! Too good to be true. I'm like some manic Jesuit encountering a tribe of mad headhunters. Missionary zeal I think they term it. Mission Impossible more like.

Ever wondered what's the quickest way to empty a Liverpool pub at nine at night?

Stick on 'Tears of Rage' at full blast and, man, just watch those headhunters disappear like they've just spotted 'Predator'.

"Er, we'll, er see yer tomorra night Al lad"

"But fellas, what about Kingdom Come?"

"Another friggin dirge like that last one and you'll be entering it tonight pal!"

Maybe I should have started with something a little lighter. Chest Fever, perhaps?

ME AND KATHERINE ROSS

That same year. Dudley College in Brum. Doing me Dustin Hoffman Graduate bit with the nearest I was ever to get to Katherine Ross. The lovely Marian from Consett County Durham.

She had ditched me by letter that day and come hell or high water I was going to woo her back. Train to Dudley. Stopped her in her tracks outside the College. Into the Student's Union. It was going well. She was warming to my heartfelt pleas; seeking reassurances -

"...and you promise - no more of that blessed Band stuff?"

Sharp intake of breath - fingers, toes and small intestines crossed - "Yeah, I promise" - the cock crows thrice [Thank God I never knew about Daniel and his Harp by then otherwise I might have disappeared without trace like a whippoorwill]

Just then, the juke box blares out .."When I get offa this mountAIN...".

Well, I'm up like a shot, arent I? Across to the jukey to embrace the guy who's just put it on. It was a beautiful communion. I mean, what else can a fella do in such circumstances? I guess desperation and isolation make you that way. So that was it. Bye bye Miss Katherine Ross. Up Cripple Creek without a paddle!

"I'll try and intercept you at the church, Marian. Promise!"


Posted on Tue Feb 5 02:17:09 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tg013.proxy.aol.com (64.12.102.153)

Ben Pike

From: Cleveland Tx

The definitive version of Loyd Price's "Pesonality" is done by jazz great Annie Ross, in the movie "Basket Case II." I know those who have seen it will back me up.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 01:33:42 CET 2002 from dialin-3-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.1.3)

Bill S

From: Cold Spring N. Y.I

It's great to see that so many enjoyed the Barn Burner Show Sat. night at the Turning Point! How could you not? Levon with his band always goes all out and puts on a great show. Just when you think it can't get any better Levon brings along Jimmy Vivino (Conan O'brien show) who adds a whole new dimention to the show. I heard the second set had horns! All this in a room that isn't much bigger than our living room! For us it dosen't get any better. Can't wait for the next B.B. show 2/23 at Bodles!


Posted on Tue Feb 5 00:22:49 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

Oh yes, the pianist in Frank Motley and the Motley Crew, Curley Bridges, is still around and was up against Richard Bell and Michael Fonfara for the best keyboard award that John Donabie gave out at the Maple Blues Awards last week. Curley, who drove down from Barrie for the event, "lost" to Richard Bell.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 00:19:29 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

Way to go MattK! "Sticks and Stones" was also the b-side of "Any Other Way", the biggest hit by Ronnie Hawkins and the Hawks' Yonge Street rivals, Frank Motley and the Motley Crew featuring Jackie Shane. Got to #2 in Toronto in '63 - on the Sue label.


Posted on Tue Feb 5 00:03:15 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-71.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.71)

MattK

Little Willie John indeed had the biggest splash with "All Around the World." It's interesting, though, how many people think it's a Little Milton song, even amongst blues musicians I know. Most see it as being penned by Little Willie John, only a handful seem to know it as a Titus Turner song. To be honest, I always thought it was Willie's song too until I stumbled across the original on Napster one day, and it peeled my ears back.

Titus' version is markedly different than Willie's or Milton's, swinging harder in a cross between jump-blues and early Fats Domino style than the two better-selling covers. To my taste, I really love this version best, and while a lot of Titus' stuff doesn't measure up to this cut, I've found digging up his recordings an education. The guy has an unbelievably powerful voice, especially when he forgoes the niceties of trying to score a pop hit and sticks to blues. If you have the Atlantic Records Blues box set (or the single volume dedicated to blues vocalists), check out his live version of "Baby Girl Parts 1 & 2"

Interestingly, Titus Turner's later co-wrote "Leave My Kitten Alone" with Little Willie John, and the latter scored a hit yet again with the help of Turner (The Beatles and Elvis Costello both later recorded it). It's interesting to note that Little Willie's 1950s singles were produced at King records by none other than Henry Glover, who we all know produced Ronnie Hawkins and The Hawks' sides at Roulette, and later Levon and the Hawks at Ware, and later as a close friend and collaborator with Levon after TLW until Henry's death in the early 1990s.

As for Titus, he wrote songs such as "Sticks and Stones (co-credited with Glover), which was a huge hit for Ray Charles (who also recorded Turner's "Get on the Right Track") and later covered just about everyone from J Geils to Joe Cocker to Manfred Mann. Elvis Presley also covered Titus' "Tell Me Why" with some success. I'm starting to think Titus Turner is one of those guys everyone knows, but no one has heard of.

As far as his own recording career, Titus didn't really score any hits until the late 1950s. Funny how the brain works - I misplace Lloyd Price in a Titus Turner case, and it seems Titus made a cottage industry out of medium hits that were answers to Prices' bigger numbers, most notably "Stag-O-Lee" (a sequel to Price's "Stagger Lee") and "We Told You Not to Marry" (a response to Prices' "I'm Gonna Get Married"). AMG points out this is due to similairities in Turner's and Price's voices, which I guess must be true, but to my ear, Price has a much higher voice whereas Turner's voice just seems to boom.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 23:46:23 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa

From: NY, NY

Right on Ray!! Levon was just smokin. You could tell he was eminating the beats from his soul. You get so caught up in it. I was talking with the singer after the show and he said they are putting an album out in a couple of months. It of course is not the sound of the Band in any way shape or form...but I think Levon has clearly gone back to his roots of the 40's and 50's blues rockabilly sentiment. In short, it is a good 'ole time, makes you feel like you are home. I can't wait to see what Garth puts out at the Bottom Line on the 22nd. Happy Trails.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 23:13:21 CET 2002 from adsl-82-225-14.msy.bellsouth.net (65.82.225.14)

Becky Toutges

From: New Orleans, LA


Posted on Mon Feb 4 23:02:07 CET 2002 from 1cust159.tnt30.nyc3.da.uu.net (67.193.78.159)

Crabgrass

From: The Front Lawn

I also happened to hear that H&R Block commercial using "Taxman" a few weeks back. I think George was lucky that he wasn't sued since the "Taxman" part is a blatant rip-off of the "Batman" theme from the US TV series. I mentioned a while back that I respected McCartney's comments about not having written his songs to sell cornflakes or something to that effect and subsequently heard the song "It's So Easy" used in a Zip Lock plastic bag commercial - part of the Buddy Holly Song Catalog owned by Paul. However, I believe that McCartney passes all royalties received for Buddy's songs to his widow Maria Elena which may absolve him somewhat for this offense.

Speaking of commercials that Nissan commercial now using the "best I ever had" sound bite from the Who's "Bargain" is really getting on my nerves - and I watch very little TV. Thankfully, it's not the original Who track that's being used.

And while we're on the subject, I've been playing the re-mastered Stage Fright album a lot lately and cringe every time the last track comes on (that dumb radio commercial for the album) which was a REAL MISTAKE to include. Did RR do it for extra royalties possibly? It really grates on my nerves!!


Posted on Mon Feb 4 21:02:01 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

Re "Fever", I believe I read once - maybe in Dave Marsh's top 1000 - that while Peggy Lee had the chart 'hit', Little Willie John's actually sold more copies over all. Which would certainly tend to restore one's faith in humanity - or at least its taste. Anyway, "Fever" runs into Cream's "Spoonful" whenever I try to hum it in my mind.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 20:48:42 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

In "Somewhere Down The Crazy River", Robbie Robertson sang about listening to Little Willie John -- "that's when time stood still". Little Willie John, who was born in Arkansas, was a very influential artist in the late '50s and early '60s. Many of his songs became standards for groups specializing in R&B and soul music.

Although Peggy Lee's cover of "Fever" became a big hit, the original version was previously recorded by Little Willie John. Some say he co-wrote that song, but the authorship is matter of controversy. Other Little Willie John songs that became part of the repertoire of bar bands of that era included "Need You Love So Bad" and "Talk To Me, Talk To Me".

Little Willie John was known as an electrifying performer, but unfortunately, offstage, his wildness and unstability caught up with him. He was found guilty of manslaughter in 1966, after allegedly killing a man in a knife fight. He died in prison a few years later.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 20:40:03 CET 2002 from cache-udd.cableinet.co.uk (194.117.151.68)

Alan edge

From: Liverpool

A further observation on Arcadian driftwood lyrics - I've always sung "Fifteen under zero when the baby came to breath" - maybe it's cos I was up to me eyes in nappies at the time it came out! Never went out ice fishin tho - too nesh.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 20:39:44 CET 2002 from 0-1pool204-109.nas29.somerville1.ma.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.204.109)

Ray

From: NY

I agree with Teresa, Levon and the Barn Burners put on a great show at the Turning Point last Saturday! I'm a longtime Band fan but never had the pleasure of seeing them play live. I did see Rick at the Bottom Line in the Mid 90's, Jim Weider a few months back, and now Levon. The BB's really put on a great show but the best part for me was the fact that Levon looked like he was having fun! I was most impressed with his Ragged But Rightoues Drumming because it's subtle, it grooves, and it is dynamic! Any musician, regardless of what instrument you play, should go to see the Barn Burners and pay attention to Levons drumming if you want a lesson on the value of dynamics in music.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 20:25:43 CET 2002 from stargate-41-87.salzburg-online.at (213.153.41.87)

Luke W.

Web page

I was just browsing the Van Morrison webpage and found an article from a 1972 Rolling Stone magazine. In the article Rick Danko is mentioned performing on rythm guitar on a Van gig as a guest. Also John Lee Hooker, Bobby Neuwirth and Jack Elliott played there. Does anyone have more informations on this and is there a tape of this concert?

Luke

...click on the link for the article...


Posted on Mon Feb 4 19:11:18 CET 2002 from t2o913p55.telia.com (195.252.44.175)

The Shepherd

From: Norberg, Sweden
Web page

Hi! I came here by accident. Very nice site indeed. OUT NOW !!! THE SHEPHERDS BUSH ENJOYMENTS NEW CD - STEREOACTIVITY - OUT NOW !!! - Retro Rock with psychedelia and progressive inputs - Please visit the official website for more info and mp3’s and maybe drop a line in our guestbook. http://w1.223.telia.com/~u22306043/


Posted on Mon Feb 4 17:24:20 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

MattK: Little Willie John, who we talked about last week, also had a hit with "All Around The World". It's on his wonderful "Free At Last" comp. Also, I'm sure you're right about "Lawdy Miss Clawdy" being in the Hawks' repertoire. It's certainly in Ronnie Hawkins's repertoire, so maybe Ronnie sang it with the Hawks rather than Richard.

Speaking of Lloyd Price, his "Personality" is often used by Eugene Smith (Jay Smith when he was with the Hawks) as his show-closer. The song was also recorded in the '60s by Little Caesar and the Consuls, and may have been in that group's set list when Robbie Robertson was a member years before.

And, speaking of Port Dover, as MattK did, I picked up the first CD by Junkhouse at the local Goodwill over the weekend. It contains a song titled "Chunk (Port Dover)", and talks about drinking on the beach and seeing a rock band there (though the group mentioned was a latter-day set of Hawks, aka Crowbar). The CD was produced by Daniel Lanois' understudy and brother-in-law, Malcolm Burn. The lead Junkhouser, Tom Wilson, is also one of Colin Linden's partners in Blackie and the Rodeo Kings.

I also picked up the Mercury Rev CD at the same Goodwill. It can't be a coincidence that the two best cuts are the ones with Levon ("Opus 40") and Garth ("Hudson Line").


Posted on Mon Feb 4 16:56:19 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa

From: NY

Oh, thanks to those who put me in touch with Across the Great Divide. It is most appreciated. Happy Trails!!


Posted on Mon Feb 4 16:54:31 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa

From: NY

Wahoo...did anyone catch the Barn Burners this past Sat.? One of the better shows I have been to in a while...and what a quaint little joint. I was in the back and only twenty feet away. What a thrill!


Posted on Mon Feb 4 16:41:44 CET 2002 from spider-wf042.proxy.aol.com (205.188.195.164)

franko

From: boston

Holy Cow, Patriots by 3!


Posted on Mon Feb 4 16:19:18 CET 2002 from spider-tp064.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.204)

bob wigo

From: havertown, pa USA
Web page

Hello all. Although I haven't posted much of late I am trying to keep up with the GB. As always the content is educational and entertaining. Thanks to everyone who takes the time to share their knowledge and opinions.

Over the course of this past weekend I enjoyed the company of old friends at a lovely mountain retreat in northeast Pennsylvania. Among them was an old and dear friend who is unquestionably among the finest guitarists I have ever had the privilege of hearing perform. He is classically trained and an absolute monster on the classical guitar but can just as easily knock you over with practically anything he chooses to tackle. His blues playing is as soulful and heartfelt as any you will ever hear. In addition he is a wonderful saxophonist and above all of this a terrific human being. We shared some wonderful conversation and as you might expect, music was the topic of choice most of the time.

We listened to so many songs over the weekend and discussed so many aspects of those songs and the artists responsible. I'll spare you all the detail but I did want to mention one disc that really struck me and I am certain that those here who don't know of it would surely enjoy it. I have always enjoyed the voice of Dusty Springfield but really only knew of the obvious hits. We listened to "Dusty in Memphis" and I can only say that it will certainly become an important addition to my collection very soon. I can not recommend it highly enough. She is positively amazing in her interpretations and the studio performances are absolutely top notch. I do believe that those of you who seek this one out will be very happy you did. Enjoy !

There is another and, in my mind, very important reason for my post today. While perusing the March 2002 edition of Modern Drummer magazine I came across a reader's poll for nominations to their Drummer's Hall of Fame. The current members were listed and I was more than a little disappointed with the omission of Levon Helm. The good news is we can do something about it with very little effort. The poll is offered on Modern Drummer's website which I have posted above. I would ask all who admire and respect the phenomenal body of work that Levon has given us to visit the site and cast your vote. He clearly deserves the honor and our efforts. Thanks in advance to everyone for your help.

P.S. Jan, would it be possible to provide a link right from the GuestBook to the poll for the duration of the voting. My post will soon be relegated to the Archives and many visitors here will not know of my endeavor. As always your help and hard work are truly appreciated.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 16:10:57 CET 2002 from cmldme-cmt1-24-198-96-71.maine.rr.com (24.198.96.71)

MattK

Peter and David mentioning Little Milton got me thinking last night about Titus Turner, who wrote "All Around the World," which Milton scored some success with under the title "Grits Ain't Groceries." And I thought, "I need to burn a new r/b compilation (new CD burner for Xmas), and put some Titus on it."

This led to a Ritalin moment as I keep all my old blues and R/B stuff cataloged seperately (everything else is mixed together, alphabetically). Somehow, the Titus Turner CD I'm looking for ended up getting put in a Lloyd Price jewel case. Which made me think, "wow, I need to put 'Lawdy Miss Clawdy' on this CD. So, forgetting all about Titus, I put on "Lawdy Miss Clawdy" for a quick listen, and then I play it again, and again. I probably played it six or seven times before I noticed my wife had that "one more, and I'm going to run out of the house screaming" looks.

Anyway, the reason I bring this up (beyond the fact I found it kind of funny), is I'm wondering if The Hawks (with or without Ronnie) had "Lawdy Miss Clawdy" on their set list, and if so, who sang it? The reason I listened to it so many times was I was bowled over what a natural tune this would have been for Richard's voice. Any of the old Yonge Street crowd have any recollection? It's not on Port Dover, but it seems like a natural fit.

Meanderingly yours,

MattK


Posted on Mon Feb 4 15:29:55 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

Jenny: You mentioned "Little Road and a Stone to Roll". Please elaborate. I know the phrase as the title of a terrific Tony Kosinec single, the follow-up to "All Things Come From God", but I can't imagine that you'd know that obscure slice of vinyl. (Harvey Brooks was on Tony's first LP, I just remembered, so there's something of a Band connection.)


Posted on Mon Feb 4 15:18:00 CET 2002 from m124-133.on.tac.net (209.202.124.133)

Bill

David and Peter: I think it's also fair to say that the Band read little Milton.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 14:16:42 CET 2002 from (209.236.161.34)

Mike

From: Clinton,NJ

Levon will be featured on a up and coming cd called "Jersey Jams/Jersey Cares". This is a tribute cd for the families of the 9/11 victims. He is playing with the Great Local band from Clinton,NJ called the MATT ANGUS THING. Check it out! www.jerseyjams.org


Posted on Mon Feb 4 06:01:43 CET 2002 from spider-ta062.proxy.aol.com (152.163.205.72)

Stephen Novik

From: Edmonton Alberta Canada

Hello everybody! Elliot Landy's photo exhibtion "SPIRIT OF A GENERATION: Dylan, The Band and Woodstock" is now on here in Edmonton at our fine Provincial Museum - to sum up quickly, wow! However I hope this doesn't mean that it's all ancient history... (For more details-- www.pma.edmonton.ab.ca) Ta!


Posted on Mon Feb 4 04:56:30 CET 2002 from spider-wb012.proxy.aol.com (205.188.192.152)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

I just saw a commercial on TV (no, Robbie wasn't in it) for the H&R Tax people, and they had the song "Taxman" playing on it. It wasn't The Beatles original, but it was the song. I bet George is spinning - wherever he is.

I blew off the Levon show last night. I just couldn't see going all the way there and ending up MAYBE getting SRO tickets and not being near the music. I would be disappointed if that were the case. I'll catch the next gig, and I'll make reservations. Let that be a lesson to me.

Hey - yesterday was "the day the music died". I have often wondered what music would have come from Buddy Holly had he lived. Great stuff I suspect.


Posted on Mon Feb 4 01:54:28 CET 2002 from 210-55-236-20.static-dialup.xtra.co.nz (210.55.236.20)

Rod

From: NZ
Web page

My old video broke down over Christmas so I bought a new one which can play NTSC format tapes - which meant i could finally buy Robbies's Going Home video. Despite some pretentous moments from it's subject it's pretty good and at least it proves that the fly didn't die during the filming of TLW. One question though, what happened to Robbies teeth?


Posted on Sun Feb 3 21:06:39 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-002ilurbap266.dialsprint.net (158.252.112.196)

Susan

Enjoy your exploration, Alan. When I first discovered this site I pulled a couple of all-nighters reading as much as I could.

Your hearing of the lyric in "We Can Talk" as 'Don't give up, we've fought this far' is just about what I think the whole song is about. I don't see that the Father Clock line changes much. I read that as time, time that heals. time that allows growth and fruition, time that gives perspective.

I can also see a bit of irony in that song, given what would happen to the Band, in "We've been holding something underneath our tongues". Some good clear talk about goals, motivation, money, and personal behavior might have made a difference, and given us more music.

For those looking for Across the Great Divide: half.com usually has used copies for sale. That's also where I was able to pick up deleted Danko , Fjeld, Andersen cds, and the Bob and Van tribute cds that were no longer available. This only works in the US, however; half.com only sells within the US.


Posted on Sun Feb 3 20:31:12 CET 2002 from ip-63-121-116-238.new-castle.de.fcc.net (63.121.116.238)

bassmanlee

Web page

To Theresa or anyone else looking for Across the Great Divide. It is still available from BMG Music Service (above).



Posted on Sun Feb 3 18:59:52 CET 2002 from cache-bas-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.224.1)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool

Thanks for warm welcome Peter. I certainly will be back whenever time allows. I love the place.

Congratulations on what I feel are quite marvellous expositions on the songs. So far I've quickly skipped through "We Can Talk" and "Arcadian Driftwood" and I'm sure when I have a bit more time I'll return to them more scrupulously :-)

Its actually quite fascinating to see how my cocooned existence has produced lyrics I may - or may not? - have got right or wrong. Don't forget mine are almost as old as many of the boys own words however inaccurate my isolation may have rendered them. Both my kids - now in their twenties - trust my lyrics. How can I break it to them that their father has been misleading them all these years??? All those bedtime sing alongs.

The one that really surprised me was the "Father Clock" bit in "We can talk". I just can never get enough of that song. I find it is SO evocative of what the group are about.

To me the thing has always said "Don't give up we've fought this far". I always felt this was crucial to what Richard was trying to convey - ie that community thing [so pivotal also of course to The Band itself] whereby we all muck in or out together and we're with you all the way pal so lets tackle this problem together. Hmmm and to think after all these years I now may have to think again...

I have to be honest and say I was a trifle disappointed that nobody picked up on the irony of one of my fave Robbie lines - "set my compass North Ive got winter in my blood". Got to say I can scarcely say it - or write it for this first time - without the tears filling these little peepers and the nape of my neck rippling with the defiance that Robbie must have felt when he penned it. For me the entire song hinges on the that line's universal desperation and single-minded determination to return home. Maybe it's a Scouser thing and I'm identifying with some of that discrimination however paltry in comparison. I'm not sure.

Whatever - the irony of iced blood in veins invoking such warm and tender emotions I think is so beautiful and so stirring I just want to be there alongside the protaganist. On that basis alone Greil Marcus would seem to be way off beam on that one.

Speak again I hope.


Posted on Sun Feb 3 15:38:38 CET 2002 from du-tele3-085.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.85)

Peter Viney

Excellent post, Alan. Stick around - you'll be a very welcome regular here!


Posted on Sun Feb 3 13:56:11 CET 2002 from (62.30.0.2)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool UK

Forgot to express my sincere thanks to all those responsible for this unbelievable website. It is a pure joy for the likes of myself - SO out of touch.

It's a bit spooky too. Just looked at the map of where the Rick, Robbie, Richard and Garth come from and find that the district of Lpool where I first heard them and lived at the time is smack dab in the middle of their area - WATERLOO. Something tells me I really did find my spiritual home all those years ago.


Posted on Sun Feb 3 12:40:04 CET 2002 from (62.30.0.2)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool UK

Forgot to express my sincere thanks to all those responsible for this unbelievable website. It is a pure joy for the likes of myself - SO out of touch. It's spooky too. Just looked at the map of where the Rick, Robbie, Richard and Garth come from and find that the district of Lpool where I first heard them and lived at the time is smack dab in the middle of their area - WATERLOO. Something tells me I really did find my spiritual home all those years ago. I HAVE to get there.


Posted on Sun Feb 3 07:39:31 CET 2002 from (141.150.95.222)

Scott

Just arrived back from The Turning Point in Piermont New York. Levon & The Barn Burners were as good as it gets.....If you want to see a great blues band, go see these guys a.s.a.p....They played for about 2 hours, non-stop....My favorite song was the Muddy Waters tune "I'm Ready". Talk about talented musicians !!!!! Levon looked and played great !!!! I even got to shake his hand (what an honor)....Anyway, if you want to listen to a band that brings the blues to its emotional best, these are the guys for you.... My only complaint is they do not have any cd's released !!!!!!!


Posted on Sun Feb 3 05:06:29 CET 2002 from cache-bas-hsi.cableinet.co.uk (62.31.224.1)

Alan Edge

From: Liverpool, UK

WoW!

What I'd have given for this website back in '68.

For me actually to find other people who rate these fellas so highly is like landing in some sort of utopia. Sure I've previously come across guys who liked their stuff but never before have I been able to experience a sort of communion like this, knowing I'm in the company of fellow acolytes who rate them as the best ever.

Judging from what I've been reading on these pages these last five hours or so it would seem I've really been living in a sort of vacuum ever since I was first smitten - via the Victoria Pub juke box 34 years ago in Liverpool - by those matchless and indelible world-weary recollections of Levon and his trusty mates' straining undertakings to share that portentous load of his.

Oh the joy of splendid isolation!

I can vividly remember when The Last Waltz came out. I arrived at the Futurist near Lime Street bristling with the anticipation of connection with fellow disciples. I'd missed The Albert Hall in '71 thro chicken-pox - I've still got the faded cutting of the NME's ecstatic review of that night at which I still peer longingly every so often - so this was the first opportunity to see the boys in the flesh, albeit a celluloid version. I'd not been so excited since The Reds won the FA Cup for the first time in '65. God knows how I'd have coped with seeing the real thing.

Anyroad, the first night I watched it I was in awe. Give me that ole time religion it's good enough for me Rick lad. It was magical.

Yet something wasn't right. The sharp intakes of breath were infuriatingly reserved for other artists. The place was full of Neil Young afficionados. The next night His Bobness freaks. And so on.

"You fellas just don't get it do you?" I would sigh to myself, as they drooled over the 'makeweights' of the piece yet accorded what seemed like mere token recognition to the chief protaganists.

And now we know they didn't get it, don't we folks? Way off the pace, they were.

Of course, for those of us who'd been drawn in the whole hog with these boys, it could never be a question, simply, of 'mere' appreciation. Sure, their sublime musicianship and songs demanded that, at least, from anyone who possessed even the most rudimentary insight into decent popular music.

For us, however, The Band went far beyond any normal judgement criteria. A different set of rules applied to these fellas.

For a start, there was an indefinable 'something' that seemed to underpin their music and, at the same time, flow from it. Something different to anything else on offer. Possibly a haven of some sort or another from long ago. Certainly a place that promised us a connection and familiarity. Or comfort, perhaps? Others might promise to take you higher. Into orbit, perhaps. The point was there are times when it's simply nice to keep at least one foot on the ground. Maybe even return to your roots. To take the more rugged scenic routes guided by some trusty Americanadian country cousins to a place where there were decent folks who milked cows whilst sat on rockin chairs waiting for the next hoe down.

The Band, in short, were offering a sort of American Brigadoon to anyone who wanted it. Fact was, though, there weren't that many takers. Not at first. Not with the boys, themselves, anyroad. Oh sure, as the years went on there were many more who opted for the comfier passage once the railroads had laid down their more, shall we say, accessible tracks.

No matter. More fool them. They missed that chance of boarding the mystery train. For those of us who did board it back then or have climbed aboard it since and stayed with it till the end, it was a damn fine community we became part of. A genuine throwback to the good ole days when life was simpler, plainer, tougher; yet we were all that bit closer. Certainly it was one I always felt mighty honoured to be a part of. Still am, spiritually, however much physically I've been forced to pine away in my own UK vacuum.

Coming from the home of you know who I've always felt a bit guilty not having you know who as my all time musical heroes. I suppose it's a bit like a guy from Noo Jorsee forsaking Broooocie for Elvis Costello. Don't get me wrong. For me The Beatles are sacrosanct. They can do no wrong. I loved them.

The Band, however, are the Real McCoy. It's them I worship.


Posted on Sun Feb 3 03:21:57 CET 2002 from 0-1pool72-55.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.72.55)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Bayou Sam and JTull: I am curious about other "Country Boy" era recordings as well, and I'd also like to hear the 30 or so outtakes of sessions from the '90s that were never released. I know that those were recorded after Richard was gone, but I have heard some hissy third or fourth generation cassette copies of Levon singing a beautiful version of Bruce Hornsby's "Tide Will Rise" that makes me want to hear more. The other sessions listed on Jan's site (in the "tape archive" section) include nine unreleased tracks from the 1990 album rejected by CBS/Sony, four tracks with Louis Perez and David Hidalgo of Los Lobos, and 17 tracks worth of outtakes from JERICHO (including at least two Bruce Hornsby tunes with the songwriter himself on piano).


Posted on Sun Feb 3 03:10:44 CET 2002 from 64-80-55-3-access.surferz.net (64.80.55.3)

Diamond Lil

Just a note to those here in upstate NY. Garth will be playing _tomorrow_ at the Towne Crier in Pawling..2pm. It's a benefit concert for the family of Dave Van Ronk, who's suffering with cancer, to help pay much needed living expenses.
For those of you who are afraid to miss the superbowl, the show will be done in time for you to get home and watch..or stay at the Crier and watch on their wide screen tv.
A link for the Towne Crier is www.townecrier.com/calendar/html. Garth is _not_ listed.. but _will_ be there.. ready to play. Enjoy!


Posted on Sun Feb 3 01:49:23 CET 2002 from spider-tq053.proxy.aol.com (152.163.201.68)

jcf

From: new york
Web page

I saw Levon in Coal Miner's Daughter, again,last night. A great movie with a great lead perfromance... For those reggae fans WKCR is in the midst of a reggae (or is it Bob Marley) marathon. it is boradcast over the www.


Posted on Sun Feb 3 01:20:38 CET 2002 from sdn-ar-001ilurbap308.dialsprint.net (158.252.112.174)

Susan

I swore I would not buy a DVD player until The Last Waltz came on DVD - now I have to make good, but ah, such a pleasure it is. It's going to be a job fitting it into the video setup, though; too many things are chained together already.

I also managed, by way of an extension cord and a cheap boombox, to get music in the kitchen. The first thing I played was Bobby Charles "Wish You Were Here Right Now". This is fine music to cook to, although I should have been making something a little more spicy than tonight's dinner. There's a dog song on this album that I don't think was mentioned in the great dog and cat fest last month. It's called "Peanut", and not only does the dog live, it romps and plays and brings joy unalloyed.


Posted on Sun Feb 3 01:10:18 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ti023.proxy.aol.com (64.12.101.158)

JTull fan

From: Richmond

Bayou Sam: Sorry you haven't gotten an answer either. This makes the question even more intriguing to me. I can't imagine that in '85 The Band found a tune, Country Boy, so good that they just had to run out and record it without having plans to record other songs or an entire album. If they were going to record just a single, it would have been more up tempo and 'hit' like, so there has to be more here. The fact that no one else has any info, after all the picking through we do out here, means there still is a 'holy Grail' of Band stuff to be uncovered! Too cool!


Posted on Sun Feb 3 00:16:07 CET 2002 from 0-1pool72-57.nas22.vienna1.va.us.da.qwest.net (63.159.72.57)

Charlie Young

From: Down in Old Virginny

Levon, Rick, Garth and Gary Brooker of Procol Harum all turn up on that same recent BEST OF RINGO STARR AND HIS ALL-STARR BAND release on DVD (though their performances were several years apart).

I am with Peter as one of those that bought the original single of "Whiter Shade of Pale," but the only other Procol Harum I owned on vinyl were the "Best of..." and the one with the Edmondton Symphony. I liked their other stuff when I heard it on the radio, but found it a lot less varied than The Band's music. It might have been interesting to hear The Band backed by a symphony at some point, but I'm not sure...


Posted on Sat Feb 2 23:55:30 CET 2002 from spider-tm043.proxy.aol.com (152.163.197.63)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

You're right Butch - I called The Turning Point up and they told me that BOTH shows were sold out - and me without reservations - shit. They said I might be able to get standing-room for the second show. I don't know. I might wait 'till next time and RESERVE like I should have done. I'm happy for Levon thought that it's sold out.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 23:54:59 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.99)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

Re: Procol Harum & the Band: I seem to remember reading a review of Big Pink that talked about the Band's versatility, noting that one minute they sounded like Procol Harum and one minute like ? something else. It is a pretty eclectic album.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 22:20:35 CET 2002 from sc-hiltonhead2a-422.hhe.adelphia.net (24.49.233.166)

Amanda

After spending most of the week at the hospital while my son has been recovering from an appendectomy...the Turning Point shows sound like just the medicine I need. I wish I could jump on the next jet out of town, but unfortunately I must remain in Squaresville. I hope everyone has the time of their lives.Boogie down to the blues and dance one for me too...PLEASE!!!


Posted on Sat Feb 2 19:22:59 CET 2002 from spider-tl051.proxy.aol.com (152.163.207.196)

butch

From: bluesville

JUST got the word,,

tonight's Levon & the BarnBurners shows @ the Turning Point,

1st show -------SOLD OUT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2nd show-------------about 10 seats left b-4 another sell-out,,,

so call or take yo chances,,, Joe Mulherin will be surprising Levon & showing up from MEMPHIS to play some trumpet w/the fellas,,,

could be KILLER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

be there or be square,,,, butch


Posted on Sat Feb 2 19:07:22 CET 2002 from spider-wf034.proxy.aol.com (205.188.195.157)

franko

From: newengland
Web page

in the name of rock and roll, good luck to the team with the elvis logo.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 17:51:23 CET 2002 from spider-tp031.proxy.aol.com (152.163.204.186)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

J Tull - let me know if you get any responses to your question about other Country Boy era recordings. I've asked the same thing. That recording is one of my favorite Richard performances. It's recorded well, and captures the deep, soulfulness of Richard's voice. If there could be a whole CD's worth of previously un-released Richard material, I'd buy it in a New York minute - and being Bronx born, I know how fast a N.Y. minute is.

I was looking at TLW DVD page on the Amazon site, and I found two things interesting. The Telecaster logo seems weird. I like that image of the Band with the hands in the air as if acknowledging the audience that was part of the original. What happened to that? I also thought it was funny that they chose the names of Robbie, and Muddy Waters to reel in buyers. I'm surprised Dylan's name didn't appear. After all, it does turn into a Bob Dylan concert at the end.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 17:12:13 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tg041.proxy.aol.com (64.12.102.166)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

WWW.procolharum.com, I believe, is the PH website and it has a wealth of cool info. (fan site). Is Java back? OK, here is something I am really wondering about and maybe someone out here can shed some light for me. What and how many studio sessions were there by The Band in the mid-eighties? What were the circumstances under which Country Boy was made, who played on it and what other songs were possibly done at the time? What is the chance they will see the light of day, officially or unofficially? There seems to be a complete lack of info. surrounding this, or at least I have not stumbled upon it.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 14:18:32 CET 2002 from stargate-46-218.salzburg-online.at (213.153.46.218)

Luke W.

From: Austria

Hank, you're absolutely right. I am 14 (nearly 15) and I've just discovered The Band. However I don't think I know everything. Should I? ;-)

Luke


Posted on Sat Feb 2 13:11:29 CET 2002 from dialup-293.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.37)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

I first heard "Whiter Shade of Pale" in 1977...I was 14...... and immersed in The BTs and Big Pink.....

I really thought it was The Band, I had never heard of Procul Harum......the guy playing drums on that was a session player.....their regular drummer had gone home.....the story goes he got something like £15 for the session, while the single sold millions worldwide.........

I saw Gary Brooker play it live in Cork City Hall in 1979. Brooker was in Eric Claptons band at the time.......Clapton played a hot solo during the song.........

By THAT time, I knew who Procul Harum were, of course, and had seen TLW and was 16, you see........you learn an awful lot between 14 and 16....so much so that, in fact, when yer 16 you really DO know everything and life is just a process of forgetting everything after yer 16....if you can manage it.....know what I mean?.....I mean, I can garuntee ya that there are 14-16 year olds out there right now who've just dicovered The Band......and I'll bet'cha they are walking around right now thinking they know EVERYTHING while all their buddies are going deaf listening to Deep Purple......uh....I mean, Limp Bizcit.....


Posted on Sat Feb 2 07:03:43 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tb064.proxy.aol.com (64.12.104.49)

Donna

From: PA

Bayou Sam: I know you will enjoy seeing Levon & The BarnBurners with Jimmy Vivino, tomorrow night! Unfortunately, I am unable to make this show. Please post and tell us about it!

Jessica: I hope you received some replies to your question! Good luck in your search! :)

i am the worst fuck ever. kat lehria would never ever ditch PAK to be with me. i suck a big fat cock (which i love to do BTW) peace

-->


Posted on Sat Feb 2 04:36:30 CET 2002 from hse-mtl-ppp70917.qc.sympatico.ca (64.229.194.250)

brown eyed girl

From: cabbagetown

Norbert: Well.....at least your post didn't make me want to listen to "Whipping Post" once again!!

Mingus: :-D



Posted on Sat Feb 2 04:31:15 CET 2002 from 209-239-207-152.oak.jps.net (209.239.207.152)

Phil

From: Ca

Here's an interesting quote on the Paul Williams notes to Shine On Brightly by Keith Reid. Also note that along with dual keyboards, they could have shared managers.

"I think we were probably one of the first groups to hear the Band," says Reid, "because at one stage there was a possibility of Albert Grossman managing us when we started touring in America. We went up to his office and he told us about this new group called The Crackers, which is what the Band called themselves at the time. He played us a tape of their album, and that was after 'Shine On Brightly'.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 03:34:30 CET 2002 from cw05.m1.srv.t-online.de (212.185.252.197)

Mingus

From: The Vineyard

Sip the line "I want to lay down beside you".

A friend sent me today a Cd-R of Tracy Nelson`s Mother Earth album and immeadiately I got into fantasies how fantastic it would have been in cooperation with The Band. It`s the same time (1972).

Still imagining that, there came a song that made me think of Rick Danko singing it "I want to lay down beside you" and quickly I realized that this was "Sip the wine". The original version from the Mother Earth album is credited to Tim Drummond, who is also the bass player on "Brainwash" and "Java Blues" on Rick`s first solo-album. So of course we have some problems with the credits here as "Sip the wine" is credited to Rick Danko.

Would be interesting to find out more about the deal between Drummond and Danko. Anyway I always loved Rick`s version of the song, but I was completely shaken by the beauty of Tracy Nelson`s interpretation. Everybody who likes the song by Rick Danko should try to listen to that earlier version too. There is also a version of Jesse Winchester`s "Tennessee Waltz" on it.

This information is not new as i found through my research that it was noted on this site (see the footnote to the lyrics of "Sip the wine), but I want recommand this version to all of you who like the song and I want this case to be taken into account when the subject comes up again that Robbie takes credits he does not deserve.

Please listen to this album, no matter what the credits are, inspired music is the greatest thing on earth.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 03:02:22 CET 2002 from apx1-05-150.pdx.du.teleport.com (216.26.3.150)

Ken Brummel-Smith

From: Portland

Are there any plans for a DVD of The Last Waltz? It'd be great if they added all th songs that were done instead of just what's on the VHS tape.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 02:18:36 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ta071.proxy.aol.com (64.12.105.51)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

Nice post Hank - it brings one back to what it's all about.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 02:09:50 CET 2002 from cc5414-a.hnglo1.ov.nl.home.com (212.120.101.7)

norbert

From: knocking a van nordic on heavens door.

Brown Eyed Girl; ...... which 5 songs should be on a ......"THE BEST OF THE BAND" cd? ......


Posted on Sat Feb 2 02:05:02 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tg023.proxy.aol.com (64.12.102.158)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

If there was a Band influence on Procol Harum it can be found on the Salty Dog album rather than on Shine On Brightly. If the Band was influenced by anyone contemporary, I would say NLSC has a very Steely Danesque musical feel. The Pretzel Logic title track would fit right on it. The Steely Dan version of East St. Louis Toodle Doo could replace Third Man Theme on Moondog without any disconcerting effect.


Posted on Sat Feb 2 01:00:02 CET 2002 from dialin-665-tnt.nyc.bestweb.net (216.179.3.157)

Bill S.

From: Colds Spring N. Y.

Its a Levon Helm weekend here in the N.Y. area. Tonight Fri. 8:00 on T.B.S. Cold Miners Daughter. Sat. at the Turning Point The Barn Burners! Sit back and enjoy the show!


Posted on Sat Feb 2 00:33:20 CET 2002 from dialup-63.215.114.216.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (63.215.114.216)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Again, what is interesting about PH and the Band is that their antecedents--The Paramounts and The Hawks--had similiar set lists. I suppose you could argue that each group came into its own when it embraced something new; in the Paramounts' case, the surreal lyrics of Keith Reid and the evocative organ work of Matthew Fisher (which btw wasn't entirely classically based); and in the Hawks' case, Bob Dylan. Not bad company.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 23:54:03 CET 2002 from du-tele3-122.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.122)

Peter Viney

Neatly put, David. I prefer Little Milton myself!


Posted on Fri Feb 1 23:03:35 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Something in Peter's last post reminded me of a major difference in essence between The Band and Procol Harum. The music of The Band was decidedly North American in its roots, whereas, Procol Harum's reflected a strong English/European influence. While Procol Harum read John Milton, The Band listened to Little Milton.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 21:55:38 CET 2002 from du-tele3-143.mailbox.co.uk (195.82.121.143)

Peter Viney

While there are clear similarities in sound, I'd bet anything that there is no "cross-influence" in either direction between the first Procul Harum album and Big Pink. Separate development. Robbie was somewhat harsh on 'Whiter Shade of Pale'though - wasn't there a DJ's poll a few years back that voted it best single of all time? I guess you can't beat a bit of Bach mixed with Percy Sledge with a bit of transposed Milton in the lyrics! I bought it the week it came out. I can see that Deram label now! It still sums up the era better than almost any other record.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 20:29:05 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

Pat's right on the money about the "Shine On Brightly" liner notes. My point, however, was that Paul Williams heard a similiarity in the sound of the two bands. Mr. Williams, as editor of "Crawdaddy", was (and still is) considered, in some circles, as an influential observer of the rock music scene.

Surely, the similiarity he heard was the organ/piano sound, in addition to one tasteful guitarist with excellent drummer in each band. Robertson, as a lead guitarist who then followed the less-is-more credo, was not as demonstrative as Robin Trower. Although Gary Brooker was a soulful singer, the other members of Procol Harum were never that strong as singers. Last, but not least, no one could ever mistake Robertson's lyrics with those of Keith Reid, with the exception perhaps of "Chest Fever" (:-)

In his 1969 interview in Rolling Stone, Robertson admitted that "Whiter Shade of Pale" was the only thing by Procol Harum that he was then familiar with. His biting put-down, accusing that song of being nothing more than a repetitive imitation of Percy Sledge's "When A Man Loves A Women", probably still stings Reid, Brooker, et al. to this day.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 20:03:54 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tk021.proxy.aol.com (64.12.107.26)

Ben Pike

From: Cleveland Tx

Pat, since you know I have always supported the considerable liberties Robertson took with the BTs(alltought we need an expanded version here too), you know I have no problem with TLW. As Greil Marcus reviewed it at the time, the Music on the soundtrack of the film is great, while the mix on the album is flat. So if they do a great job on the new CD, that could be the real revalation.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 19:49:24 CET 2002 from spider-wm021.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.156)

Bill Hilser

From: Baja Arizona

Damn if I don't cry real tears every Thanksgiving when I play my vidiotape of "The Last Waltz!" Been doing this for 12 years now and I hope it will never stop. They were a special group, never to be duplicated. After the Band, I saw Rick at the Golden Bear in Huntington Beach, CA., and Levon at Juanita's in Little Rock.Let Rock & Roll never die! Yer pal, Ferrari Willi


Posted on Fri Feb 1 19:13:07 CET 2002 from cranberry.cache.fi.jippii.net (195.197.160.12)

Kalervo

From: Finland
Web page

Thank you guys for reacting to my Van Dyke Parks praise...Ben - what a memorable meeting! I can' t anybody who is more versatile artist ...maybe Caetano Veloso is close..Please look the fine web site made by a german guy called Jan Jansen

I always thought that Procol Harum was spiritually close to the Band, like our own Wigwam....


Posted on Fri Feb 1 18:49:40 CET 2002 from ns1.prenhall.com (198.4.159.5)

Ray

From: Rockland County, NY

I was wondering if anyone knows where I can find any live recordings of The Hawks and any other obscure Band recordings or memorabiala. I live in Rockland County New York and can't find anything to speak of. I would appreciate any suggestions. Thanks from Ray


Posted on Fri Feb 1 18:22:19 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa

From: NY,NY

Can anyone put me in touch with Across the Great Divide. I have searched high and low for it, vintage cd stores and such. My set was stolen in college. It would be helpful.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 18:16:23 CET 2002 from (199.79.168.252)

Theresa Cassiack

From: New York, NY

Does anyone know if Levon will be playing in Woodstock or NYC anytime soon?? I ahve been searching high and low to see him perform. Also, Garth Hudson will be appearing at the Bottom Line on February 22 in NYC...a tribute to The Band and the Rock of Ages. I will be buying tickets soon, so let me know if you need any.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 17:54:56 CET 2002 from jed22.revealed.net (208.23.178.117)

Mike

From: Strawberry Flats
Web page

I'm going thru posts and listening to Billy Joel's "The Stranger". After hearing the accordian solo on "Vienna", I can't help feel that it sounds so much like Garth's playing on "When I Paint My Masterpiece". It has a european flavor to it. Perhaps it SHOULD have been Garth playing?!

Pat, I agree that The Last Waltz would need a little primping. But The Band on a bad or uneven night were better than bigger bands on their best nights. Ok, so my favorite singer's voice (Richard) wasn't in top form. That can be heard on TCLW, but he still gives his all. Enough for now.

Mike


Posted on Fri Feb 1 17:36:00 CET 2002 from dialup-63.215.114.65.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (63.215.114.65)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Those Procol Harum liner notes were done without their approval (rather typical of record companies) and the group publicly dissociated themselves from them. It wouldn't surprise me if RR was in fact reacting to the liner notes' unsubstantiated claim of influence when he reacted so negatively to PH. I for one think its pretty obvious that the insularity of Woodstock helped the boys find their voice; I doubt they even heard PH's first album.

Ben, even a casual listen to the CLW would detects a need for, shall we say, primping. However, that knowledge has never served to dampen the great joy I experience every time I see The Movie. And, if Hank were here, I'd pat him on the back.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 17:23:06 CET 2002 from (208.218.212.2)

David Powell

From: Georgia

From Paul Williams' original liner notes for Procol Harum's "Shine On Brightly":

"...This is a wonderful record, kind of a letter from a friend I guess, or an expression of an eight-month moment. I like it at the end, when Robbie simply says what he has to say, and it was so utterly relieving to hear him say it again. I like it at the beginning, when that familiar organ rolls/fades in and Keith/Gary starts by apologising. I like especially "My Moonbeams" and "Shine On Brightly", which already run through my mind, and I like especially the whole show, as a whole show. Have you noticed how much the first Procol album (which was so influenced by "Blonde On Blonde") influenced "Music From Big Pink"?..."

Jenny: "Road Away" was included on John Stewart's "Canons In The Rain".


Posted on Fri Feb 1 16:56:51 CET 2002 from (216.5.93.117)

Jenny T

From: Ohio

Re: Lonesome Picker: I can't remember which songs were on which albums, but I looked up Lonesome Picker--that was a really good one. Touch of the Sun always comes to mind when it rains a lot, even though I like dreary weather. Swift Lizard and Wolves in the Kitchen rocked pretty well if I recall, and I like the theme of Little Road and a Stone to Roll--everybody needs a stone to roll. I remember John's version of Daydream Believer was very different from the Monkees--with "old closet queen" in one chorus instead of homecoming queen and "funky" instead of "happy." We used to pass by Wild Horse Road on vacation--it's probably now Wild Horse Road Estates.

One song I loved as a kid was Road Away, about a boy finding his own way in the world and not letting anyone else make it easier for him, not even Lupe Jones at San Luis Rey who owned a Ford and served the Lord and rang the mission bell. Can't remember the album.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 14:17:22 CET 2002 from dialup-283.cork.iol.ie (193.203.148.27)

Hank

From: Cork
Web page

I dunno......I just remember being 16 in 1979 when TLW made it the cinema to Mallow, Co. Cork and going to see it with my old man and meeting all the heads in Mallow at this dingy old cinema with dodgy sound and being completely entranced by the magic of the thing....you grow older, you lose your innocence and gain experience and magic becomes calculated overdubs and editing..........Sigh.........

Aw, what the heck......I'm looking forward to The DVD anyway!........if only for the fun we'll have in here......


Posted on Fri Feb 1 10:55:12 CET 2002 from harpo.christianacare.org (167.112.160.7)

Paul DiGuglielmo

From: Newark, Delaware

I've been a big fan of the Band since I first heard Up On Crippled Creek. Still my favorite song by the Band. I purchased all of the reissues, and I was wondering whether there has been any comments from Robbie on this box set he was working on. We've already had Across The Great Divide, and all of the reissues with the bonus tracks. I was wondering what Robbie planned on including on this box set, which he said he wanted to be the definitive story of the Band, that hasen't already been released on the reissues. Also, any proposed track listing for the 4 cd box set of The Last Waltz?


Posted on Fri Feb 1 07:13:42 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-004neomahp1585.dialsprint.net (63.186.38.61)

Dave Z

From: Chaska, MN

Nice pics Joe and Alex... Zoos are fun places too... I always like the polar bear who swims and kicks off the glass wall in St. Paul's Como Zoo... I can watch it for hours... My advice to the guy who asked about whether somebody would be disappointed at a BB show by not hearing Levon sing... is... just go... you won't be disappointed at all... same goes for Garth... but he sings now... he only mumbled when I saw him... yeah, mumbling and slapping skins makes for good times... today on my "get-lost" drive I was just listening to the specific organ sounds in ROA... And I did get lost which helps...


Posted on Fri Feb 1 05:49:17 CET 2002 from spider-we064.proxy.aol.com (205.188.195.49)

Bayou Sam

From: ny

If I remember Levon's book correctly, he was the only one who did not participate in overdubbing on TLW.

Hey - speaking of Levon - I'm going to try to make the show at The Turning point on Sat. Anyone else out there going? Let me know please. I'd love to say "hi".


Posted on Fri Feb 1 05:50:25 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-ti064.proxy.aol.com (64.12.101.179)

Ben Pike

From: Cleveland TX

Pat, I thought what you were saying was that diferent players dubbed stuff in for Robbie and Levon, but that wasn't it, right? It would be cool if there were some new songs on the DVD, allthough some reports say Richard was just not at the top of his game that night anyway... do the CLW reflect this? And I think you are all just jelous of me hanging out with VDP and thats why you didn't say anything.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 04:35:49 CET 2002 from dialup-65.56.138.205.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.56.138.205)

Jeb Stuart

From: VA

There's only been one released version of the Last Waltz. And if you can't enjoy the possibilities of a DVD release and all that that entails, then why be here?


Posted on Fri Feb 1 04:17:16 CET 2002 from sdn-ap-002castocp1781.dialsprint.net (63.187.15.3)

rollie

Well folks, it looks like our internet freedom is about to come under attack as well. Please check out this link and see how you can become involved.http://www.democraticmedia.org/getinvolved/index.html


Posted on Fri Feb 1 04:04:55 CET 2002 from dialup-65.56.138.205.dial1.chicago1.level3.net (65.56.138.205)

Pat Brennan

From: USA

Ben, I was referring to the original 1977 sessions wherein many a flubbed note and shaky harmony was corrected. A comparison between the CLW and the album/movie showed that both RR and Levon did little overdubbing. Regarding Garth's sax solo (and if memory serve me well, RR's solo) at the end of IMND, I think both were truncated for the movie which made them (at least Garth's) appear to be overdubbed. It's been a while since I revisited those comparisons.

Technology today can pretty easily remove hums and buzzes--a Digidesign ProTools plugin called DINR (Digital intelligent noise reduction) actually analyzes the audio and pinpoints the offending noise frequencies. However, it does color the remaining audio to varying degrees. There is definitely an art to the application of this, errr, application.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 03:38:25 CET 2002 from spider-wl073.proxy.aol.com (205.188.199.53)

butch

From: land of the Blues,,,

OK, AS ADVERTISED !!!! FINAL ANNOUNCEMENT - LAST CALL

This Saturday, Feb 2nd,,,,,,,

Piermont NY,,,,,just over the Tappan Zee Bridge

Tha Turning Point

LEVON HELM & THE BARNBURNERS

w/ Jimmy Vivino on piano & guitar

two shows, 8 & 1030

gonna be huge FUN !!!!!!!!!! cmon out,,,,,,,


Posted on Fri Feb 1 03:04:45 CET 2002 from a010-0309.burk.splitrock.net (63.255.172.55)

Tim(SUNDOG)Corcoran

From: Madison,Wi.
Web page

Hey now folks, please join us with your friend and ours, Vince Welnick (of The Grateful Dead),Toni Brown, Professor "Louie" & The Crowmatix w/Michael Falzarano of "Hot Tuna", and Mississippi Cactus at the ~Sundog Summer Shakedown~ with 17 other JAM'N bands! We are very pleased and grateful to welcome Vince Welnick and you to this Grateful Dead oriented grass roots event, brought to you by Deadheads, for Deadheads, and Tie-Dyed Psychedelic Kind Folks. This camping event located at the wonderful ~Hoppe Homestead Farm Campground~ is a celebration for all of you Tie-Dyed Psychedelic Kind Folks and fun lovin' Deadhead friends. This event will be almost as "magical" as a Grateful Dead show use to be, with three daze & nights of camping with campfires, drum circles, grate food, vendors. Plus, all the music jams ROCK!!! For the past five years the Tim's Sundog Television show has aired some of the best jambands that the midwest has to offer,and national acts such as Vince Welnick, Merl Saunders, David Gans, and Justin Kreutzmann, Michael Falzarano of "Hot Tuna" w/ Prof. "Louie" & The Crowmatix. This will be a blast! We also worked to bring you the "Zappening 2000", which was a celebration of the music of Frank Zappa by some of the original members of his original members of his band.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 02:44:39 CET 2002 from spider-wj051.proxy.aol.com (205.188.198.41)

JTull Fan

From: Richmond

Jessica: As someone who majored in Southern History I will be happy to help you out as best I can in that regards. OOOOHHH! Someone mentioned Procol Harum's Shine On Brightly! Great, great song. Best keyboards this side of Garth thanks to the brilliant Mathew Fisher. Regarding the rereleased Last Waltz: The way I see it, Levon, Rick, Garth, and Richard were the best cover band/bcking band EVER!, from Ronnie Hawkins to Dylan to RR. Yes, it makes an interesting perspective to view Robbie not quite as one of the Band, but rather more in line with R. Hawkins and Dylan. True, the Band even without Robbie were more than just a cover Band, but they brought a transcendental quality to any song they played on. None of Robbie's solo work attains the plateus his work reached with the other 4. Perhaps, rather than the Last Waltz being viewed as a definitive biography it should be classified as a chapter in what should really be given a Ken Burns treatment; the Hawkins phase, the Hawks, the Dylan phase, Big Pink, basement and Brown Album period, the laster works by the original 5 through 'Robbie's Last Waltz', Reunion, Re-reunion, The Final THree Albums, and to today. Now THAT is the story that needs telling.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 02:09:48 CET 2002 from modem-200-18-60-62.vip.uk.com (62.60.18.200)

union man

Not too long ago I signed the guestbook and got off me chest my feelings about " It Makes No Difference". It took a while before I actually heard the song and when I did, I was disappointed. But now, I'm going through the same mill and might as well be singing it myself. I'm not the sort that mopes about, waiting for song lyrics to perfectly sum up my every twist and downturn, but in this case I have to make an exception. Marital breakdown gives a feller a whole new perspective. That'll teach me to be a smart-arse.


Posted on Fri Feb 1 01:49:50 CET 2002 from (151.200.135.241)

le

From: the highway of life!

Hey Robbie! Wouldn't it be great to hear some incredible new music that reflects the best fo what is happening now--the best tribute to America and patriotism...I would love to hear some new stuff that might reflect some of the best of your old stuff when America held some innocence and hope and prosperity in spirit and more for all? Rob-please--your music and lyrical content are important. I would think that this would be a great opportunity in a GOOD way to "shine on brightly" as Procal Harum sang... Greetings from an eastcoast pal....rawwaw


Posted on Fri Feb 1 01:47:45 CET 2002 from dialup-67.25.135.20.dial1.buffalo1.level3.net (67.25.135.20)

G-MAN

I see that the umpteenth version of TLW is out there!!!!!! Well,,,,,John Cass posted awhile back about seeing a Levon show!!! Well,,,it won't be THE BAND, but it will be tuff blues played by some great musicians!!! Levon,,Pat O'Shea, Chris O'Leary,,and Mr. Sorley---if U can't enjoy that,,,,, well maybe some wonderful Olympic music will do the trick; "Comming To America", by Neal Diamond!!!! Also,,Jim Weider and Rando are out there with the Gurus, and just released a new Cd!!! Be nice if some current stuff got some support!!! I don't know if terrorist threats or the original music production will keep me from missing this years Olympics!!! NEal Diamond???? Real deep and kewl,,,!!


Posted on Fri Feb 1 01:27:59 CET 2002 from spider-mtc-tk061.proxy.aol.com (64.12.107.46)

h evans

From: alabama

Had to chime in on the John Stewart thread. "The Lonesome Picker Rides Again" is one of my all time favorite albums. Musically and lyrically I think it is superb. Also liked "Bombs Away Dream Babies" and "Dream Babies go Hollywood", but they aren't in the same league as "Lonesome Picker".


Posted on Fri Feb 1 00:40:09 CET 2002 from dorms-034-232.bates.edu (134.181.34.232)

John

From: Maine

Im glad to say that there is a showing of interest in The Band as evidenced by amazon.com listing The Last Waltz DVD as its #1 best seller...$18.73 I must say is a bargain considering I paid nearly $30 for my used VHS copy...Lets only hope that Rick and Richard's estates and Levon and Garth see their fair share of the profits...May 7th couldnt come sooner.


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